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I'm trying to build a WoC army for a tournament and would like some input on several things...

I am new to Ed8 but not new to warhammer, but i still have a few questions...

Tzeentch on a disc with available wards, enchanted shield is hardiest but a Death sorc seems more interesting and deadly and useful against characters and units that annoy me and grind warriors like steamtanks - purple sun against low initiative foes is ferocious and horrifying with the right rolls...I gave the sorc spell familiar, armour of destiny, and necrotic phylactery to protect the sorc 5+/4+ and he has performed great - I actually stick him in the front corner of a nurgle halberd unit with banner of rage

so Death or Tzeentch?

I have included 6 dogs and 5 marauder horsemen with axe and shield (no good reason for shield, just had models and 5points) for vanguard/fast cavalry duties? after experiencing goblin fanatics bursting through all three warrior units I don't think I'll be leaving home without these guys. but I have mixed feelings about including them - I have won 3 straight 2500 pt. battle against HE, DE and O&G, but I think I need the deployment drops and the speed

How do Chaos players use these 2 units to effect in 8th ed.?

Finally with only 2 full units of warriors painted for an upcoming tournamnet I guess I have to babysit trolls. No problem, but with the hellcannon that makes two random units I have a question for chaos players?

How do you feel about the hellcannon and its random behavior? Is it worth the points or too big a headache? When I get my last unit of warriors put together and painted I may abandon it all together, either that or add a second one. What say you, followers of the dark gods?

Nurgle lvl2 is pretty cool because you can snipe guys with their standard spell.

Mot with amulet of preservation and some shieldness is pretty hard to kill.

Give marauders flails because they give you more str first turn of combat mok always good.

I dont use hounds or marauders atm because well its warriors are cool

Hellcannon is a beast amazing love it nothing better unless you are doing chosen star in which case you may not be able to fit it in because of war shines.

Hm. Well, first, I'll point out that we're trying to use correct grammar as much as possible. Easy reading and all that.

Death was considered a "meh" lore until late. Purple Sun is da' Big One, since it not only annihilates a lot of good stuff, but refills your pool.

Fire is a great secondary Lore, with stripping Regen and whatnot.

Tzeentch is great for Pandemonium. And no one fears anything like Infernal Gateway. Except, of course, Purple Sun.

If you want character-sniping, go Lore of Death. If it's a lvl2, I'd suggest Lore of Fire, Tzeentch, or maybe Slannesh. Really, it comes down to this:

- Purple Sun is better than Gateway, so take a look at the other spells. Some of the Death spells are almost worthless, but not many. Whichever seems more useful overall is something I'd consider.

As for hounds and Marauder Horsemen: don't put a Mark on 5 measly dudes. They both are great distractions, where the horsemen are much more versatile. If you're just lookin' for a way to get some crap out there fast, the dogs are the way to go.

The Hellcannon is...amazing. When it shoots, it's devastating. When it charges, it's even better.

Oh, one more thing: Mark of Nurgle is a waste of points with the FaQ.

Oh, one more thing: Mark of Nurgle is a waste of points with the FaQ.

Is -1 BS and -1 WS on opposing units not useful to a halberd wiedling banner frenzied pack of Nurgle warriors? Oh, also gave death sorc ironcurse icon to help unit - realize it's a little dicey to put lvl 4 6dice death worhiping wizard in expensive warrior units but everybody has to be somewhere and my big marauder units aren't finished yet.

Anyway, thanks for input - starting to get a handle on things, always played Khorne in the 7th ed universe, but things have changed

If you are worried take a support caster with infernal puppet it can save you and make the other guy blow up bigger bang there goes half his squad.

Yes purple sun is a mean mean spell I have seen it go down an empire line lets just say that they were not too happy about that but then again infernal gateway lets you get away with casting nurgles signature spell for 5+ because everyone saves the dice to stop infernal gateway so over all good times lore of nurgle also really nasty the minus 1 str and toughness can make units weaker and even make them disappear because everyone saves dice to stop gate way oh good times


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nurlge is over priced it helps a little but I would prefer the extra attack or the extra ward save

For the points you spend on the Mark of Nurgle:

Against WS/BS3 and lower: you reduce your wounds by 16%.
Against WS/BS4-5: no chance.
Against WS/BS6: reduce wounds by 16%
Against WS7 and up: no chance.

Compare that to the cheaper Mark of Tzeentch:

- reduce all wounds (caused by missile attacks, CC attacks, magic, and war machines) by 16%.

And it's cheaper.

thanks for the explanation - good mathhammer. so ironcurse icon on unit character and MoT on unit sounds superior. Shields on halberd warriors in this build - are they useful or should I put the points toward dogs - assuming this build has 6+ ward overall and 5+ against warmachines?

I like shields on halberd warriors, just because the extra point per man is so small compared to the cost of the model that if you save 1-2 from early deaths you pay for the shields. If you are going to run LOTS of warriors I could maybe see skimping, but I for instance run one unit of 18, so it attracts a lot of fire, and that +1 armor often is the difference between no save and getting a chance to keep them alive. Saving one out of six is still pretty cost effective.

I am a fan of Shadow magic on my Sorcerer Lord. Gives roughly the mobility of a Disc with the access to a variety of useful and deadly spells.

I do also love Lore of Tzeentch, the 3+ ward and disc you can easily get (and obviously the awesome spells) are incredibly useful.

I love to use the lore of heaven on the warriors, you get some nice offensive magics and you gotta love those buffs and debuffs (rerolls).
plus there is nothing more fun to see your opponents army trying to scramble away from a boosted comet that's about to hammer down on their lines.
Btw can anyone tell me what the faq says about mon please.

I know i'm late to the party but yes, mon got a huge nerf this Ed: it technically reduces your wounds taken even less as it modifies to hit which then must be modified to wound: but even being generous I'm glad you got the point
although it does absolutely SMASH ogres lol

MoN:
1. used to be -1to hit unit
2. Then turned into opponent got -1ws or -1bs if attacking or attacked by mon.
3. Was eratta'd to be opponent gets -1ws/-1bs if attacking, but not when attacked

MoN is totally viable and not worthless as advertised, But to make this work you have to take lore of shadows on 2 lords + the book of secrets and work the signature spell for the -ws.
and anything you can get on the board to cause fear/terror.

nothing annoys a player like his big unit of doom missing a fear check and not swinging at all, and if they are ItP, lore of shadow their WS to 1, then MoN = WS 0.


it is one of those things where you have to think outside the box to make work, and a little bit of skill.

Totally viable is probably a bit of an exaggeration. If you need to take two lord level casters with shadow to make it work, well, what doesn't work then?

Not to mention the fact there is still debate as to whether WS0 means you can't attack or only hit on 6's. I think it means you can't attack, but that's not nearly universal.

MoN isn't a complete waste of points, but honestly in so far as it works on warriors etc. it is only because Warriors are that good, and can soak a 30 point bonus that doesn't do much without losing enough efficiency to make them bad.

Lore of Nurgle is pretty cool though, so I would definitely consider taking MoN on sorcs.

my MoN went 2-2-2 at ard boys last year wining prelims, and 4th in semis. but getting your opponent to WS0 only happened about 1/game so overall i dont think its completely viable.

my improved list this year is 3-0-0 so far we will see what i do in the semis'