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Me again! After another session of Deathwatch, I feel like I'm getting a better handle of the rules, thought I still have some questions I hope you guys can answer for me:

1) Lets say we have just started a combat action and I am the squad leader of my team. We have a 10 cohesion points at the start of the fight and I rolled highest for initiative. Now, lets say I use my turn to call my squad mates into Squad Mode and they all use their Reactions to make and automatically successful Cohesion Test to enter Squad Mode (they can't roll lower than a 10 on 1d10, so they all auto pass).

Everyone then spends the fight in Squad Mode until the xenos are all dead. Now that the fight is over, do we automatically exit Squad Mode? Or can we choose to stay in Squad Mode as long as we want and are within Support Range?

2) Why are Black Templars so... sub-par? I mean, they can't use the Beltcher's Gland (spit acid) or sus-anne membrane (enter suspended animation to negate the effects of life-threatening wounds), they can't be Apothecaries or Librarians and they HAVE to hate any pyskers in the party. Then, to make things worse, if they get enough insanity points, there will be a significant chance that they will KILL friendly pyskers at the drop of a hat.

The Blood Angels really seem like they are the same as Black Templars minus all the bad stuff. They both make good melee combatants and are best suited to the Assault Marine class. The Blood Angles, however, have more options, can use the Beltcher's Gland and sus-anne membrane and the Primarch's Curse of the Blood Angles is arguably less punishing than the Black Templars. While the BA's curse pretty much manifests abstractly and shouldn't be too much trouble if you are an Assault Marine (or other close quarters related class) then it doesn't seem like it should ever be a problem. The BT's curse, however, manifests and specific detriments and can potentially come at odds with someone who wants to be a Librarian or when you need to keep a pysker alive.

To be fair, the BT's chapter power does grant some pretty good bonuses against demons and the BA's curse puts him at risk of killing surrendering enemies, but the BA's power is more widely useful and over all I just don't see any reason to run a BT over a BA.

Can anyone point out some good reasons to use a Black Templar? Am I missing something?

Loki77515 wrote:Me again!

Not again!

Loki77515 wrote:1) Lets say we have just started a combat action and I am the squad leader of my team. We have a 10 cohesion points at the start of the fight and I rolled highest for initiative. Now, lets say I use my turn to call my squad mates into Squad Mode and they all use their Reactions to make and automatically successful Cohesion Test to enter Squad Mode (they can't roll lower than a 10 on 1d10, so they all auto pass).

Everyone then spends the fight in Squad Mode until the xenos are all dead. Now that the fight is over, do we automatically exit Squad Mode? Or can we choose to stay in Squad Mode as long as we want and are within Support Range?

I'd have to say that as long as you remained within support range squad mode would continue.

Loki77515 wrote:2) Why are Black Templars so... sub-par? I mean, they can't use the Beltcher's Gland (spit acid) or sus-anne membrane (enter suspended animation to negate the effects of life-threatening wounds), they can't be Apothecaries or Librarians and they HAVE to hate any pyskers in the party. Then, to make things worse, if they get enough insanity points, there will be a significant chance that they will KILL friendly pyskers at the drop of a hat.

The Beltcher's Gland and Sus-ann Membrane are hardly important parts of the game. They can be Apothecaries. They cannot be Devastators. They're better or worse off than any other type of Marine. They make good assaulters.

Loki77515 wrote:Can anyone point out some good reasons to use a Black Templar? Am I missing something?

The game isn't just about combat. Some people like the Black Templars.

The game isn't just about combat. Some people like the Black Templars.

Of course people can play the chapter if they like it, but I think its weird that they are EXPLICITLY worse off then the other chapters. Nobody else has the kind of restrictions these guys have and while they may not be deal-breakers depending on what kind of marine you want to play, I just find it odd that they got picked on more-so than the others.

I'd have to say that as long as you remained within support range squad mode would continue.

This is what my gaming group decided, too. Since we couldn't find a rule that explicitly said otherwise.

Thanks for the reply.

The Black Templars are generally for a player that wants to role-play a character versus bieng a totally involved "combat junkie". ( Term comes from my group that plays vampire and whatnot ) The PC itself best serves as a foil for a friendly psyker that way when and if your libratian decides to go all power hungry you have a player that tries to keep him in line.

Spitting acid does not work so well when I am running the game as most of the players wear their helmet, and I do not let my players have both.

And it is not only in this game that a Black Templar cannot be a Librarian or a Devastator IIRC.

And it is the Space Wolves that cannot be an apothecary.

You don't like BA??

This is a ROLE playing game.....not a ROLL playing game. So many people get the 2 confused.

You mean BT, but yes, it is about playing a character not about midless killing.

How.............dare you!
The power of our Chapter is not in the ability to spit the eyes out of Guardsmen(Someones going to try that now ) but in the power of our Righteous Fury!(See what I did there?)


No seriously though us Templars are actually really really powerful in Deathwatch. Free action become immune to Psychic powers? ZING!

And honestly, if some filthy player tried using a power beside a Templar....Well you can't really blame the Surprise Attack+Point Blank+HeadShot= Plasma Pistol needs to not Overheat to hit Psyker Marine Joe, oh and Joe remember you already used your reaction for the round. Hehe...look, Righteous Fury.....BangBangBang. I doubt that Joe is going to play as a Psyker again.

The person playing the libby is creative and can find ways to make his character OTT if not kept in check, and a BT NPC does that perfectly, only issue that I have with the game is that the Ultramarine PC in the party is a whiny little nuisance who wants to carry the entire armoury of the deathwatch with him. In other words, the power of a chacracter is only limited to the creativity of the player, think outside the box, yet within the rules and you can have a overly powered character that is completely within the rules.

I nearly set the BT in our group on fire using Avenger. He was not happy with me, but as we had formed the 'Bad Cop' portion of our little team, he let it go by. I've been careful not to make things explode near him since then though.

btemple0 wrote:The Black Templars are generally for a player that wants to role-play a character versus bieng a totally involved "combat junkie".

Black Templars are pretty much the definition of combat junkies. Their reaction to nearly everything can be easily predicted, since it will likely be to kill it. I do agree that the inter-squad relationships can lead to some interesting conflicts if a psyker is present but if players are actually behaving like Astartes there will always be conflict regardless of which Chapters are mixed together. They are all inflexible, psyho-indoctrinated, living weapons who believe their Chapter superior to any other and therein will always exist friction.

Gridge wrote:

btemple0 wrote:The Black Templars are generally for a player that wants to role-play a character versus bieng a totally involved "combat junkie".

Black Templars are pretty much the definition of combat junkies. Their reaction to nearly everything can be easily predicted, since it will likely be to kill it. I do agree that the inter-squad relationships can lead to some interesting conflicts if a psyker is present but if players are actually behaving like Astartes there will always be conflict regardless of which Chapters are mixed together. They are all inflexible, psyho-indoctrinated, living weapons who believe their Chapter superior to any other and therein will always exist friction.

That can also be said, but then again, that is the way that every military organization is in the real world.... "My branch is better than yours" "my battalion/battery/platoon is the best"