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Grey Knights 1500

HQ:

- Castellan Crow...150


Troops

- Purifier Squad...231 pts
-2x Psycannon
-3x Nemesis Force Halberd
-Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon and Psybolt Ammo


- Purifier Squad...234 pts
-2x Psycannon
-2x Nemesis Force Halberd
-1x Nemesis Daemon Hammer
-Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon and Psybolt Ammo


- Purifier Squad...231 pt
-2x Psycannon
-3x Nemesis Force Halberd
-Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon and Psybolt Ammo


- Purifier Squad...231 pts
-2x Psycannon
-3x Nemesis Force Halberd
-Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon and Psybolt Ammo

Heavy Support

- Nemesis Dreadknight...160
-2x Nemesis Doom Fist
-Heavy Incinerator

- Dreadnought...135 pts
-Twin Linked Autocannon x2
-Psybolt Ammo

- Dreadnought...135 pts
-Twin Linked Autocannon x2
-Psybolt Ammo

total = 1507 points.

C&C Appreciated

Looks Solid, Whats the purpose of the Dreadknight? DS and burn then Smash?

That does look pretty mean not going to lie. I would love to play against it!

I got a chance to play against the DreadKnights last night and they really are tough. Not sure if you could fit it, but those teleport things are pretty sick on them.

Thanks

Yeah, the Dreadknight will probably deepstrike, and kill some footsloggers with that heavy incinerator, and then use the daemon hammer/dccw to wreck some enemy tanks. I'm not sure, but if the dreadknight uses hammerhand wouldn't that be a str 14 daemon hammer?

IMO the razorbacks are too many points other than that, it looks quite solid.

necronsftw wrote:IMO the razorbacks are too many points other than that, it looks quite solid.

What other weapon would you give them? I like the TL Plasmagun and Lascannon cuz it gives you some extra antitank

SomaRukido wrote:Thanks

Yeah, the Dreadknight will probably deepstrike, and kill some footsloggers with that heavy incinerator, and then use the daemon hammer/dccw to wreck some enemy tanks. I'm not sure, but if the dreadknight uses hammerhand wouldn't that be a str 14 daemon hammer?

No, max strength is always 10.

But, you're 10 + 2d6 for being a monstrous creature...that should be enough.

Why does the Knight have a daemonhammer? You lose I4 just to have an extra stun ability and you have to pay a bit extra, not worth it imo

targetawg wrote:

SomaRukido wrote:Thanks

Yeah, the Dreadknight will probably deepstrike, and kill some footsloggers with that heavy incinerator, and then use the daemon hammer/dccw to wreck some enemy tanks. I'm not sure, but if the dreadknight uses hammerhand wouldn't that be a str 14 daemon hammer?

No, max strength is always 10.

But, you're 10 + 2d6 for being a monstrous creature...that should be enough.

yeah strength 10 is enough to kill just about everything
it would be strength 10 even without hammerhand though right?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

kenshin620 wrote:Why does the Knight have a daemonhammer? You lose I4 just to have an extra stun ability and you have to pay a bit extra, not worth it imo

Daemon hammer is only 10 points, and it says in the codex that the knight strikes at normal initiative with the daemon hammer, plus it can pretty much destroy every vehicle in the game

SomaRukido wrote:

targetawg wrote:

SomaRukido wrote:Thanks

Yeah, the Dreadknight will probably deepstrike, and kill some footsloggers with that heavy incinerator, and then use the daemon hammer/dccw to wreck some enemy tanks. I'm not sure, but if the dreadknight uses hammerhand wouldn't that be a str 14 daemon hammer?

No, max strength is always 10.

But, you're 10 + 2d6 for being a monstrous creature...that should be enough.

yeah strength 10 is enough to kill just about everything
it would be strength 10 even without hammerhand though right?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

kenshin620 wrote:Why does the Knight have a daemonhammer? You lose I4 just to have an extra stun ability and you have to pay a bit extra, not worth it imo

Daemon hammer is only 10 points, and it says in the codex that the knight strikes at normal initiative with the daemon hammer, plus it can pretty much destroy every vehicle in the game

His point is that you pay for the daemonhammer, and it's not even really any better.

Remember he comes armed with dreadnought close combat weapons: these already double his strength to the max (10). The hammer just provides an extra stun effect.

There's a bit of rules debate of whether a monstrous creature can use a dreadnought close combat weapon at the moment, however, it's a serious case of raw, and you can expect any TO/FAQ to reinforce this ruling. Ruling that a model can't use it's standard weapons would be a tad silly after all.

Paying 10 points in order to lose an attack, trading it for automatic vehicle stun, when you're pretty much going to kill any tank you hit anyways?

Fail.

Yeah, there doesn't seem to be a point in the hammer, really.

Luna Havoc wrote:Yeah, there doesn't seem to be a point in the hammer, really.

The FAQ will be interesting because one can assume the fists do not double STR (for various reasons, one being what would be the point of Hammerhand?). Logically, so the points makes sense, I anticipate the FAQ will give you the following options for your Dreadknights:

1) Doomfists - matched pair gives +1 attack, ignores armour saves, force weapon, does NOT double STR, strikes at I4.
2) Daemon Hammer - doubles STR, adds stun effect, ignores armour saves, force weapon, strikes at I4.
3) Greatsword - rerolls failed hits, wounds, armour penetration, ignores armour saves, force weapon, strikes at I4.
4) REALLY BIG NEMESIS HALBERD - ignores armour saves, force weapon, +2I.

(Well... maybe not #4.)

DoW

Well i like how the hammer looks, and its cheap lol, so im gonna keep it, i dont really have anything else to fill 10 points up with anyway

DogOfWar wrote:

Luna Havoc wrote:Yeah, there doesn't seem to be a point in the hammer, really.

The FAQ will be interesting because one can assume the fists do not double STR (for various reasons, one being what would be the point of Hammerhand?). Logically, so the points makes sense, I anticipate the FAQ will give you the following options for your Dreadknights:

1) Doomfists - matched pair gives +1 attack, ignores armour saves, force weapon, does NOT double STR, strikes at I4.
2) Daemon Hammer - doubles STR, adds stun effect, ignores armour saves, force weapon, strikes at I4.
3) Greatsword - rerolls failed hits, wounds, armour penetration, ignores armour saves, force weapon, strikes at I4.
4) REALLY BIG NEMESIS HALBERD - ignores armour saves, force weapon, +2I.

(Well... maybe not #4.)

DoW

I think your "one can assume" is the issue in your above post. Assuming the dreadnought close combat weapons the model comes with don't double it's strength, which is their entire purpose, is a pretty big leap. That may be the current RAW, but I think most people are fairly certain it'll get FAQ'd that they do double strength.

But, these are points best left to TO's or personal game groups to determine their ruling until an FAQ comes out.

True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

DoW

DogOfWar wrote:True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

DoW

technically its not minus one attack, it just stays at base attack


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On another note though, if i do take off the hammer, waht would i use the extra 10 points for? i could just as easily do -10, seeing as the list is 1t 1506 right now, and it would only go down to 1496.

Yeah dump the pointless Daemon Hammer you're paying points to become worse...

Why Las/plas on the Razorbacks? Given that everyone is totting multiple powerweapon attacks do you need the extra anti-heavy infantry fire? I'd say no. Given that you'll be going forward so the squads can use their psycannons and CC ability do you need the range on the solo LC? Again I'd say no. So why haven't you gone for the Psycannon back? Superior Anti-light to medium infantry and superior anti-tank and range matched to the squads you're transporting.

True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

If they bother FaQing it you'll still get the bonus attack, just like a dread with Seismic hammer and DCCW so you're paying 10 points for the auto-stun (still not worth it). You'll be double strength with 4 attacks unless you take the sword and then S6 with 4 attacks re-rolling everything.

FlingitNow wrote:Yeah dump the pointless Daemon Hammer you're paying points to become worse...

Why Las/plas on the Razorbacks? Given that everyone is totting multiple powerweapon attacks do you need the extra anti-heavy infantry fire? I'd say no. Given that you'll be going forward so the squads can use their psycannons and CC ability do you need the range on the solo LC? Again I'd say no. So why haven't you gone for the Psycannon back? Superior Anti-light to medium infantry and superior anti-tank and range matched to the squads you're transporting.

True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

If they bother FaQing it you'll still get the bonus attack, just like a dread with Seismic hammer and DCCW so you're paying 10 points for the auto-stun (still not worth it). You'll be double strength with 4 attacks unless you take the sword and then S6 with 4 attacks re-rolling everything.

If you're telling me to use psycannons on the razorback, its not a weapon option for them to take...i do las/plas because its two guns for the price of one twin linked gun, and is good anti tank or anti heavy infantry
i guess ill drop the daemonhammer on the knight, even though i still think it would be a pretty nice thing to have, and idk why everyone is against, the only downside to having it is not getting the bonus attack for being on the charge

Assault Cannon + Psybolt Ammo = Psycannon.

SomaRukido wrote:

FlingitNow wrote:Yeah dump the pointless Daemon Hammer you're paying points to become worse...

Why Las/plas on the Razorbacks? Given that everyone is totting multiple powerweapon attacks do you need the extra anti-heavy infantry fire? I'd say no. Given that you'll be going forward so the squads can use their psycannons and CC ability do you need the range on the solo LC? Again I'd say no. So why haven't you gone for the Psycannon back? Superior Anti-light to medium infantry and superior anti-tank and range matched to the squads you're transporting.

True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

If they bother FaQing it you'll still get the bonus attack, just like a dread with Seismic hammer and DCCW so you're paying 10 points for the auto-stun (still not worth it). You'll be double strength with 4 attacks unless you take the sword and then S6 with 4 attacks re-rolling everything.

If you're telling me to use psycannons on the razorback, its not a weapon option for them to take...i do las/plas because its two guns for the price of one twin linked gun, and is good anti tank or anti heavy infantry
i guess ill drop the daemonhammer on the knight, even though i still think it would be a pretty nice thing to have, and idk why everyone is against, the only downside to having it is not getting the bonus attack for being on the charge

The reason everyone is against it:

Nemsis Doomfist (Stock)
-Strength 10
-Force Weapon

Daemonhammer (10 points)
-Strength 10
-Force Weapon
-Auto stun
-1 LESS attack


So you pay 10 points to attack one less time...and get an auto stun. Id rather keep my extra attack.

Magister187 wrote:Assault Cannon + Psybolt Ammo = Psycannon.

ah ok i see
i still like the las/plas better, seems more tank killy to me,and its helped me out of a lot of situations, but ill try it both ways and see what i like better


Automatically Appended Next Post:

targetawg wrote:

SomaRukido wrote:

FlingitNow wrote:Yeah dump the pointless Daemon Hammer you're paying points to become worse...

Why Las/plas on the Razorbacks? Given that everyone is totting multiple powerweapon attacks do you need the extra anti-heavy infantry fire? I'd say no. Given that you'll be going forward so the squads can use their psycannons and CC ability do you need the range on the solo LC? Again I'd say no. So why haven't you gone for the Psycannon back? Superior Anti-light to medium infantry and superior anti-tank and range matched to the squads you're transporting.

True enough.

While GW isn't known for logic, a 10 point upgrade for something that grants the model -1 attack, and the ability to stun vehicles/cause models to strike at I1 next turn is a bit silly if it isn't the only way to also double the bearer's strength.

If they bother FaQing it you'll still get the bonus attack, just like a dread with Seismic hammer and DCCW so you're paying 10 points for the auto-stun (still not worth it). You'll be double strength with 4 attacks unless you take the sword and then S6 with 4 attacks re-rolling everything.

If you're telling me to use psycannons on the razorback, its not a weapon option for them to take...i do las/plas because its two guns for the price of one twin linked gun, and is good anti tank or anti heavy infantry
i guess ill drop the daemonhammer on the knight, even though i still think it would be a pretty nice thing to have, and idk why everyone is against, the only downside to having it is not getting the bonus attack for being on the charge

The reason everyone is against it:

Nemsis Doomfist (Stock)
-Strength 10
-Force Weapon

Daemonhammer (10 points)
-Strength 10
-Force Weapon
-Auto stun
-1 LESS attack


So you pay 10 points to attack one less time...and get an auto stun. Id rather keep my extra attack.

i suppose
auto stun would help with a lot of armies at my flgs though

auto stun would help with a lot of armies at my flgs though

Not really as with S10 and 2d6 armour pen you should wreck any tank you touch with 5 attacks (on the charge). Why pay points to make yourself worse (4 attacks with autostun is worse than 5 attacks)?

i still like the las/plas better, seems more tank killy to me,and its helped me out of a lot of situations, but ill try it both ways and see what i like better

Against AV14 1 Psycannon = 2.67 Lascannons. So against AV14 a Psycannonback is better than a Landraider Godhammer!! Still think your solo-untwinlinked Lascannon is more tank killy?

FlingitNow wrote:

auto stun would help with a lot of armies at my flgs though

Not really as with S10 and 2d6 armour pen you should wreck any tank you touch with 5 attacks (on the charge). Why pay points to make yourself worse (4 attacks with autostun is worse than 5 attacks)?

i still like the las/plas better, seems more tank killy to me,and its helped me out of a lot of situations, but ill try it both ways and see what i like better

Against AV14 1 Psycannon = 2.67 Lascannons. So against AV14 a Psycannonback is better than a Landraider Godhammer!! Still think your solo-untwinlinked Lascannon is more tank killy?

yeah ok i see your points, and they are good, i think i will change that lol

only problem with that is it puts on an extra 20 points, which puts me at 1516, so i need to shave off 10 - 15 points..would it be worth taking the daemon hammers off the purifier squads and just giving them halberds?
that would shave off 12 points, giving me 1503, but idk if its worth it

Possibly dump the dread Knight for another Psyfleman Dread that saves you 25 points.

FlingitNow wrote:Possibly dump the dread Knight for another Psyfleman Dread that saves you 25 points.

i n33d the dreadknight. It's so cool.
I would rather drop the daemon hammers in the purifier squads, but idk if thats a good idea like i said, plus if i drop 25 points ill need to add in another 10 :/

then just drop 3 NDHs rather than all of them.

I guess that would work

or drop all of them to 1 hammer and MC it