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My wife bought some more things for her horde yesterday, and Im starting to see a pattern emerge. Shes focusing on filling out her spods with devourer guants, as well as a few carnifex in pods. She also started buying gargoyles as well. And Im seeing a pattern emerge. Shes obviously wanting to just kindda, spring up in my midsts and cause all kinds of hell. The group we play with here is mostly SMs, orks, necrons, chaos and Tau. Im basically wondering the pros and cons to her logic on this. We arnt competition players so I dont care about the effectiveness of that. Im mainly wondering how can a DS heavy nids list work against normal players of varying skill levels?

Shes also bugging me for a Tyrgon or 2 for her bday (dunno if shes thinking mawloc or not) Just thought Id toss that in there as well

I would help if I could, but I have no idea. Sorry.

Nids are bad, I always fight gunline I do not know anything about them.

Yes, they can work. Little pressed for time right now, but here are a couple general insights.

1) It takes a fairly reactive approach. Your plan will change depending if you have first or second turn and on how your reserve rolls go (both in terms of how much comes in and what comes in). Sometimes you'll drop aggressively, other times conservatively. Obviously, this takes some practice to develop the right feel.

2) I think she's off to a decent start in terms of units. I like devourer Gaunts in spores quite a bit. Haven't run fexes in spores, but I imagine the overall effect is pretty similar to tunnelling Trygons (+shooting, -close combat). The thing I've found with Trygons is that you need to run 3, at least at 1850. With 2, the chance is high that they'll enter in singles, and almost any army can drop a Trygon in a turn of shooting. Three big guys give you a good chance of getting 2 in the same turn, and that changes things quite a bit for your opponent. Spores and Trygons work very nicely together. Lots of safe drops, and spores can provide cover.

I think a winged Tyrant with Hive Commander is a must. And that allows you to use an outflanking Tervigon. Personally, I like two...one Terv in regular reserves, and one usually outflanking (that's the reactive part again). Haven't run Gargs yet, but I like them. One nice thing about them is that she doesn't always need to DS them. They have enough speed to be deployed in regular reserves, especially in Spearhead missions.

What are her plans for Elites?

3) If that sounds like a lot of expensive units, you're right. And that's why I think they work better at higher points levels. But yeah, I think they're normal-play competitive at 1850.

Got stuff to do, so I'm cutting it off there. Feel free to PM with any specific questions.

I too like/hate devguants. I hate them because holy cow, they pump out some shots. She stumbled on liking them from spods in the first game we played. She was surprised when she came down and nearly murder a whole mod of boyz with them.

The fex she varies on its loadout. Im trying to convince her to use the dakka fex (TL devourers on it) in a pod. Usually her fex is either fairly good, or fairly poor, Im hoping the amount of shots they get will convince her.

Shes liking the idea of how fast the gargoyles are, even though she isnt a fan of the flesh borer on them.


Elites shes been looking at genestealers for some time, and almost bought them (probably next time we go shopping) Other then that, Im not sure. Any suggestions?

Reserve based Nid lists can work, but they really took a hit with the FAQ. You need some reserve bonus to make them work and most of them got nerfed in the FAQ.

The Doom (well a Zoanthrope anyway) should definitely be on your shopping list. Its not that hard to kill, but man is it a pain for anything on foot.

A Flyrant with hive commander and TL devs, Zoeys in spods, toxic Stealers, possibly a tervigon using the outflank slot given by hive commander, Devilgants in spods, and Trygons (or spoded Carnis with devs if you prefer, trygons are cheaper and more survivable generably speaking). Balance it out to your taste/points level. On the gargoyles, I usually love em, but it's hard to get their timing right if you walk them on, and it's hard to get their placement right if you DS them. Not a fan of DoM, but once in awhile it can be a fun option.

Once you have the list, it's fairly plug and play if you are decent with target priority.

Here is a 2000 point list i played in a tournement once with pretty good success considering its style:

HQ - Tyrant - Paroxism and Lashwhip - 2x TL Devourers - Hive Commander - Wings. 285
EL - 2x Zoanthropes - Spod. 160
EL - 2x Zoanthropes - Spod. 160
EL- Doom of Malan’tai – spod – cluster spines -140
TR - 15x Termagants - 15x Devourers - Spod. 190
TR - 15x Termagants - 15x Devourers - Spod. 190
TR - 8x Stealers. 112
TR - 8x Stealers. 112

HV - Trygon - Adrenal Glands. 210
HV – Mawloc -170
HV – mawloc - 170
Tot. 1999


Thanks, Dave_Nz

Gargoyles are great when used correctly! They have the cheapest source of adrenal glands and toxin sacs (1pt per model) and with Blinding Venom, can be a threat to even bigger targets. My Boyfriend prefers to have them start on the board with his Flyrant, and act as a mobile shield.

Your wife shouldnt worry about their fleshborers, they are just the appetizer. When my boyfriend played them against his mate, a squad of 20 took down his keeper of secrets 2nd turn. now I don't remember the exact rolls he got, but just looking at averages:

20 gargoyles charge into keeper
6 die to keepers attacks
14 attack back
28 attacks hitting on 5's
9~ hit, of those 4 or so are auto-wounds
the other 5 roll to wound on 4+ poison
2 more
so the keeper is taking 6 saves
averaging 3 unsaved wounds

and that is a 160 point squad vs over 200 points (i dunno what upgrades his keeper of secrets had)

anyways in our game, he actually took 1 wound off with shooting before charging in, which was sorta lucky, so the keeper was dead, and it was really funny to see the look on the daemon players face

Also, if the flyrant had lashwhips you could pop him in there so that everything is attacking first!

The hardest part is if you DS in and they don't have synapse, you shouldn't rely on charging anything

The problem with starting gargs on the board with an all reserve list is you are giving the opponent one thing for them to focus all of their firepower on (two if you put the flyrant down as well), which means against a lot of lists, by turn two, they probably will have been shot off the board, having achieved nothing.

i run a DS/Reserves nid list.. at 2k .. it is fun as hell.. not exactally tournament list.. just fun . i got 2 squads of 20 devil gaunts.. that i like to drop places.. and just obliterate troops.. i use 2 groups of 2 zoans in spods as well as the doom of malan'tai.

Maelstrom808 wrote:The problem with starting gargs on the board with an all reserve list is you are giving the opponent one thing for them to focus all of their firepower on (two if you put the flyrant down as well), which means against a lot of lists, by turn two, they probably will have been shot off the board, having achieved nothing.

Well since your flyrant can't come in using a spore, you're either keeping him in reserve or starting him on the board, and he's a lot harder to find cover for to get across the board than the gargoyles. I've seen it work to have him start on, with the gargoyle shield and moving up behind cover; though either way the gargoyles serve the same purpose.

nublette wrote:Well since your flyrant can't come in using a spore, you're either keeping him in reserve or starting him on the board, and he's a lot harder to find cover for to get across the board than the gargoyles. I've seen it work to have him start on, with the gargoyle shield and moving up behind cover; though either way the gargoyles serve the same purpose.

My main list has dual flyrants with two units of screening gargs, so I am familiar with getting them across the board. All they have to do though is manage about 50% casualties on the gargs with anti-infantry (not hard to do ) and then the flyrant is going to be a lot more exposed to their AT fire, probably enough so to take him out. Now you've lost a 260+ point MC, a source of synapse, and your +1 bonus to reserves, which means the rest of your list is most likely going to be coming in even more piecemeal, making it that much easier to deal with...all this before they have had a chance to do anything.

In my opinion for an all-reserve list, you are better off dropping the gargs all together, and bringing the flyrant in via deep strike. He'll be more exposed on the turn he comes in, but unless your reserve rolls are utterly horrible, he'll have a lot more help on the board with him, and hopefully by the time the opponent's turn comes around, you will have neutralized a lot of the stuff that can hurt the flyrant.

2 Zoans in a spod are a fav of mine. Sure they are a suicide unit, but that 3++ makes them tricky to kill without your opponent expending resources desperately needed elsewhere on the battlefield.

Ymgral genestealers are wonderful too.

Just a quick side note on tyranid reserve tactics. When bringing in your reserves it pays to think about rolling for things with no mishap protection first (ie ravners, gargs) before things like trygons and spods, just so they have more room to avoid a mishap.

Wow, I didnt realize it, but my wife seems to have a knack for decent Nids build. Ill make sure she reads this thread, itll put a smile on her face. Thanks all