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So I'm about 3 quarters of the way through this book and can honestly say it's been a pretty good read throughout. I've liked the depiction of the Space Wolves through out and the character of Hawser is interesting. I do have some questions and would like your opinions and take on things. I have had a flick through all the way as well, i'm a bad boy

1. At Nikea in A Thousand Sons Fulgrim and Sanguinius appear to be on Magnus side and for standing by him. I knew something was wrong by the description of Fulgrims expression before the Emperor delivers his decree. Do you thing Amon's interpretation of Magnus brother Primarchs correct do you think? Are Sanguinius and the Khan really jealous? I can imagine Fulgrim going with the majority and siding with most of his brothers, but Sanguinius, he's not far off from Magnus? I was pretty shocked when Raldaron of the Blood Angels was there in the Quietroom. I knew Russ and Mortarion were the chief instigators. This whole scene made me feel proper sorry for Magnus. I blame him for the Thousand Sons situation but not having any brother other than Lorgar on your side, jeez ...

2. The image that Edea pulled from Hawsers memory of the Anathame, was this something gleaned from the Thousand Sons or was this something else? I kinda think that it was possibly Erebus or the likes doing. He knew that they would not be able to infiltrate all the Legions, was Hawser possibly an agent of his? I'm sure that if Magnus was the one pulling Hawsers strings then he would have spoken back to Russ.

3. There are no Wolves on Fenris - Yes, this one. There are threads on this but I am asking again as I don't want to open a dead thread. To me this is a tricky one. I think it has something to do with the creation of an Astartes process. Brom I guess was initiated into the ranks of the Astartes but when he was to go through the implantation process his body rejected the Geneseed and he mutated. With Howser they did the same to him, but having tested him knew that he wouldn't accept the Geneseed and at the end left him to join the other wolves. Either that or Russ kills him, 'until next winter' gives me the iddea that that is also a possibility.

spoilers ahoy...

Pilau Rice wrote:
3. There are no Wolves on Fenris - Yes, this one. There are threads on this but I am asking again as I don't want to open a dead thread. To me this is a tricky one. I think it has something to do with the creation of an Astartes process. Brom I guess was initiated into the ranks of the Astartes but when he was to go through the implantation process his body rejected the Geneseed and he mutated. With Howser they did the same to him, but having tested him knew that he wouldn't accept the Geneseed and at the end left him to join the other wolves. Either that or Russ kills him, 'until next winter' gives me the iddea that that is also a possibility.

The only problem I have with the whole "There are no wolves on Fenris" idea is the mythology behind Leman Russ.


This has likely already been discussed, but I don't want to resurrect an old thread for it

reds8n wrote:spoilers ahoy...

Spoiler:

2. Is to do with "who" exactly is behind the plot.

Yup, Erebus then

reds8n wrote:

Spoiler:

As to the actual ending borrowing from a previous conversation.....I think that he was experiencing an induced dreaming, similar to that which Longfang guided him through in his last 12 minutes, and then later, Helwintr when they were trying to get him to turn around and see his manipulator. I would suggest the Wolf King was leading him through the dreaming, into his state of stasis; a last walk for a faithful and respected retainer. I think the inherent analogy of the sequence, was that they were bestowing a measure of freedom on him, by taking him out of play, and also, in a rather lovely way it has to be said, that they would always protect him: He no longer had to be afraid of wolves.

Ah, that's a very good idea red - I haven't actually got to this part yet so I will keep this in mind

NagothDaCleaver wrote:

The only problem I have with the whole "There are no wolves on Fenris" idea is the mythology behind Leman Russ.

Spoiler:

Because if all Fenrisian wolves are failed Space Wolves and there were never Fenrisian Wolves before the Space wolves came to Fenris , as is implied... than what of the story of Leman Russ being raised be a Fenrisian She-wolf and growing up as part of a wolf pack?

That is a good point Maybe Russ ate her?

I can honestly say that Prospero Burns tipped me into the fold of believing that the Imperium is *not* for the greater good of mankind.

That one legion, who is even today a valued part of the Astartes....that one legion can be solely blamed for the galactic civil war, the Horus Heresy, and worse - destroying the servants of the Emperor more faithful than them, and forcing into exile the one being who cared enough to try stopping what Russ' ravening pack fought heroically to achieve: Destruction of the Golden Age and the the death of the Emperor.

I sincerely hope that every Space Wolf burns in hellfire and eternal torment for f****** mankind.

reds8n wrote:

Spoiler:

No.. not Erebus.

Come on then Red .. whom, or at least, who do you think?



C'mon, chuck us a freakin' bone here

errmm.... it tells you whose behind it all if you read the book.

If you're 3 quarters of the way through the book then, IIRC you should already know or have a good idea who it is...

Pilau Rice wrote:Either that or Russ kills him, 'until next winter' gives me the iddea that that is also a possibility.

This last scene is definitely one of the most mysterious passages of the book. IMO I don't think Russ killed Hawser, or that Hawser even died, despite the mortuary sentence:"until next winter".
At first, I thought Hawser was going to get eaten by the wolves which would explain why Russ literally says farewell to Hawser. But it does not really make any sense. We know that Hawser survived this scene with the wolves because it is said in the book that it took place a few hours before Hawser's internment into a stasis sarcophagus with the other dreads.

In addition, the description of the Sacking of Prospero in the previous paragraph is made by the Skjald of Tra to an assembly of SW. In this scene, I had the impression of reading about one of the times Hawser had been woken up from his stasis chamber to tell his stories to his SW company, which would mean that Hawser survived the encounter with the wolves and Russ and was interred in a stasis chamber. I think this is confirmed by another scene just at the end of Hawser's account to the SW, where we see him talking about his stasis internment with the dreads:"we don't like it here. We miss the firelight, etc..."

But I have myself a question: I thought Bjorn, after his internment into a dread, became the official "story teller" of the SW. Being awaken from his stasis from time to time to tell his account to the SW chapter and tell the stories of their primarch. Don't you see similarities with Hawser's role as a skald, being kept in stasis bu awaken from time to time to tell his accounts?

So here is my speculation about Hawser's future: We know that the Fang's siege by the TS will be described in the final book of the TS/SW series.
We know that Bjorn the dread will be a major character of this book.
So, I guess that Hawser will somehow die during the siege and that Bjorn will take up his role as a storyteller of the SW.

reds8n wrote:errmm.... it tells you whose behind it all if you read the book.

If you're 3 quarters of the way through the book then, IIRC you should already know or have a good idea who it is...

Spoiler:

... which ties into why he can't or doesn't want to turn around and see who is behind him

Does it? I get impatient and flick through and miss stuff

I'll finish it, its started to get to the point where he's trying to turn around to find out who it is behind him.

Pilau Rice wrote:

reds8n wrote:errmm.... it tells you whose behind it all if you read the book.

If you're 3 quarters of the way through the book then, IIRC you should already know or have a good idea who it is...

Spoiler:

... which ties into why he can't or doesn't want to turn around and see who is behind him

Does it? I get impatient and flick through and miss stuff

I'll finish it, its started to get to the point where he's trying to turn around to find out who it is behind him.

Stick with it and read all of it.

It's much cooler than Erebus, and makes much more sense.

reds8n wrote:

Spoiler:

@Mr. NagothDaCleaver : indeed, that part of his story would indeed seem to have been relegated to being a mixture of myth and mythunderstanding (.. sorry ). Whilst he might not have have been raised by a wolf and had wolves that were considered to be his brothers, he now has wolfs whom, on a genetic level, are almost literally family/his brothers. I would suggest that the myth of him being raised by wolves is one perhaps born out of people hearing that the wolves with him were/are his brothers and extrapolating in a suitably epic/primcarchesque fashion, it not being common knowledge of course what the wolves actually are.

I wonder if the dropping of this aspect of Russ' past is to also remove this somewhat Romanesque flavour to the Nordic flavour background they have otherwise.

Yeah, but this novel is the only thing where it's stated. Up until this point it was stated as fact that Russ was raised by Fenrisian Wolves, literal wolves. From the original Space wolf background to the Index Astartes articles to the latest Space Wolf Codex.
From the lexicanum:

Lexicanum wrote:
He was adopted by a Fenrisian she-wolf and raised among the wolves, with his two wolf brothers Freki and Geri.

One harsh winter, the wolves attacked a village and stormed the food storage facilities. The villagers fought off the wolves, but Leman Russ fought them off so viciously that all of his brothers escaped alive. Thengir, King of the people of Russ, sent a raiding party of hunters and villagers to remove this menace for good with poisoned arrows and knives sharp enough to slice through oak.

The raiding party killed many members of the pack, including the she-wolf and one of his wolf brothers. Leman Russ was shot many times, and then captured, and brought, bound and gagged before King Thengir. Leman Russ proved himself to be more than just another wolf, and was eventually taken in by the king himself.

He is always accompanied by his two wolf brothers Freki and Geri...hell they're even on the cover of "Prospero Burns" standing on either side of Russ. And in most other artistic depictions of Russ.

So I don't understand what they are trying to do here.

NagothDaCleaver wrote:

Stick with it and read all of it.

It's much cooler than Erebus, and makes much more sense.

Don't worry about that, I intend to, I just get a bit excited I guess and want to find out whats happening. I also suffer a poor attention span, not for a lack of trying to read every page.

NagothDaCleaver wrote:
So I don't understand what they are trying to do here.

Perhaps there is another explanation?

But Russ does say there were no wolves on Fenris before they arrived. Does he mean the Astartes or do they mean the humans? The original settlers would be the explanation as to why there are Wolves before the Astartes but then these would not be tranformed to Astartes. Perhaps it's the Mjod

Dashofpepper wrote:I can honestly say that Prospero Burns tipped me into the fold of believing that the Imperium is *not* for the greater good of mankind.

That one legion, who is even today a valued part of the Astartes....that one legion can be solely blamed for the galactic civil war, the Horus Heresy, and worse - destroying the servants of the Emperor more faithful than them, and forcing into exile the one being who cared enough to try stopping what Russ' ravening pack fought heroically to achieve: Destruction of the Golden Age and the the death of the Emperor.

I sincerely hope that every Space Wolf burns in hellfire and eternal torment for f****** mankind.

How exactly is it Gwar gets permabanned for trolling yet you get to post your dribble everywhere?

NagothDaCleaver wrote:

Pilau Rice wrote:
3. There are no Wolves on Fenris - Yes, this one. There are threads on this but I am asking again as I don't want to open a dead thread. To me this is a tricky one. I think it has something to do with the creation of an Astartes process. Brom I guess was initiated into the ranks of the Astartes but when he was to go through the implantation process his body rejected the Geneseed and he mutated. With Howser they did the same to him, but having tested him knew that he wouldn't accept the Geneseed and at the end left him to join the other wolves. Either that or Russ kills him, 'until next winter' gives me the iddea that that is also a possibility.

The only problem I have with the whole "There are no wolves on Fenris" idea is the mythology behind Leman Russ.

Spoiler:

Because if all Fenrisian wolves are failed Space Wolves and there were never Fenrisian Wolves before the Space wolves came to Fenris , as is implied... than what of the story of Leman Russ being raised be a Fenrisian She-wolf and growing up as part of a wolf pack?

This has likely already been discussed, but I don't want to resurrect an old thread for it

I mulled this one over for some time. Having come from the game vision of 40k where it SEEMS things are more cut and dried. Er, if that's possible.

The mythology of Russ is just that. As such, it may not reflect actual facts and is presented as such.

I think this comment is an allusion to the fact that this is a "failed" or "end" result inherent in the SW's biology. In truth, there are no wolves on Fenris.

NagothDaCleaver wrote:

It's much cooler than Erebus, and makes much more sense.

I wasn't overly fond of this reveal actually, I think it would have been better if it would have been Erebus, I think it would've tide in with how he was keeping an eye on the other legions. Nevermind, it was pretty cool.

What happened to the Bjorn and Valdor incident eh? I thought that was a better telling than that of Bear.

Uhlan wrote:
I think this comment is an allusion to the fact that this is a "failed" or "end" result inherent in the SW's biology. In truth, there are no wolves on Fenris.

We're aware of that dude, but what are the wolves - are they the failed aspirants or are they the first settlers?

From the passage where Hawser is on Prospero and he mentions the smokey shadows that resemble Wolves I thought that possibly they were like the Thousand Sons Tutelaries, but then I thought no, as the Sisters of Silence were there.

Pilau Rice wrote:

NagothDaCleaver wrote:

It's much cooler than Erebus, and makes much more sense.

Spoiler:

It was a Daemon

I wasn't overly fond of this reveal actually, I think it would have been better if it would have been Erebus, I think it would've tide in with how he was keeping an eye on the other legions. Nevermind, it was pretty cool.

What happened to the Bjorn and Valdor incident eh? I thought that was a better telling than that of Bear.

Uhlan wrote:
I think this comment is an allusion to the fact that this is a "failed" or "end" result inherent in the SW's biology. In truth, there are no wolves on Fenris.

We're aware of that dude, but what are the wolves - are they the failed aspirants or are they the first settlers?

From the passage where Hawser is on Prospero and he mentions the smokey shadows that resemble Wolves I thought that possibly they were like the Thousand Sons Tutelaries, but then I thought no, as the Sisters of Silence were there.

I was trying to be oblique for the sake of those who might not have read anything yet. I guess I went too far.

By "failed" or "end" result inherent in the SW's biology. I meant that the wolves on Fenris most likely are failed aspirants or those who have subcumbed at a later date (fully transformed wulfen?). I think that's what I meant... I'll ask myself again later. Meanwhile, let's just go with that...

I would think, much like the Space Vampires, er, Blood Angels, that the wolves on Fenris are "sanctioned" physical aberrations of the Primarchs gene-seed and are NOT considered a manifestation of chaos like the 1K S's tutelaries for exactly the reason you cite.

If they were "native" intelligences, in other words, "not human", the nature of the crusade would have eliminated them. If they were descended from the original colonists they would have been seen as tainted by chaos and eliminated... Russ, or no.

Uhlan wrote:
I was trying to be oblique for the sake of those who might not have read anything yet. I guess I went too far.

Sorry Uhlan, I was just being friendly - there are others out there that haven't posted on the thread and you are right

Uhlan wrote:By "failed" or "end" result inherent in the SW's biology. I meant that the wolves on Fenris most likely are failed aspirants or those who have subcumbed at a later date (fully transformed wulfen?). I think that's what I meant... I'll ask myself again later. Meanwhile, let's just go with that...

I would think, much like the Space Vampires, er, Blood Angels, that the wolves on Fenris are "sanctioned" physical aberrations of the Primarchs gene-seed and are NOT considered a manifestation of chaos like the 1K S's tutelaries for exactly the reason you cite.

If they were "native" intelligences, in other words, "not human", the nature of the crusade would have eliminated them. If they were descended from the original colonists they would have been seen as tainted by chaos and eliminated... Russ, or no.

Perhaps only the Wolves are aware that they aren't actually wolves, rumours will eventually get out. But without being able to prove otherwise, that's all they remain. The Wolves aren't likely to let anyone on to Fenris to start running tests

Dashofpepper wrote:I can honestly say that Prospero Burns tipped me into the fold of believing that the Imperium is *not* for the greater good of mankind.

That one legion, who is even today a valued part of the Astartes....that one legion can be solely blamed for the galactic civil war, the Horus Heresy, and worse - destroying the servants of the Emperor more faithful than them, and forcing into exile the one being who cared enough to try stopping what Russ' ravening pack fought heroically to achieve: Destruction of the Golden Age and the the death of the Emperor.

I sincerely hope that every Space Wolf burns in hellfire and eternal torment for f****** mankind.

Ouch, thats kind of harsh man

But in all honesty its all a matter of opinion, and I think you're exaggerating a little in saying that the SWs were the cause of the Horus Heresy.

I say the Thousand Sons got what was comin to em. Magnus did it to himself, he played with fire and he got burned. The Emperor told him, he warned him, he said "Son, I know more about the warp than you, take my word for it." What did Magnus do? He continued to play with fire, he continued to practice sorcery in his room while his dad wasn't looking. Oh yeah he tried to do the right thing and warn the big E about Horus but...

The Emperor: So besides you disobeying me to burst in here and destroy centuries of my work, why should I believe you?

Magnus: Because I saw him dad! He swore fealty to the Ruinous Powers!

Emperor: And how did you see Horus doing this while you're on Prospero?

Magnus: uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhm......


Yeah, if Magnus really wanted to warn the Emperor, I'm sure if he sat down and thought up a way that wouldn't totally piss the guy off then everything would work out fine, but it really ruins your credibility when you break a law at the same time you're doing something right.

Oh and what does Magnus do when he loses? Swear loyalty to Tzeentch. If he was TRULY loyal to the Emperor and mankind he would have let his legion fall instead of handing them to the dark side.

And what of Russ? He was doing what the Emperor told him to do, Horus, his bigger brother and commander of the Emperor's forces including the Astartes told him it was different and so needed to be handled differently. The Emperor was all the way back on Terra and Horus (who might I remind you is still loyal in everyone's mind) is closer to the problem than anyone is. Who would you believe, your dad back home or your big brother who's right there?

Russ did what was right with the information at hand. Retrospect is a wondrous thing but it doesn't do any good.

Yeah, the Wolves follow orders, Magnus did not and turned to Tzeentch for salvation. Simple as that. If he really cared about more than his own ambitions, he would have abided by the Decree and/or surrendered his legion. The fact that the Emperor never admonished Russ or his legion, nor did any subsequent loyalists- indeed Russ was beloved by many in the Imperium and the Space Wolves are still regarded as great protectors of humanity, reaffirms this.

As to the "No wolves on Fenris," it is an offhand quote by a traitor. It could be construed as yet another level of Chaos trying to undermine the trust of loyalists. From a writing perspective, it is a poorly thought out attempt to add mystery that conflicts with existing canon. Fortunately, since the HH books do not claim to be literal (they are premised on being recollections, probably so any statements can be altered or discarded as GW sees fit), it's all pretty much speculation anyway.

WARORK93 wrote:Oh and what does Magnus do when he loses? Swear loyalty to Tzeentch. If he was TRULY loyal to the Emperor and mankind he would have let his legion fall instead of handing them to the dark side

To be honest, Magnus did try to accept his father's decision. He shut down his orbital defenses, scattered his war fleet, abandoned his orbital platforms, sent his people away from prospero and led his legion in an open space to wait for the wolves arrival.

But then, the wolves started sacking his beloved homeworld.
You know, like peeing on his books, or using them as paper toilet. They're wolves for the emperor's sake! What did he expect?

Seriously, the wolves did fire the first shots in the battle of prospero (according to the orders they had received). Thus, the TS and the prospero spireguard fought back with all they had (including the forbidden sorcery arts).
But it was already too late.
The wolves slaughtered the sons, and, at the climax of the battle, seconds before receiving the deathblow from the hands of his own brother, in a act of total desperation, Magnus turned to Tzeentch.

IMHO, both sides acted as anyone would have in this desperate situation. Their acts are completely justified according to me. Even Magnus' treason in favor of Chaos can be understood: He had been abandoned by all. His father had humiliated him and sent his own brother to kill him and destroy his homeworld and his legion. Hence, I understand why Magnus accepted Tzeentch's offer and turned away from the IoM.

Laodamia wrote:

WARORK93 wrote:Oh and what does Magnus do when he loses? Swear loyalty to Tzeentch. If he was TRULY loyal to the Emperor and mankind he would have let his legion fall instead of handing them to the dark side

To be honest, Magnus did try to accept his father's decision. He shut down his orbital defenses, scattered his war fleet, abandoned his orbital platforms, sent his people away from prospero and led his legion in an open space to wait for the wolves arrival.

But then, the wolves started sacking his beloved homeworld.
You know, like peeing on his books, or using them as paper toilet. They're wolves for the emperor's sake! What did he expect?

Seriously, the wolves did fire the first shots in the battle of prospero (according to the orders they had received). Thus, the TS and the prospero spireguard fought back with all they had (including the forbidden sorcery arts).
But it was already too late.
The wolves slaughtered the sons, and, at the climax of the battle, seconds before receiving the deathblow from the hands of his own brother, in a act of total desperation, Magnus turned to Tzeentch.

IMHO, both sides acted as anyone would have in this desperate situation. Their acts are completely justified according to me. Even Magnus' treason in favor of Chaos can be understood: He had been abandoned by all. His father had humiliated him and sent his own brother to kill him and destroy his homeworld and his legion. Hence, I understand why Magnus accepted Tzeentch's offer and turned away from the IoM.

Exactly, despite being suger gentic soldiers there were still of human stock and felt emotions. Magnus basically tried the whole 'ends justify the means' in his attempts to warn the emperor and dissuade Horus form signing over his soul to the warp but in doing so broke rules that his father had laid down. Russ followed orders and 'local' Intelligence (Horus) but did strike too hard but he is a feral animal and what else could you expect of him?

Laodamia wrote:
To be honest, Magnus did try to accept his father's decision. He shut down his orbital defenses, scattered his war fleet, abandoned his orbital platforms, sent his people away from prospero and led his legion in an open space to wait for the wolves arrival.

But then, the wolves started sacking his beloved homeworld.

Magnus did everything EXCEPT the one thing he needed to do. Surrender. If he had hailed Russ and said 'My bad, take me to Terra and leave the planet alone.' it would have been okay. But instead he was torn by indecision over what to do. He left the defenses down, but left the defense forces ready and the force shields up. If you read it, he's in his tower for half of the battle trying to figure out what he wants to do.

Russ didn't want to sack Prospero, but he has a job to do and that is to follow his Dad's orders and do the dirty jobs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Dashofpepper wrote:snip
I sincerely hope that every Space Wolf burns in hellfire and eternal torment for f****** mankind.

Dash trolling SW players? NO WAI


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I don't believe Russ struck too hard either. If you read Russ' conversation with Hawser, he is clear that the Emperor told him to Sanction Magnus, if necessary and bring him back to Terra.

He also makes it clear at the very end that this isn't the first time. Throughout the book, the wolves indicate that this is their job, to stamp out malificarum and utterly annihilate what they are aimed at.

Do you really think the Emperor would have sent Russ if he wanted a nice peaceful walk in the park? No, he would have sent one of the prissy primarchs to nicely walk up and ask for Magnus to come home. Instead, who did he send? Freaking Russ.

Whether you beleive Horus influenced Russ' approach or not, the Emperor chose who was going there. Do you think the Emperor is so dumb as not to know who he sent? He made the Primarchs; He knows what each one is good for and what they are not good for.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
At least he didn't send Angron.

pretre wrote:At least he didn't send Angron.

I bet he considered sending the psychopath of the family to solve the problem once and for all. If Angron had been sent instead of Russ, the TS would really have had things to complain about.

Laodamia wrote:

pretre wrote:At least he didn't send Angron.

I bet he considered sending the psychopath of the family to solve the problem once and for all. If Angron had been sent instead of Russ, the TS would really have had things to complain about.

You mean the bits that he would pick out of his teeth?

Also, I don't think the World Eaters would have been successful. The Thousand Sons are a bit too devious and a bit too easily directed. Of course they do make up for it in sheer brute force and destruction.

Laodamia wrote:

pretre wrote:At least he didn't send Angron.

I bet he considered sending the psychopath of the family to solve the problem once and for all. If Angron had been sent instead of Russ, the TS would really have had things to complain about.

But why Russ and not Angron?

From what we know of Angron he is an absolute killer and murderer.

Why Russ to be the Executioner and not Angron? Possibly Angron is without conscious in these matters where Russ can know restraint and temperance.,

Angron is too obvious - Russ plays at being the barbarian king, while being much, much cleverer than that.

From memory the earlier books in HH set the tone for Russ not going to Prospero in a concilatory mood; there is definite implication the Horus tampered with the orders, potentially just over emphasizing the need for physical chastisement (i.e., kill everything) over simply bringin Magnus back with him.

I think the issue with the Emperor is almost everyone thinks the Big E can call on whatever resources he can, at any time.

Its not like:

"Line up kids, your brother Magnus has misbehaved so I need one of you to go talk to him nicely and bring him back. I'm debating who I should send."

More like:

"My Lord Emperor! We need to make Primarch Magnus answer for this travestry!"

The Emperor struggles to make a response while pouring more of himself into the temporary psychic shield that prevents immaterium from bleeding into reality. The magnitude of Magnus's intrusion have utterly destroyed all the wards that protect this place of research and a 2nd Eye of Terror could occur at any time. Only the Emperor's presence and full power prevents complete disaster.

"My Lord! We need to take action now!"

With more strain than the Emperor would care to admit, he asks, "Which of my sons are available?"

"Primarch Russ is in a neighbouring sector. He can reach Magnus within 4 cycles."

The Emperor hesitates but says tersely, "Let it be so." before turning his full attention back to containing the crisis.

---

Don't get me wrong. I'm a fan of SW but they were designed to be the ultimate fail-safe. In a battle between equals, the 1st person who blinks loses. That was why Russ was unique in his ability to make decisive war once the gauntlet has been thrown.

For Magnus, he really is a sympathetific figure. Take a look:

1) Sacrifices irreplaceable resources to reach the Emperor
2) Gets through but is consumed with horror at the consequences his actions has wrought (He was hoping for vindication remember?)
3) Retreats back into his sanctum to manage his guilt
4) Deactivates everything but struggles to share with his children his shame
5) The lack of communication prompts his confused legion to defend itself (SW and TS always had a lot of mistrust between the 2) against a barbaric assault
6) Their defence prompts the SW into all out war (you cannot leash the dogs again once unleashed)
7) The level of brutality & inhumanity visited upon his loved ones/home finally galvanizes Magnus to take action
8) By then, it is too little, too late