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2011/03/26 04:31:44
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 3000 New To Fantasy!
hey all, so I finally took the plunge and traveled back in time to the age of swords and sorcery, here's the list I'm building towards with my Warriors of Chaos, I'm going for a predominantly Tzeentch theme with my army (as the title suggests) but I'm always open to suggestions, especially since I just started! Anyways I look forward to any comments or constructive criticism you guys might have, thanks!
Heroes:
Level 2 Chaos Sorcerer (General) - MoT, Conjoined Homunculus, Enchanted Shield Spell Familiar, Nectrotic Phylactery - 190pts
Exalted Hero - MoT, Fury of the Blood God, Filth Mace, The Other Tricksters Shard, Shield, Daemonic Steed - 245pts
Core:
17x Chaos Warriors - MoT, Full Command, Hand Weapons/Shields - 322pts
18x Chaos Warriors - MoT, Full Command, Hand Weapons/Shields - 338pts
Special:
8x Chaos Knights - MoT, Full Command, Banner of Swiftness, Ensorcelled Weapons/Shields - 405pts
Total: 1500pts
The Sorcerer runs with the 17 Warrior Unit, while the hero obviously runs with the knights. warriors act as anvil, knights act as hammer, simple and straightforward.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2011/04/05 17:38:59
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
Brutal little nugget of armor and ward, innit? Here are some thoughts from me:
+ I'd much prefer third eye over the homunculus any day, especially since you aren't running a BSB and the sorcerer's stupidity check is going to be at LD8 Or drop the gift entirely if you need points. Actually, I think the points are wrong on your sorcerer anyway - without the homunculus he comes to 180 points (you have to buy the enchanted shield in the WoC book, not the one in the BRB)
+ The exalted can't take fury and any items (so no fury for him!), and I also think you could do better on his weapon, like a sword of swift slaying to get some legit reroll action going on. While the shard is certainly useful, I would rather see ironcurse icon to give him and his expensive entourage a better ward vs artillery, and I'd also like to see his mundane shield be a charmed shield instead (same points, and it fits with ASF sword and ironcurse). Rounding out his points, maybe a little dragonbane gem to jack his ward up vs those ever present flaming things? Finally, what about making him the BSB? Many upsides, not too many downsides, but modeling dependent to an extent.
[Exalted Hero - MoT, sword of swift slaying, charmed shield, dragonbane gem, ironcuse icon, demonic mount = 210]
+ Why banner of swiftness? MR(1) banner, or flaming for a warrior unit, or so on seem a bit more useful. M8 isn't much different from M7 (though clearly it'll come up when you most miss it )
After you play some games you might find that having even 1 unit of 5 warhounds is useful, as a chaff unit that can do unwholesome things (like sit on fanatics or bait frenzied maniacs and so on). There are definitely points to be had in the list if you need them.
EDIT You know what, even if you go with the stripped down characters I suggested above, you've got 390 points in Heroes, when you only get 375 @ 1500 points (25%). Can be fixed by trimming (phylactery, maybe dragonbane) but watch those %!
For the hell of it, I've included a tweaked out list if you're interested ...
Spoiler:
H: Sorcerer - MoT, level 2, enchanted shield, spell familiar = 170
H: Exalted Hero - MoT, sword of swift slaying, charmed shield, dragonbane gem, demonic mount = 205
Heroes are legal again, I recruited some puppies and distributed magic standards: the sorcerer's warriors got a reroll for failed fears or whatever, and the knights got a 4+ ward vs shooting, because they will be shot and you may as well protect that investment!
- Salvage
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2011/03/28 04:27:32
thanks Boss! that second list looks good, It definitely has alot more feng shui then mine lol. I actually played my first game of fantasy yesterday aginst Lizardmen @ 1500pts. after chatting with some of the more veteran Fantasy players at my store I decided to try out a Nurgle WoC list 1) Because everyone in the store who plays WoC plays Tzeentch, and 2) statistically they said Nurgle can be better than Zteentch simply for denying attacks coming at you.
*after reading your post today Boss, I realize that my hero points were over their percentage, something I'm gonna change for sure!
my opponents list ( as near as I can remember it):
H: Lvl 1 Skink Priest on Stegadon w/engine of the gods H: Lvl 4 Slaan Mage Priest w/lore of Light
C: 18 Saurus warriors - Hand Weapons/Shields, Full Command C: 18 Saurus warriors - Hand Weapons/Shields, Full Command
S: 20 Temple Guard w/Hand Weapons and shields, the banner that gives armor piercing
______
The game went well, granted his mage priest and skink kept shutting down my sorcerer like it was cool, but the knights did their job quite effectively killing both units of saurus warriors and the stegadon. The Slaan blew himself and 17 temple guard up after rolling an irresistible force which completely turned the game around. If the slaan hadn't of blown himself up things wouldv'e gone downhill very fast indeed lol.
but I ended up tabling my friend on my first game, after which he proceeded to crush a Tau player with his demons to salve his wounded pride lol.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/03/28 12:10:18
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
Good on you going Nurgle, I fully support the switch. Tizz is 'better' but Nurgs is more unique and tons of fun to model Also, it's got quite a cool magic lore, that people pretty much never see any more
NICE work beating those lizards! His slann certainly deserved to blow up, fielding fatty @ 1500 points is mean / somewhat ridiculous ...
On your hero problem, I think the only place to cut is the sorcerer's enchanted shield, maybe replace it with seed of rebirth? The regen will help more with miscast damage and snipes than the 2+ armor would have. Also, make sure you write 'charmed' on the BSB's shield, costs no extra but keeps cannonballs from sniping him a little longer (remember, he's monstrous cav so gets no Look Out Sir! roll vs artillery).
Also, with your extra points, definitely stick banner of eternal flame on one of those warriors. I didn't mention it with Tzeentch because you had flaming magic, but you definitely want some kind of fire to wreck hellpit / hydra / trolls' parades.
Thanks again for the advice Boss! I'll try and do some point shifting and write up a 'renewed' Nurgle list.
Another question, at the 1500pt level my Hero mainly rides around with the knights and acts as a hammer so I was wondering if the BSB is a necessity with him, seeing as he's usually riding up the flanks away from the warriors who would benefit from the re-rolls.
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/03/28 13:45:32
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
In the list I posted I went with kill gear, deciding that a BSB is not 100% mandatory @ 1500 points. I still think it's incredibly useful, and you'll want one @ 2000, when you can make the sorcerer or the demonic mount guy a lord, freeing up hero points for a third character. As to pulling his banner out of range, your line shouldn't really be spread that far out anyway, and in 8th edition your warriors can probably keep pace with the knights well enough to not get too left behind. You could also not drive your knights 14" a turn into the enemy backfield, but keep them a little more cohesive with the rest of the crew That said, for 25 points having +1CR and rerolled LD for the knights alone is a steal. Not having a magic weapon (ASF sword!) or a little better defense (collar of kron?) is sad, but hardly a bad deal.
- Salvage
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2011/03/28 13:46:28
Gotcha, yeah at higher point levels the intent is to have a Sorcerer Lord Riding around on a Daemonic Mount with Lore of Shadows so the Exalted Hero will definitely be the BSB, plus at higher levels I can afford to give him cooler gear lol.
As far as expanding the core, would you recommend maurauders/maurauder horsemen, or should I add more warriors?
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/03/31 18:39:36
Subject: Re:Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/03/31 18:42:29
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/01 01:02:28
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
Wait, is that a Mark of Khorne on the marauders? Shame! ()
Good to see more bodies though, always a good move. Few smallish things:
+ Knight champs are a really poor use of points, only useful when you've got a character with them. Now that you don't, there's 20 free points!
+ I'd prefer the sword of swift slaying on the BSB rather than the rending sword. Besides hitting first, he'll probably get more benefit from it, particularly against T3 things that he's already wounding on 2+ (due to the nature of the WS chart, with 3+ being as good as it gets, rerolling that 3+ is more useful more often). Also, 5 points cheaper!
+ So now I've freed up 25 points, what did you want on your characters? Seed of rebirth is ok (and cool on Nurgle), if a little meh, particularly against miscasts, enemy snipes, etc. Remember, that dude is your general! Collar of Kr0n or talisman of endurance come to mind.
+ Getting some fire in the list wouldn't be a terrible thought either, regen-ing bastards are real threats at 1500+ 10 points to slap banner of eternal flame on a warrior block? Well worth it!
Awesome advice as always Salvage! and did I say Khorne? I meant Nurgle.....I swear! But in all seriousness I was trying to keep fluff accurate with this army and seeing as Nurgle and Khorne willingly work together from time to time it seemed fitting to have a bunch of blood crazy marauders link up with a Nurgle host for the promise of death and glory.
As far as the list goes I'll keep in mind the bit about dropping the Knight Champion, as well as The Banner of Eternal Flame/Sword of Swift Slaying.
I cooked up a 2,000pt Nurgle List Last night as well that looks rather mean on paper, but as always C&C is much appreciated!
S: 17x Chosen - MoN, Shields, Halberds, Full Command, Blasted Standard - 440pts
R: Chaos Warshrine - 130pts
Total: 2001pts
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/01 15:00:19
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
nice that you are going nurgle!! nurgle are awesome snipers with their magic, since their base spell is awesome also you will most likely get the regen spell for nurgle which is a plus on its own, with your 2k list i would give your chosen the wailing banner for terror so that at the start of the game you have less bad things to get( you re roll all results of 2,7,10,11) and favour of the gods to get points for that i would drop 1 warrior each and then run them as a 6 X 4 unit and MoN knights with a banner of rage are awesome frenzied nurgle is just funny
2011/04/01 18:27:12
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
S: 17x Chosen - MoN, Shields, Halberds, Musician, Standard Bearer, Blasted Standard - 440pts S: 6x Dragon Ogres - Great Weapons - 462pts
Total: 2499pts
* The warhounds run Interference for the Dragon Ogres and give them hard cover, BSB rolls with the Chosen, Nurgle bricks to the left and right, while the Sorcerers scoot around on foot and zap of spells while negating the damage on my troops of potential miscasts.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/04/01 18:32:23
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/01 18:35:16
Subject: Re:Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
S: 17x Chosen - MoN, Shields, Halberds, Full Command, Blasted Standard - 440pts
R: Chaos Warshrine - 130pts
Total: 2001pts
I'd grab a 5+ ward on the level 4 before taking blood (same points), especially if he's riding on a LOS!-less pony (which I'm not saying is a terrible idea, but certainly makes him more vulnerable). And I'd still take the ward even if you're planning on putting him with the chosen, because he will be miscasting and being sniped from time to time, as well as punched in the face in combat
Let me echo my banner of eternal flame comment from last time (i.e. one of those warriors should have it), and also that if you're taking a warshrine, you may as well put favor somewhere in the list. Whether you attach it to the chosen or hand it to the exalted (giving it to the chosen also makes their extra cost pay off more, by manipulating their starting roll), it's too simple of a way to make your 'shrine pay off a bit better to pass up. Dropping the roar pays for the favor and the flaming banner, and also cleans up that 2001st point
- Salvage
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/04/01 18:36:38
S: 17x Chosen - MoN, Shields, Halberds, Full Command, Blasted Standard - 440pts
R: Chaos Warshrine - 130pts
Total: 2001pts
I'd grab a 5+ ward on the level 4 before taking blood (same points), especially if he's riding on a LOS!-less pony (which I'm not saying is a terrible idea, but certainly makes him more vulnerable). And I'd still take the ward even if you're planning on putting him with the chosen, because he will be miscasting and being sniped from time to time, as well as punched in the face in combat
Let me echo my banner of eternal flame comment from last time (i.e. one of those warriors should have it), and also that if you're taking a warshrine, you may as well put favor somewhere in the list. Whether you attach it to the chosen or hand it to the exalted (giving it to the chosen also makes their extra cost pay off more, by manipulating their starting roll), it's too simple of a way to make your 'shrine pay off a bit better to pass up. Dropping the roar pays for the favor and the flaming banner, and also cleans up that 2001st point
- Salvage
Gotcha, I'll encorporate the changes later today! any thoughts on the 2500 Salvage?
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/01 20:10:11
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
Ranked drogres are nifty, good luck with that. I'd rather see MoN on the level 4 (or is he 3?) as well, partially for theme, partially because every damn chaos level 4 is shadow or tizz, and partially because buboes spam is still pretty legit in 8th. In which case I'd rework the back up caster, probably keep him level 1 for the bewbs and give him an arcane item that matters more (a scroll, dispel or otherwise) after the lord takes the puppet.
A lot of my other comments still apply: lack of wards on characters that matter (level 4, BSB), lack of flaming anywhere. I'd also split the dogs up into 2x 5-6, drop the scaly skin if you need points (unless it's a modeling thing?), and give the favor to a chosen champion. Not sure what points look like at that point, but you should have the cheddar to afford some wards for the HQ dudes.
EDIT Do not take the Book of Secrets on any wizard higher than level 1 (or probably any wizard), as it resets their level to 1 and then gives them that hideous low-end of the misfire chart - it was FAQ'd to no longer do what you think it does ...
- Salvage
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2011/04/01 20:17:52
Ranked drogres- sweet! I think great weapons is the way to go on them, but they are sooooooo pricey, so it's good that you're not adding them in until 2.5k.
I'd try to combo-charge them into another unit, hopefully getting the flank. It's somewhat sad that a nearly 500 point unit needs to combo charge, but that's eighth edition and the mighty, mighty blocks! (Of which you have a few )
Way to go nurgle! Awesome modelling potential, here.
There are great conversions for drogres, and in the meantime you could swap in your chaos knights, they fill a similar role (and are actually a bit more cost effective and killy than the drogres, although they sport a lot less wounds).
2011/04/01 21:29:13
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
Boss Salvage wrote:Ranked drogres are nifty, good luck with that. I'd rather see MoN on the level 4 (or is he 3?) as well, partially for theme, partially because every damn chaos level 4 is shadow or tizz, and partially because buboes spam is still pretty legit in 8th. In which case I'd rework the back up caster, probably keep him level 1 for the bewbs and give him an arcane item that matters more (a scroll, dispel or otherwise) after the lord takes the puppet.
gotcha, the reason I was taking a lore of shadows guy was to cast enfeebling the foe followed by curse of the leper to nuke out a single unit if the dice are good.
Boss Salvage wrote:
A lot of my other comments still apply: lack of wards on characters that matter (level 4, BSB), lack of flaming anywhere. I'd also split the dogs up into 2x 5-6, drop the scaly skin if you need points (unless it's a modeling thing?), and give the favor to a chosen champion. Not sure what points look like at that point, but you should have the cheddar to afford some wards for the HQ dudes.
yeah the only reason I didn't shuffle the new Item in was because I didn't have my rulebook at work so I couldn't remember the names/costs of certain items, but rest assured they'll be worked in!
Boss Salvage wrote:
Do not take the Book of Secrets on any wizard higher than level 1 (or probably any wizard), as it resets their level to 1 and then gives them that hideous low-end of the misfire chart - it was FAQ'd to no longer do what you think it does ...
Holy crap! noted! book has been thrown in the fire!
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/02 03:01:32
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
I like the list, though scaly skin on the warhounds seems a little questionable. Only 18 odd points, so no biggie, but it would be 1 more warrior.
Props on running Nurgle theme. I like Big Papa N. in theory, but unfortunately your friends are, statistically, very bad at math. Nice folks I am sure, but I wouldn't ask them to do your taxes or check your research papers Tizz is ALWAYS better in all cases than Nurgle, both in the effect and the points cost. Swap the points costs and they might be more balanced.
BUT! That only matters if you are intending to win tournaments or other games. Nurgle is cool and makes for awesome conversions. I am partial to Slaanesh or just straight unmarked myself.
Still, can't stand to see people claim it is better or as good when the math is actually pretty straight forward. Pedantry and all that
Also, what are you planning on rolling model wise for the Drogers? A sweet conversion I hope
Hmmm. I too would like to know which friend it was who said Nurgle was better. Let the record state that I run and argued for Tizz if you wanted to win tournies. Nurgle Knights maybe, only because they always get shot at and the 6+ ward may not be as good as the -1 BS but, you can't beat Tizz on the warriors. I will be printing this out and bringing it up to HC just for proof.
2011/04/03 01:04:46
Subject: Re:Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
The only way Nurgle is better is if the enemy fails their Fear test in melee, and thus is WS 0 to attack you. Depending on which side of the "WTF happens with WS0?" argument your group falls on, the enemy is then hitting you on 6's (instead of 5 off the top of my head) or not hitting you at all. Even still, making them WS1 is nearly as good if you decide they still get to attack.
You can think of it this way:
1/6 less chance to be hit = 1/6 less chance to be wounded = 1/6 better chance to avoid the wound
It doesn't matter which step gets the adjustment, so long as it happens. So the only question is: Where do I get the bonus?
Nurgle affects:BS based shooting, and enemy WS is equal 1 greater than yours, or WS ~3 lower than yours. (E.g. WS4 Marauders benefit if their enemy is WS 5, going to 4, so needing 4's instead of 3). Nurgle does not affect: Any melee other than 1 more or about 3 less than yours. Templates, cannons, spells of all kinds, TK shooting, impact hits, stomps, thunder stomps and anything else that autohits that I am forgetting about.
Tzeentch affects: Every wound that allows a ward save. This includes: Templates, cannons, spells of all kinds, TK shooting, impact hits, stomps, thunder stomps and anything else that autohits that I am forgetting about. Tzeentch does not affect: ... wounds that don't allow a ward save... uhm I suppose there are some magic weapons that do that too.
Then you have cost. Nurgle is inexplicably more expensive by 10 points.
So basically, Nurgle costs more for what is at best an equivalent benefit when you manage to benefit from it at all. MoT works against nearly everything while MoN hardly ever works. MoN also has the added bonus of starting an argument when you say your Nurgly knights can't be attacked because their opponents failed their Fear check :-P
PS: sorry if I sound pissy when writing that; thinking too hard about how short the end of the stick Nurgle got makes me mad. The effect wasn't even better in 7th when it was just straight -1WS instead of only when attacking, and it still cost more inexplicably. Further, even if MoN gave +1 T like 40k it would STILL be worse, as anything with S equal to your new T +2 wouldn't care (such as cannons) while Tizz would STILL improve your survivability by 1/6. Such bad rules writing it is painful.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/04/03 01:05:23
uhm you can't reduce someone BS lower then 1 its in the errata so they will always hit on a 5+ even if they fail their fear test. the whole point of taking the nurgle on the knights is against mass shooting not cannons as the extra -1 to hit from shooting works better then a 6+ ward save and in Close combat anything that bypasses your AS deserves to kill you since those will most likely be monsters that strike last anyway which you can kill before they attacks or a cannon ball which is solved by the standard
2011/04/03 05:07:00
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
bob501 wrote:uhm you can't reduce someone BS lower then 1 its in the errata so they will always hit on a 5+ even if they fail their fear test. the whole point of taking the nurgle on the knights is against mass shooting not cannons as the extra -1 to hit from shooting works better then a 6+ ward save and in Close combat anything that bypasses your AS deserves to kill you since those will most likely be monsters that strike last anyway which you can kill before they attacks or a cannon ball which is solved by the standard
No... -1 to BS = +1 ward. Seriously. Do the math. Losing ~16% chance to be hit is the same as gaining a ~16% chance to ignore the hit. What the devil are they teaching in schools today?
Just to clarify, unless a modifier takes a step to ZERO chance, a +/- change to any given Hit-Wound-Armor-Ward/Regen save chance is equivalent. It only matters how often you get the bonus at that point.
Also I assume you were referring to WS, not BS. Didn't know they clarified that, good to know. Makes MoN even less useful sadly :(
As to the rest, I would suggest that no monster deserves to kill my knights, especially if I can cheaply get a way to avoid the most powerful attacks all together. Also, that standard that is great against cannon balls? It is even better with MoT. How about that?
you must remember that with a 1+ AS the 6+ ward wont be used as much compared to every shooting attack getting -1 BS and not all armies have cannons or enough cannons at this point lvl(1500) to point at the knights since they will be aiming at the blocks of warriors with the characters inside
2011/04/03 20:43:15
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
You also must remember that this is Fantasy, not 40k; that ward save is used in addition to your armor, not instead of it. So you get your 2+ armor roll, then you get a 6+ ward roll.
So again, a +1 ward is used against EVERYTHING that wounds the knights in addition to their armor.
thanks for the advice guys, I know Tzeentch is the competitive build, but I'm building towards Nurgle because there's already a couple Tzeentch guys in my area and because I like the modelling/fluff angle.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/04/03 21:43:43
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
0103/05/10 21:46:41
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
Brother Heinrich wrote:thanks for the advice guys, I know Tzeentch is the competitive build, but I'm building towards Nurgle because there's already a couple Tzeentch guys in my area and because I like the modelling/fluff angle.
Good fellow! I expect to see some awesome conversions posted on here.
I'll do my best! I really want to work in a Sorcerer Lord on a Chaos Dragon just so I can make an awesome plague dragon!
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
2011/04/04 00:19:19
Subject: Tzeentch(Now Nurgle!) WoC 1500 New To Fantasy!
Wehrkind wrote:Sweet. One big downside to the way things work in 8th is that you almost never see dragons anymore. Just too expensive and easy to kill :(
I Know, its such a bummer I can't justify taking him even at 3,000pts because of the competitive atmosphere of my FLGS, its not a bad thing but fluff players have a rough time surviving unless they're playing a fluff that happens to coincide with competitiveness (i.e. Tzeentch). I still might end up building it down the road and just go down looking awesome lol
actiondan wrote:According to popular belief I cannot use drop pods because only the Imperium can organize itself enough to put 10 men in a container and fire it at a planet.
Or drop the gift entirely if you need points. Actually, I think the points are wrong on your sorcerer anyway - without the homunculus he comes to 180 points (you have to buy the enchanted shield in the 
)
)
Also, it's got quite a cool magic lore, that people pretty much never see any more 
to get points for that i would drop 1 warrior each and then run them as a 6 X 4 unit
