Chaos Daemons Nurgle Host 1500 pts

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**MechaEmperor7000**

With the advent of GKs there's been quite a number of people selling off their Chaos Daemons, so I managed to snag myself a GUO. I've been slowly building up my 4 Powers of Chaos armies, starting with Khorne and then Tzeentch. Now seems like a good time to work on Nurgle. As always I'm aiming for damage dealers (which is gonna be hard, but Epidemius should help in that respect) since I play mainly Annhilation. My main opponents are Eldar and IG, so on average I should get my FnP save (the IG guy does not own a Demolisher or Basilisk).

HQ:

Great Unclean One - 160pts
Epidemius - 110pts

Troops:

Plaguebearers (35, divided into units as necessary) - 525pts

Heavy Support:

Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Noxious Touch, Wings, Iron Hide, Cloud of Flies, Daemonic Gaze - 245pts
Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Noxious Touch, Wings, Iron Hide, Cloud of Flies, Daemonic Gaze - 235pts
Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Noxious Touch, Wings, Iron Hide, Cloud of Flies, Daemonic Gaze - 235pts

A Noxious Prince with Wings seems like an awesome loadout for them, however the high cost of the wings are questionable to me (especially since I can get a grand total of 12 more plaguebearers for that cost) so I'm iffy on it. However a footslogger prince, even a EW T6 one, does not appeal to me. The GUO is something I love, so I wanna include it in some form in this list. What are people's thoughts on Ku'Gath? I can convert the GUO into Ku'Gath if he is indeed a better choice. The Plaguebearers are set at 35 intentionally, because it makes for 5 units of 7 (fluffy for Nurgle. This list is already a themed one, so practicality can take a back seat this time). Hopefully I can get some feedback soon, as I will likely be making purchases in the coming weeks and would like to know what to spend my money on. Thanks!

**Jackal**

If you want a serious impact i'd drop the basic GUO and grab ku'gath instead.
Granted he costs a fair bit more, but his ranged attack and extra stats really do add to it.

Also, keep in mind that in a tally list basic nurglings really can do alot of damage.
So might be worth taking a unit.

I'd change the cost of the princes too.
Different points for the same one.

Also, i'd try and add in breath to one of them.
The template really does cause alot of damage, which will all add to the tally.

35 plagues is pretty impressive, but until the tally builds, they are dead weight.
I'd drop them down to 2 units of 10 at the most in 1,500.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I've considered Nurglings, however the unit sizes are kinda small, so I might have to fill out with PBs eventually. Also, what are your thoughts on Wings? I still think they may be a deadweight, where the points can be better transfered somewhere else.

EDIT: One of the reasons I considered PBs was because I cna cheaply convert them from Bloodletters. Nurglings are bloody expensive >_<

**Jackal**

I usually run triple grinders in my list, but if im running princes it all depends really.

I'd never run 3 all with wings due to the insane points cost.
So i would cut the wings on 1 of them, and at the risk of being mauled by other posters, i'd drop a 2nd set too.

This free's up a decent amount of points.

Drop 15 plagues too and you have 345 points to play with.

In larger games i usually run a unit of beasts aswell.
They are there to simply soak up firepower to start with, but once the tally starts to build they can actually cause quite a bit of damage.

But anyway, 345 points to play with.

140 - Upgrade GUO to Ku'gath
117 - 9 bases of nurglings
60 - breath of chaos added to the unwinged princes.

28 points remaining.

Edit: Nurglings can be made pretty easily from GS mate.
I just go on a sculpting spree and make 30 or so at a time.
Thats then enough for 6 bases.

**The Bloodbearer**

I would probably drop Epidemius and have Ku'gath or a fully kitted out Great Unclean One. Also, I would suggest that you consider having a Soul Grinder or two. It gives more tank popping capability but also it's only 160pts and having a mix of these & Daemon Princes will make your army more survivable. They both have advantages and disadvantages, this should create a balance. Also the IG would get some lucky shots against a Daemon Prince, this is harder against a Soul Grinder, but I know the damage a bright lance can do. Like I said, you need to find a good balance.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I'm iffy on Grinders because they and their defiler counterparts never made back their points, while Daemon Princes always have (namely, I dont get gimped with a single brightlance or lascannon to the face, and my friends love to spam those two). Target saturation is another concern, as a single vehicle outside of a sea of EW MCs will definately be the first to go pop.

For the Princes, I was thinking of running all of them footslogging. This frees up a heafty 180 points for me to splurge on Nurglings and PBs. As for beasts, I've never heard good things about them. For HQ, I think both Ku'Gath and Epidemius are gonna stay, since they are pretty awesome for what they do (plus, Ku'Gath might be a big enough fire magnet long enough to get the non-FnP princes into position).

**Jackal**

Bloodbearer, i cant think of anything worse than dropping epi from the list.
The whole idea of a tally list is just that, use him to buff every unit in the army.

Ive usually run a full length game with ku'gath still alive at the end of it, so he is more than worth it.
Granted his combat is nothing amazing, but its still better than most.
the pie plate will do plenty of damage to anything it hits.
Breath will be used simply before you assault a unit.
Again, it will do alot of damage.

Grinders - this is why i run 3 of them most of the time.
I can throw both upgrades on all of them and they still come out cheaper than princes.
With that in mind, they can then drop AP3 pie plates, they have the harvester, a template weapon.
They also have fleet, making them faster than a basic prince.

Granted they will attract unwanted attention, but it means your plagues wont be getting hit with things that ignore FNP.
Princes get hammered by small arms and shrug off heavies.
Grinders get hammered by heavies and ignore small arms.

Its pretty much a trade off on this one.

Since ive been running 3 grinders (8 months or so now) ive never had a real problem with them earning back points.
Allways done thier job and usually i can get 1 to the end of the game.

At any rate, its just a case of personal pref. with princes vs grinders.

**MechaEmperor7000**

For the record my preference for Princes is based solely on the fact that my friends love their Anti-armour weapons (namely, I once got shot with 5 brightlances before my first turn came. needless to say I lost that one pretty badly. My IG friend also has two full HWS with Lascannons and a Leman Russ kitted with lascannons). Princes also help adds to the Tally, which is one of my main concerns.

Also, Jackal, do you have any tips for sculpting Nurglings? I tried once and got something that looked like those forest sprits from Princess Mononoko.

**Jackal**

Oh i agree, in a tally list daemon princes win out for tally building.
I also use princes if im running a mono tzeentch army, but i usually run a mixed khorne and slaanesh army with triple grinder.

Ill make some later on and make a tut for on here as i go.

But rough basics;

1: Roll out a small sausage of GS about 2-3mm thick.
cut it into about 5mm long pieces (2 of them)
Use a sharp blade to cut 3 little slits in the end (makes the toes)
Use the flat side of the blade to gently press on the very tips of them (makes the toenails)

2: The body is easy, just make a small blob of GS and place ontop of the feet.
Make sure the toes and a bit of each foot poke out under it.

3: Head is simple aswell.
Smaller blob of GS, place it ontop of the body section.

4: Make the arms the same as the feet but a little bit longer.
Pose them as you want.

5: Add detail where needed (face, boils, cuts etc)

Aslong as you have a sharp blade (all you will need to sculpt them) and keep water on it then you wont have any problems.
I usually make them ontop of a scrap piece of paper, so once they are dry i can just peel them off and glue to a base.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Taking into account your advice, here's the new list I've made:

HQ:

Ku'Gath The Plague Father - 300pts
Epidemius - 110pts

Troops:

Plaguebearers (20, divided into units as necessary) - 300pts
Nurglings (20, divided into units as necessary) - 260pts

Heavy Support:

Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Daemonic Gaze - 170pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Cloud of Flies, Daemonic Gaze - 175pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Cloud of Flies, Breath of Chaos - 185pts

I am somewhat considering going back to the basic GUO, as Ku'Gath is taking up a hefy amount of points which I can spend on more nurglings and Plaguebearers, which might do for more returns. Here's a modified list with a basic GUO:

HQ:

Great Unclean One - 160pts
Epidemius - 110pts

Troops:

Plaguebearers (21, divided into units as necessary) - 315pts
Nurglings (30, divided into units as necessary) - 390pts

Heavy Support:

Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Daemonic Gaze - 170pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Daemonic Gaze - 170pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Noxious Touch, Cloud of Flies, Breath of Chaos - 185pts

So, thoughts?

**Subcrazy**

The models in this current list are fine. I do think you may have too many nurglings even for a tally list but that depends on play style. Wings are a hefty point cost in most cases, but in a tally list you need the ability to get in there fast and start killing. The list in it's current state is incredibly slow and you can't really afford to not be up in their grill come turn 2. Test the list without wings just for kicks, but I'd recommend putting them back in the list at the expense of however many nurglings it takes.

**big baby jesus**

I'd drop Kugath - he's almost twice the cost of a base GUO which spews a free KP that cant hold objectives - no thanks.

A normal GUO w nades will suffice, you could use the points to add in some screamers for anti tank or a tzeentch herald on chariot.

Keep the princes - you need them to build up the tally - there the only thing in your army that doesnt strike last! Giving them breath of chaos is probably a good move.

**teh unforgiven**

How the

are you going to destroy tanks with this list???
Thats what winged DPs are made for.
In nurgle everything is slow and there is no anti-tank shooting, so you need something that can catch tanks and rip them apart

-unforgiven-

**MechaEmperor7000**

Keep in mind a few things: I've already said Objectives are null because we play almost exclusively annhilation. Plus it's a Nurgle Themed list, so no other units are allowed.

My friends dont run tanks that often, and if they do it's usually one parked in the rear. Four MCs should be able to take care of them pretty easily. I've read some articles and have opted to drop the Noxious touch from all the DPs and 5 Nurglings to give some of them Daemonic Strength for tank busting, as well as wings for the Breath Prince.

New modified list:

HQ:

Great Unclean One - 160pts
Epidemius - 110pts

Troops:

Plaguebearers (22, divided into units as necessary) - 330pts
Nurglings (25, divided into units as necessary) - 325pts

Heavy Support:

Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Daemonic Gaze - 160pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Daemonic Gaze - 160pts
Daemon Prince - MoN, Iron Hide, Daemonic Strength, Wings, Cloud of Flies, Breath of Chaos - 185pts

**BSent**

Personally I liked the oringal list more. To me the key to an Epidemus list is 2 things, Demon Princes and nurglings. No Soul Grinders are allowed. Only followers of nurgle can be used to increase the tally. Deamon Princes don't have to worry about Slow and Purposeful, and are close combat machines. They need to be kitted out. If you're able to get to the 20 kill mark, all your cheap little nuglings wound on 2+ and ignore armor saves. Then they have 3 wounds and 3 attacks base. That's just pure nasty.

To get that though you need winged demon princes with MoN. If you're thinkning of dropping something, drop deamonic gaze and cloud of flies. They need to get into assualt as quick as possible, or totherwise, you'll will have major problems trying to compete.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I could just drop Noxious Touch to upgrade their Gaze into Breath Of Chaos, and drop their flies entirely in the first list. This way they speed up, drop some Poisoned AP2 templates, and can possibly get Noxious anyways.

EDIT: The list would be:

HQ:

Great Unclean One - 160pts
Epidemius - 110pts

Troops:

Plaguebearers (20, divided into units as necessary) - 300pts
Nurglings (20, divided into units as necessary) - 260pts

Heavy Support:

Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Iron Hide, Breath of Chaos - 180pts
Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Wings, Cloud of Flies, Iron Hide, Breath of Chaos - 245pts
Daemon Prince - Mark of Nurgle, Wings, Cloud of Flies, Iron Hide, Breath of Chaos - 245pts