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So I was knocking around ideas for a small ~1000-1500 points all cav DE list, mostly based on max cold on knights. Something along the lines of 500 points of Knights, Sorc on dark steed, 250 points of dark riders at 1k. Not really a power list obviously, but it would be cool if it had a chance at small points levels.

Now, obviously the knights would be doing all the real killing, with the dark riders just putzing around flicking shots about and being sorc meat shields. So what I am wondering is just how good at the whole killing thing ARE cold one knights? They look fairly beefy, with just about the damage output of chaos knights, with a bit lower survivability at a good bit lower price. It seems like either a really big unit or two moderate units could be pretty scary at 1000 points, so long as they hit enemy units somewhat pulped by magic and shooting beforehand, especially if they can nab a flank.

Then again, cav is pretty questionable in 8th. So tell me, oh sages of Dakka, what say you on knights on lizards?

Cold One Knights can be great. A friend of mine used a unit of 10 of them in a 2400 points list a couple days ago and managed to wipe out an entire unit of Temple Guard with them. They were buffed by the Cauldron though.

Besides the Cauldron, the Lore of Shadow can also be great to support Cold One Knights. Dropping the opponent's Strength will make your Cold One Knights very difficult to deal with, dropping your opponent's Thoughness (or buffing your Cold One Knights with Okkam's Mindrazor) will help your Knights deal damage after the first round of combat.

If you are going for a single unit of Cold One Knights (fairly large) than you could look into a BSB with the Hydra Banner.

Just some ideas.

Personally prefer the Chariot, but knights are still decent.
They are a support unit though, by themselves they'd get stuck by steadfast. Have spears/corsairs/WE/BG on the front and have them flank/rear charge.

They are still good..especially with that banner which gives them a ward save...

I fight them often as they are a staple in my regular opponent's DE army. If they are withing the inspiring ld of the general as well as within the BSB radius of effect, they can actually absorb the charge of the enemy, although of course it is better if they do the charging....

Although they still have extreme difficulty handling the steam tank..but who doesn't?

Airmaniac wrote:Cold One Knights can be great. A friend of mine used a unit of 10 of them in a 2400 points list a couple days ago and managed to wipe out an entire unit of Temple Guard with them. They were buffed by the Cauldron though.

Besides the Cauldron, the Lore of Shadow can also be great to support Cold One Knights. Dropping the opponent's Strength will make your Cold One Knights very difficult to deal with, dropping your opponent's Thoughness (or buffing your Cold One Knights with Okkam's Mindrazor) will help your Knights deal damage after the first round of combat.

If you are going for a single unit of Cold One Knights (fairly large) than you could look into a BSB with the Hydra Banner.

Just some ideas.

Spearmen buffed by the cauldron, with mindrazor, or with a banner also kick ass.
All cav are support units, which makes it tough to evaluate them on their own.

-Matt

So, again, assuming I am NOT TAKING ANY INFANTRY, even at small points levels Coldone knights can't smash units the same way Chaos Knights can? Is that the general consensus?

You might consider a unit of shielded Dark Riders about 15 strong to provide at least some ranks. Have that hit the front of a unit, with COK in the flank, and you'll bust nearly anything at 1000 points.

Any reason not to put the COK in the front and the DR's on the flank? The DR seem like they could get there easier due to being fast cav, and would be less likely to be smeared.

Basically, without plopping down a list, I was thinking as many COK as 500 points would get, then all DRs and a mounted sorc at 1000. Sort of light on variety, but since all cav falls apart at pretty low points levels and up, I thought at 1k it would be worth trying.

Try to make your list a 1250 so you can have Mallus. The Cold one knights are not going to run through stuff like chaos knights do but you get almost twice as many.

After playing some DE this afternoon ... ... we chatted about how everything in the DE book is good, including stuff people don't take normally. Conclusion on COK is that they too are pretty sexy and hurt like hell, but they tend to be really expensive to get the job done right. That means not just a lot of them, but the proper magic banner (I actually like ASF on them, makes them mean even if charged), the proper character support (BSB most often, probably with the Loads of Attaks banner or simply fighty / survival gear of his own, to combo with the ASF banner), and cauldron backup if possible (because it's still balls out insane - seriously chaos warshrine, you have nothing on this).

My response to this: I like fighting COK, because often they aren't properly supported, which means they're just some T3 dudes in heavy armor, which is easy to strip off with the right attaks (skaven excel at no-armor-saves nonsense) or simply force to collapse through weight of dice.

It smells like you've still got all cav modeling shenanigans in mind, Wehr? You could pull something off no problem with all cav DE, no promises how good it would be though - driders fade and fire, COK get shot to hell and try to get their stab on ASAP, with magic where able. And for once the actual GW models (ok, not driders) are pretty sexy, kinda including the sorceress on CO too. Though there are always GameZone Preds ($33 a pop but meaty too) ...

- Salvage

Wehrkind wrote:Any reason not to put the COK in the front and the DR's on the flank? The DR seem like they could get there easier due to being fast cav, and would be less likely to be smeared.

To keep casualties among the more expensive COK down, of course!

One could do it the other way, of course.

Salvage: Yea, still knocking around ideas for a small model count army that is fairly flexibly maneuver wise. Plus, as you said, the COK models are really nice, and having left the DE army book in the bathroom I keep getting new ideas. Only all the ideas with 50+ models get shot down pretty quick

Vulcan: Gotcha, though isn't it a concern that the dark riders would be wiped out for more combat res, basically losing the fight for the COK who can't keep up?