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Can a butcher cast the same spell more than once on a unit and therefore boost the outcome of the unit? i.e:

Butcher casts toothcracker and increases a bull unit buy +1 toughness, giving them toughness 5. Next turn he casts the same spell toothcracker onto the same unit, there by increasing the bulls toughness by another +1, giving the bulls toughness 6.

As this is the same spell, is the dispel power level still the same power level 7 to dispel both the spells or just 1 of them? ie:

2 of the same spell toothcracker increasing the bulls to toughness 6, i dispel it on a power level of 7 therefore the bulls are toughness 4 again or does it just get rid of one +1 toughness and i'd have to dispel the next one.

Any help to clarify would be great

spells stack in fantasy Mark, so yes, you can do that

just read the bit in the BRB about Hex and augment spells being cumulative. So that clears that up but what about the second question?

Gorillawizard wrote:Can a butcher cast the same spell more than once on a unit and therefore boost the outcome of the unit? i.e:

Butcher casts toothcracker and increases a bull unit buy +1 toughness, giving them toughness 5. Next turn he casts the same spell toothcracker onto the same unit, there by increasing the bulls toughness by another +1, giving the bulls toughness 6.

As the Toothcracker spell is a RIP, no you can't do this. A wizard can't cast multiples of the same RIP spell unless the the first is dispelled either by the Wizard or the opponent. This is spelled out on pg 36 under Remains in Play Spells. *edit* This may not be the case. See the FAQ and decide for yourself *edit*

Now, if you cast Toothcracker from separate Butchers/Slaughtermasters, then yes, this would work.

As to dispelling, the spells are separate, and your opponent would have to dispel both to fully remove the effects. So if he were to dispel one, the other would continue to function until he dispelled it as well.

On a related note, none of the Gut Magic spells are either Hexes or Augments. They may function like them, but they are not those spell types. Nothing in the Ogre FAQ changed them to be so.

Awesome, thank davall.

Davall wrote:...On a related note, none of the Gut Magic spells are either Hexes or Augments. They may function like them, but they are not those spell types. Nothing in the Ogre FAQ changed them to be so...

I also believe they are not RiP spells (only act like it), therefore they can be casted multiple times from the same caster, having them stack, correct?

I would be inclined to say no. The FAQ mentions they are treated as RIP spells for dispelling. While this may an overly broad interpretation, it seems to be the only one to make them work without MSU (Making "stuff" up) within the current system.

Q. An opponent may dispel a Gut Magic spell in his own magic
phase as though it was a Remains in Play spell cast with a Power
level of 7. Can an opponent use excess dispel dice to attempt to dispel
Gut Magic spells in play at the end of the Ogre Kingdoms player's
subsequent magic phases? If yes, are the Gut Magic spells treatd[sic] as
Remains in Play spells cast with a Power level of 7? (p60)
A. Yes to all questions.

I think I would err on the conservative side and play them in the least advantageous manner. Talk it over with your opponent/TO to be safe. And yes, I have Ogres, so I am not trying to bone them over

(I never even thought of trying to play it that way before these posts, you cheesy gits )

It's just the way we interpreted it, it's quite amusing to have a group of bulls at toughness 8, strength 9 with regen.

Gut magic allows you to cast multiples of the same RiP spell.
The FAQ tells you to ignore the paragraph that prohibits you from casting multiple spells on the same unit.

Spells stack in 8th edition, so you can put several +1 strengths on a single unit, and your opponent would have to dispel each one individually.
It's not really all that great. Ogre wizards are very expensive, so spamming a buff spell isn't all that easy; it's actually easier to spam the dispelling of the RIP.
Stacking spells is the only thing that makes Gutmagic useful. It's far to easy for your opponent to dispel it on his own turn, leaving your unit high and dry for the ensuing combat.


-Matt

Oh, it's a solid question. Like I said, I never even thought about it that way, and see on other forums where they claim it works. *shrug*

Like I said, ask your opponent/TO, or avoid the whole situation and play them as RIP. It will help keep your (and your opponent's) sanity.

You know I read somewhere, and this miffed me.

Youre allowed to dispel all ogres buffs in the ogres magic phase with remaining dispel dice on a 7.

Cheers FAQ, so even if I roll a 9+2 from butcher, you can now let it through, save the disp dice and roll them at the END of ogres magic phase and only need a 7 to rid the buff.

( 's)

Only in further phases, as they are dispelled as if they are RIP. You cannot dispel the same phase.

Since they are not RiP spells, despite being dispelled as if they were (that statement itself further implies that they are -not- RiP...) They can stack up over turns. I don't think it is very easily achieved, however... since ogre spells are so easily dispelled. I have noticed that my opponents have a tendency to allow trollguts or toothcracker to go through, allowing my butcher to wound himself, and then tossing a couple dice at me on his turn, stripping the protections off the ogres before he blows them away with magic or shooting.

So be warned, stacking gut magic like that is a good way to load your butcher with self-inflicted wounds for potentially no advantage.

I stack my spells. It's the beauty of thowing regen on the unit with him in, and then afterwards use bloodgruel.
It's all good fun.

Nos, im sure its in the FAQ, that the opponent can dispel buffs with remaining dispel dice in the very same ogre magic phase on a 7.

That is only for following magic phases. You cannot dispel magic cast in the same phase EXCEPT at the "dispel" stage during casting.

If you disagree, please find it in the FAQ.

Gutmagic is NOT RiP so yes you can have multiples of the same gutmagic spell(potentially from the same butcher) on a single unit.

Gutmagic is dispelled like a RiP spell in following magic phases(but not the same phase as it was cast) at power level 7.

if there are multiple GM spells on a unit, they must be dispelled one at a time.


if a butcher attempts to cast the same spell another butcher already cast this phase the casting value goes up by 3.

but in the next turn the casting value drops back to 3, no matter how many Gutmagic spells are still up on the table.