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Heya
I have a quick question about WYSIWYG (you spell it like that right?).
I want to use a couple of soldiers in my IG army who don't really represent who they are, do you personally think this would be aloud at tournaments?
1. First of all I run a standardbearer (the guy with the flag who came with the old command squad box) as a normal guy in my CCS since I love the model. Would you accept this guy as a normal soldier if I told you at a tournament or game?
2. Then my Astropath is a communications soldier with vox thingy on his back. Other than that he only carries a lasgun, you think this still works?
3. And finally, I have a model of a sergeant with a Boltgun (with an attached chainsword on the front ) and an actual sword on his back, running as a sergeant with a power weapon. Same question here.

It would be very motivational to know that I could use these guys since I really like the models and I am a slow painter, but can't really fit the models into my army otherwise.
thanks
FFE

Caveat: None of this is "enforceable". A TO can decide ANYTHING they like.

1) As long as you dont have any actual banners in your army, then that would normally be ok - just keep reminding your opponent!

2) As long as you have no Vox's in your units, that again should not be too confusing

3) Again: are ALL your sarge's armed with Powerswords? Is the sword ornate than a "normal" sword?

1) Flag guy is okay as long as there are no banners.

2) Astropaths should have a pistol and CCW so his weapons are wrong as well as looking like a vox trooper. This guy looks and is equipped exactly like a vox trooper - this one isn't great. Are you going to remember that he only has a pistol when he's holding a rifle?

3) Boltguns aren't a valid option for sergeants anymore - are you equipping him with a bolt pistol? That would be okay. The power sword on his back is fine as long as it's clear that it's a power sword, not a CCW. (e.g. if all the CCWs are chainswords)

Remember the it's entirely up to the TO, personally I wouldn't be happy with 2) but the others might be okay in the context of your army.

You might want to consider making three extra guys (or at least the astropath) if you're planning to play in tournaments and keep these three for friendly games.

Hey
thanks for the answers. I don't have any other banners in my army, so 1) should be fine.

The astropath indeed seems to be a problem, I somehow assumed the astropath just walks a long but doesn't have any weapons, don't know where I got that from.
But making a astropath model shouldn't be very hard, this can be done quickly and the com model loses his backpack and goes witht the standard infantry.

Well the sergeant is kinda difficult. I can post I picutre of him when I get the time. The sword on his back is quite fancy, but it doesn't glow like an actual power sword. He isn't equiped with a boltpistol either, just laspistol and power weapon (as are all my other sergeants, exept some also have melta bombs). Thing is this model has absolutely no use for any thing one could use, so I'm hoping I can run it as a sergeant with power weapon.
The decission of course depends on the TO and / or other players but having a general opinion could always help.

Edit: I found a pic.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/124444-IG.html
The guy on the right is the sergeant. One can only see the handle of the sword on his back...4
The guy on the left is the banner carrier. To my defense, all of my soldiers have been "updated" (painted them some more, a little better) so they do look a little better now

Sgt should be fine(one would certainly turn of the power swords power field before sheathing it/placing it into a back hanger)

As said with no actual banners I doubt the Banner will be a real issue(at the very least your soon to be vox-less former-astropath could be a good replacement stand-by model).

The astropath would need re-done for obvious various reasons stated above.

Only one I'd really 'insist' on changing would be the astropath.

So long as you tell your opponent, everything but the astropath is fine. You should really just kitbash a custom model for him instead of using a vox man.

Fire_for_effect wrote:Well the sergeant is kinda difficult. I can post I picutre of him when I get the time. The sword on his back is quite fancy, but it doesn't glow like an actual power sword. He isn't equiped with a boltpistol either, just laspistol and power weapon (as are all my other sergeants, exept some also have melta bombs). Thing is this model has absolutely no use for any thing one could use, so I'm hoping I can run it as a sergeant with power weapon.
The decission of course depends on the TO and / or other players but having a general opinion could always help.

Take him as bolt pistol and power weapon and he's just about okay. (sergeant's used to be able to get boltguns...)

Cool cool
thanks for all the responses. Making an astropath shouldn't be to hard. I still got a Valk door gunner left, with some greenstuff, he should do just fine. Glad the other two are fine
Now that I'm at it I might just as well ask.
1) For those who know the Kasrkin sergeant with the sword. What should I do with that model? No way I give my vet squad a power weapon^^ maybe just use him as a normal sergeant and replace him with a greenstuffed melta guy?
2) My Iron Hand Straken has all the wargear exept that his robotic arm is the space wolf terminator axe (which would suit his S6) that should be allright, right? :p

Just on a side note, one has to love the new plastic kits. All the old metal models that don't really find any use are making me sad...

lg
FFE

1) I'd keep him for a stormie squad (unless you've got a carapace vet squad). Swapping the power sword for a chainsword is a fairly easy conversion.

2) Sounds okay - as long as he's got a shotgun, a CCW and robot arm you're good to go.

I'm personally not a fan of using the standard model without paying for the standard, either. Having one can be a big deal, and I would prefer not to have to keep reminding myself during the game that it doesn't "exist."

I have another question about WYSIWYG...my CSM army has Havocs that are equipped with Necron guns to represent lascannons...I just thought it was cooler at the time I modeled them. Now since I don't have any other lascannons in the army, would this be allowed?

Also, I have two scrap-built dreadnoughts that are made from GW parts, but don't necessarily look like GW dreads, but they are the right size, and mounted on the right base...they are armed with the correct GW weapon models that they are equipped with, and have the correct number of bolters and a large weapon on each to represent a dreadnought CC weapon. Would these be allowed either?

Both of those sound like they're probably fine. Pictures might help, but it does come down to the judgment of the person you're playing with or the organizer of the tournament if you're in one of those.

My three rules of thumb for counts-as are Clear, Consistent, and Cool.

Clear: The unit/weapon should be easily recognizable as what it's representing, and not easily confused with another item from the codex.

If you are making a killer clown army, and rubber chickens = power weapons, I should be able to easily see and recognize the rubber chickens in your army. As another example, it's generally a bad idea to represent a unit with the "Bikes" rule using models which have a guy on top of the living thing. This is because Cavalry has its own different and distinct rules, and using one for the other is likely to cause confusion.

Consistent: The given unit/weapon should be represented the same way throughout the army.

If you are making a killer clown army and rubber chicken = power weapon, then ALL power weapons in the army should be rubber chickens. There shouldn't be any which are represented by banana cream pies, or by regular power weapons, for that matter.

Cool: The cooler-looking something is, the more open and flexible your opponents will be. If they love how it looks, they are less likely to care if it doesn't look how it's supposed to.

Since these things you want to use already have meanings in the codex, I would not use them to represent other things.

Why not just shell out the 20 points to take the standard, vox, and bolter?

These things just don't make sense... I could see being okay with it if the "cool stuff" didn't actually have rules, but standards have rules, voxes have rules, and bolters have rules.

Yeah I though about just buing the stuff, but it really isn't worth the points. Wasting points that I want to spend on meltabombs or the like on a standard when most of my squads have a commissar anyway isn't really nice :/ In the end, I'll just try to replace the models when I get enough soldiers. Until then I just keep them as they are (even though I already replaced the astropath :p)

thx
FFE

If you're buying the commissars for stubborn, it's being "penny wise, pound foolish" (IMO) to NOT spring for the standard. Stubborn on Ld9 is a 1/6 chance to fail. Stubborn on Ld9 WITH A RE-ROLL is a 1/36 chance to fail. Why mess around if you're already investing the points for the commissars?

Because why waste the Points/ additional weapon option from the Standard when the Commissar already provides the Stubborn, Ld9 with a re-roll.

Also Summary execution takes precedence over the Standard, the killing simply happens upon a failed test, and the squad MUST then re-roll.

But at least that only applies to morale tests; the reg. Std. lets you re-roll pinning tests.

guard is actually easy to WYSIWYG, since all GI have interchangeable parts between kits, custom models are a snap. the only propblem i would have is the astropath, if you had a model with LP and a vox i would assume he was a MoO, astropaths are psykers, so a feeble looking model would work better. banners are fine, my friend actually just runs the model around for looks and ingame whenever he becomes a problem, we just move him out of the way, acting as if he is invisible to everyone and just there to look cool.

ph34r wrote:Why not just shell out the 20 points to take the standard, vox, and bolter?

Standard does nothing if you have a comissar, bolters are't options for PIS sergeants.

As for WYSIWYG the models wouldn't exactly need to be the exact models, but it should be clear which model is which. Make them special. (I still lol everytime I see my friends biker painboy who has a handsaw for his doks tools... works for orks )