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Let's start out by saying this is my first list idk what I'm doing or even how to play I am literally trying to find a quarter in warehouse


Ok here we go
Siege is my "leader" +5

Jacks
-Light:
Hunter -6
-Heavy:
Defender -9

Troops
Stormblade -5
stormgunner -1

Black 13th -4

I think this is 20points let me know what you think! Also I'm looking to be competitive and shooty with melee capabilities
Thanks in advance!

Siege is good sturdy caster to get into the game. Defender is a good jack for him, but he doesn't give hunter anything. If you check siege's feat and hunters armor piercing you'll notice that the have exact same effect and it doesn't stack. Therefore I would suggest you to switch the hunter to charger. That gives you 2 more points to play with, and these can go to Reinholdt, who gives Siege one extra attack with the rocket gun.

Black 13th is great unit, but I would consider the Stormblades a bit. They hit hard but are pretty vulnerable on the way to the enemy and I would not run them without UA, especially with Siege as during the feat turn the assault order brings carnage if you can pull it off.

20 points is so small game size that you cannot fit everything to list and your choices are all good units, some of the things I would look into in addition to what you have selected are squire and rangers both of which would buff the strenghts of Siege.

Metsuri's suggestions are solid. If you drop the Black 13th and Hunter, that gives you 10 points to play with. I would go Charger, Reinholt, Squire, Stormblade UA.

Also you don't need to break your lists down to lights/heavies, infantry etc. Something like this:

Caster Name +pts
Jack/Beast 1
Jack/Beast 2, etc.
Units/Solos

If you have a 'Jack Marshal note it in the list.

agreed on all suggestions. Chargers are excellent jacks for siege as he can make their guns have a 3in AOE. He also can cover infantry on the approach or cover a block of longgunners from retaliation.

The defender is critical for him as well, because you need a real heavy hitter to maximize his feat. An AP boosted defender shot will reek havoc on enemy warcasters, and it makes assassinations with siege easy.

Also, reinholdt should be an auto include for siege as he has one of the more powerful ranged weapons with excellent range.

KingKodo wrote:
The defender is critical for him as well, because you need a real heavy hitter to maximize his feat. An AP boosted defender shot will reek havoc on enemy warcasters, and it makes assassinations with siege easy

I don't know if its an auto include. You can build Seige to turtle in a corner but then you run into Gators and can't do a thing about them, balance in the key with Cygnar.

Ok some solid advice thanks.
Now for my return questions

What's UA and how do i give it to stormblades

As for the charger I read the special rules for that aoe thing and it's not the charger it's trencher infantry that get it.

What's reinholdt?

Neroku wrote:
What's UA and how do i give it to stormblades

UA means Unit Attachment. Its typically an officer and substandard for units. It gives the unit added bonuses. In this case it gives them the Assault (Order) and 3" AOE shots. It costs 3 points for Stormblades

As for the charger I read the special rules for that aoe thing and it's not the charger it's trencher infantry that get it.

Explosivo makes the model it targets attack magical (it can't affect an entire unit, just the specific model). The Charge does not get an AOE because its normal shot isn't an AOE.

What's reinholdt?

Its a matter of who not what. Reinholt is one of the best one point solos in the game. He has 3 *actions that he can use. The most important out of these for Siege is Reload which gives him an additional shot regardless of ROF.

I don't know how your mates do it, but 15-25-35-50 are the most used points, I've never played 20 my self. Can't give much advice since I don't player Cygnar. All I know is that I saw a hammersmith smash a megalith to pieces this weekend. It was good.

Casper wrote:

Its a matter of who not what. Reinholt is one of the best one point solos in the game. He has 3 *actions that he can use. The most important out of these for Siege is Reload which gives him an additional shot regardless of ROF.

He seems to sound interesting on paper... for some reason no one in my flgs would field him.

djphranq wrote:

Casper wrote:

Its a matter of who not what. Reinholt is one of the best one point solos in the game. He has 3 *actions that he can use. The most important out of these for Siege is Reload which gives him an additional shot regardless of ROF.

He seems to sound interesting on paper... for some reason no one in my flgs would field him.

how is your meta djphranq? any Cygnar or Khador ?
Is there a large number of caster from these faction that prefer to perform ranged attack rather than meele?
Reinholdt is THE best solo companion for ranged caster, like Siege simply because you can get one more shot and miniature SnP from him
But he is too squishy to have near the front line (hence why many Khadoran doesn't use him, Well except for Strakhov )

Retrias wrote:

djphranq wrote:

Casper wrote:

Its a matter of who not what. Reinholt is one of the best one point solos in the game. He has 3 *actions that he can use. The most important out of these for Siege is Reload which gives him an additional shot regardless of ROF.

He seems to sound interesting on paper... for some reason no one in my flgs would field him.

how is your meta djphranq? any Cygnar or Khador ?
Is there a large number of caster from these faction that prefer to perform ranged attack rather than meele?
Reinholdt is THE best solo companion for ranged caster, like Siege simply because you can get one more shot and miniature SnP from him
But he is too squishy to have near the front line (hence why many Khadoran doesn't use him, Well except for Strakhov )

Last time I played most everyone was playing Horde armies... but that was a couple years ago. I'm not sure what gets run alot now. One Cygnar player (mostly plays trolls now) would opt for eStryker who I think is mostly good for melee. Another trolls player on Occasion would bring his Khador. His casters were mostly melee... I forget what he would use... I think he got eButcher in there as well as eVlad. There was one girl who used to really dig the Cygnar caster on a horse... I think that guy was kind of ranged right? I, as a Khador player, would opt for melee for my casters (eButcher, pButcher, eSorscha, pSorscha, pVlad)... I'm wondering if it would have been better for me to use the Sorschas as mostly ranged.

Hence total lack of reinholdt, your meta prefer melee
Khador is mostly meele, our ranged option is decent and mostly AOE. I can't see Sorcha playing ranged much by herself actually. You should try the WG deathstar if you want to play ranged

Neroku wrote:Ok some solid advice thanks.
Now for my return questions

What's UA and how do i give it to stormblades

As for the charger I read the special rules for that aoe thing and it's not the charger it's trencher infantry that get it.

What's reinholdt?

Here are links to the battlecollege's pages for Stormblade UA and Reinholdt.

Reinholdt is really great one point investment and an excellent model to boot. He is great with Siege and Sloan with those two the battlegroup should include him without a question.


And as Casper said Siege has a spell explosivo that makes the target's next attack magical and if it doesn't have AoE it gains 3" AoE.

Have you bought the rulebook? Read it first, then make a list

Metsuri wrote:
And as Casper said Siege has a spell explosivo that makes the target's next attack magical and if it doesn't have AoE it gains 3" AoE.

I said it does not get AOE.

Here is the exact rule for Explosivo

When target friendly model makes a normal attack with a non-spray ranged weapon, the weapon gains magical weapon. IF the weapon was AOE - it becomes AOE 3. An affected model cannont participate in a combinded ranged attack. Models in the AOE other than the model that was directly hit suffer blast damage but do not suffer any other effects of the attack. Explosivo expires immediatly after resolving this model's next ranged attack. Explosivo lasts for one turn.

Its fairly clear in the rules that if your gun its AOE, then your shot becomes AOE 3. If your gun is not AOE then you don't get an AOE.

Casper wrote:

Metsuri wrote:
And as Casper said Siege has a spell explosivo that makes the target's next attack magical and if it doesn't have AoE it gains 3" AoE.

I said it does not get AOE.

Here is the exact rule for Explosivo

When target friendly model makes a normal attack with a non-spray ranged weapon, the weapon gains magical weapon. IF the weapon was AOE - it becomes AOE 3..

And there you are interpreting this rule wrong. What it says is that if the weapon was AoE - (minus or hyphen) it becomes A0E 3. See what is listed with weapons that don't have AOE, they have - character in the column. The explosivo spell gives the weapon in question AoE 3". That's why it is great especially on the Siege's Feat turn.

Ok I picked up all the books and cards so here goes 25pts.

Siege -5
Charger +4
charger +4
defender +9
Black 13th +4
Stormblade +5
Officer and standard +3
Reinholdt +1

How does this look?

You are doing fine really
What is the StormBlades doing there though? They benefit little from siege, I would probably replaced them with an 8 point meele jack, just because I don't want to end up playing Gator "I put water everywhere" where shooting would be made useless

What does water do? Also I have them in there cuz they are strong with jack marshal and a good ranged attack with a better melee! What close range should I get? Lancer for 6, ironclad for 7, hammer for 8 or something else? If I go for a lesser then 8pt 1 what should I spend the extra on?

HammerSmith is my choice really, most killy of them all

What you want to loom at is not only water, but the Barnabas spell
Swamp pit
It drop shallow water, and model is the shallow water can't be shot/targetted by ranged attack

The stormblades benefit a lot from Siege, they kill infantry like nothing on the feat turn with their assault and 3" AoEs.

The one problem that I spot right out of the list you posted Neroku is that Siege has two Chargers. He really doesn't have the focus to run two, often he can only spare one or two focus per turn to his jacks and charger would like to have at least 2 for itself. Drop the other charger and put Squire and something else maybe 2 stormgunners for the stormblades to fill the points.

What do you guys think about the journeyman warcaster? Its 1 point more then the squire but gives 3 extra focus a turn? I take out the charger add in the J.W. And 1 stormgunner? That way I can give the points to the charger and use all of sieges on himself or toss 1 to the defender?

JWC is great addition to cygnar, he has three focus and arcane shield. The problem with him is that his control area is small and therefore he often gets too close to action and he really cannot take a hit. Therefore it is often best to give him shooty jacks so that he can stay out of trouble and upkeep the AS while feeding 2 focus to the hunter, grenadier or charger he is controlling.

What JWC brings to Siege? He can give AS to key jack or unit to help with their survivability and then control one additional jack. That jack cannot use Siege's mage sight (Siege's battlegroup only benefits), so you'll loose some of Siege's power with this set up. Try it out as JWC is one of the signature pieces of Cygnar, I would say that Siege gets more out of Squire, but that is dependent on the play style so try it out.

Metsuri wrote:

Casper wrote:

Metsuri wrote:
And as Casper said Siege has a spell explosivo that makes the target's next attack magical and if it doesn't have AoE it gains 3" AoE.

I said it does not get AOE.

Here is the exact rule for Explosivo

When target friendly model makes a normal attack with a non-spray ranged weapon, the weapon gains magical weapon. IF the weapon was AOE - it becomes AOE 3..

And there you are interpreting this rule wrong. What it says is that if the weapon was AoE - (minus or hyphen) it becomes A0E 3. See what is listed with weapons that don't have AOE, they have - character in the column. The explosivo spell gives the weapon in question AoE 3". That's why it is great especially on the Siege's Feat turn.

This.

How would a weapon with a "-" for it's AOE have an AOE anyways? That just wouldnt make any sense.

What makes it so nice is that the charger gets two boosted shots for three focus, add another and you get two boosted AOE 3 shots, but the damage rolls on the models that are not directly hit arent boosted (I dont think anyway).

This is exactly right. Any Ranged weapon with a hyphen in its stats simply means that it has no AoE, thus any ranged weapon can benefit from siege's spell. Also in regards to one point solos...well this is mostly for Khador, but Wardog.

Wardog.... the best one point anyone would ever spent

So if I take a jwc I get more points for another jack? I don't get that. Can I take him with out a jack under him? And if I take him without a jack can I give the 3 focus to anyone? I'm confused lol!

The JWC does not give you more points to spend on jacks.

You can take him without a jack under him, but his skills would be wasted if you did IMHO.

He can only allocate focus to members of his battlegroup I.E. Jacks that he is controlling, but he cannot allocate focus to jacks outside of his battlegroup.

Just think of him as a mini warcaster, he "behaves" jacks exactly the same as a warcaster does.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
My buddy fields a hunter with his JWC most of the time, and gives siege a charger or defender (depending on the game).

The hunter is a very efficient jack and has an extended control range, so it works very well with the journeyman.

Ok that I didn't know exactly what I was wondering. I can't alocate focus to my warcaster from my jwc right? Or vise versa


What does wardog do? No 1 in my area has a merc book for me to look up these guys. I found out what reinholt does cuz 1 of my friends has his card

To your first question: No, the warcaster and the JWC cannot trade focus, although it would be awesome if they could.

The war dog is a 1pt khador warcaster attachment. It actually has pretty good stats considering it is only 1 point. It has health and toughness as well, so it can be a bit of a pain to kill.

As far as it's abilities - it grants a whole bunch of defensive buffs to the warcaster, so long as the dog is nearby. These buffs include things like: cannot be targeted by free strikes, a DEF bonus to melee attacks, to name a few.

The dog also has counter charge that lets it charge a model that moves too close to it and it can return to it's warcaster after a charge. Really nifty model that WILL save your warcaster at least a few times. Opponent's often forget that it has counter charge and thus, have their assassination run ruined by the little 1 point pup.