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Hello everyone,

I've recently begun to get into 40k, and I chose Chaos as my starting army. So far I have 5 CSM, 5 terminators, and a Chaos Lord. I'm really not sure what my next steps should be, but I'm thinking zerkers/rhino/plague. Is there any advice that you can give a n00b such as myself in terms of starting a Chaos army? I've heard that Chaos is the weakest army, and that I should stay away. Is this true?

Anyways, any feedback is greatly appreciated and I'm glad to be on the forums.

Thanks

To get a legal force you'll need to get another troop option. Berserkers and Plague marines are the best two options other than normal chaos marines. Which one you want depends on what army you want, berserkers for an assaulty army and plague marines for a shooty army, whichever one you pick a rhino would be good to go with them.

Chaos aren't the weakest army at all, they're weaker than they were with their last codex but they can still compete.

Thanks! I think I'm going to go with both plague and zerker...and a rhino. That's what I thought. Pretty sure I was just getting trolled.

Those are good troops choices.

Oh, and HERETIC! Traitor! Foul servant of chaos!

Plague marines are amazing for their point cost. Defensive grenades, T5, CCW + Pistol + Bolter, etc...

Don't let anyone tell you chaos isn't competitive or is the weakest codex. It's not the king of them all like it once was, but it's still competitive for sure.

Agreed. CSM may be lagging a bit compared to the uber "competitive" (usually meaning they have units that do more for less points) armies, but if you look beyond the little IG/SW/BA club, they are quite menacing.

As people said, focus on your troops first. Plague Marines are often used in teams of 7 (fewer than that and they lack firepower and numbers to last, more than that and it gets a bit expensive). Khorne berserkers usually go in teams of 8 (nice point-cost package, enough to churn out lots of attacks). You should get rhinos for each troop squad you want to use.

A big part of the game now is opening transports so you can kill the enemies riding inside. Chaos has a few options here:

-Meltaguns on all infantry that can take them (chaos marines, plague marines). Drive in close with a rhino, disembark, fire from up close. Leaves you vulnerable to being charged, though.

-Predator tank with lascannon sponsons: These can put out a lot of S9 fire at long range, but they are usually eclipsed by the other heavy choices in the chaos army, such as....

-Obliterators: people sound like broken records pimping these guys, but they have lots of advantages. You can put them in cover (giving them a save against lascannons and other heavy weapons that can insta-kill them) and fire lascannons, multimeltas, plasma cannons and guns: whichever you need. They are lethal at varying ranges. They are slow but can move a bit and still fire anything. They have a low number of shots compared to their point cost, however, and they are quite expensive.

-Chaos Havoks: Few people use them, but those that do love them. They let you spam heavy weapons for a moderate cost; however, you can't fire on the move, and sometimes you'll just bring the wrong weapon for each situation. The models are also metal and hard to get with the weapon you want, though.

-Chosen: a very flexible elite slot. There are no models for them; people just use regular chaos marines with nifty guns and cooler painjobs. They can choose a ridiculous number of special weapons and outflank (coming in from the sides in the middle fo the game, even in their rhino!). The most popular pick is 5 of them in a rhino with 5 meltaguns, though some people go 3 meltas/2flamers to give them some anti-infantry power. Used right, they can wreck almost any vehicle in the game, but they are a bit of a suicide unit.

-Termicide: Chaos can get Terminators in units of 3 for a cheap price. Spent 15 point and give them 3 combi-meltas. Then you can deep-strike them behind an important enemy vehicle and five 3 melta shots in the vulnerable rear armor from 6 inches or less away, netting you that sweet 8+2d6 penetration roll. Also a suicide unit, but if you destroy something important and expensive, they are worth it.
-

Wow, thanks for the great information.

Seems like there is a lot to know, but I'm extremely grateful for all the input so far. This hobby has a pretty steep learning curve....

I think I'm going to grab a Daemon Prince as well because I heard it wrecks. I'm definitely going to grab Obliterators, as I have had everyone telling me how amazing they are. I'm probably going to use Nurgle as my mark...I've heard that it is about the best God to worship.

Daemon Princes are commonly taken with a Lash of Submission (marked Slaanesh with wings). You may be better off to start with a Sorceror marked Slaanesh until you learn the basics of playing the game, simply so he has some survivability-I feel like monsterous creatures are not simply "point and click" options-they need to be used in addition to other units/troops and they may not be the easiest place to start. So I'd say go with a Sorc of Slaanesh and get used to using Lash appropriately-remember, math-hammer states you will move your opponents unit ~7 inches. Until you get used to how the Lash works you don't want to chance leaving your prince's butt flapping in the wind-he can't join units and a sorc can. So give that a try first and add the Prince when you feel you're ready. Good luck

Anavrin wrote:Don't let anyone tell you chaos isn't competitive or is the weakest codex. It's not the king of them all like it once was, but it's still competitive for sure.

I don't think anyone says it's the weakest dex. The trouble is a lot of it's options are way outclassed by similar items in newer imperial 'dexs.

Chaos preds can't hold their own against any imperial marine pred
Havocs can't hold their own against long fangs
CSMs can't hold their own against grey hunters, but thats because grey hunters are ridiculous
Their elite choses are all fairly unimpressive
Their fast choices are generally unimpressive

They have a couple of things that are still very good. You can still make a competative army, but 1/2 - 2/3 of the book is not competative, which means as a whole the army is not as flexible or "competative" as the 5th ed books.

I still love them, I have quite a few myself. But good builds only have a few different unit types which is frustrating for how characterful the army could be.

Yiffstar wrote:Wow, thanks for the great information.

Seems like there is a lot to know, but I'm extremely grateful for all the input so far. This hobby has a pretty steep learning curve....

I think I'm going to grab a Daemon Prince as well because I heard it wrecks. I'm definitely going to grab Obliterators, as I have had everyone telling me how amazing they are. I'm probably going to use Nurgle as my mark...I've heard that it is about the best God to worship.

Don't worry. You'll learn a lot quickly once you have a few games under your belt and read a few battle reports. If you can, try to borrow a friend's army for a small game to get a feel for shooting, assaulting and etc.

Daemon Princes are good HQ options because they are cheap, killy and can't be instant-killed. However, they also can't be put inside a squad to protect them. I like Nurgle Princes a lot: they laugh at most small-arms fire. Give them wings for a 12' movement and Warptime and they -will- hit a kill a lot. Also, you can cast Warptime during your turn -and- the opponent's!

A basic in this game is to always know what you want a unit to do, and to try to have some redundancy ( multiple units that can do the same thing). For instance: Plague marines excel at defensive jobs, but being able to take 2 meltaguns with a small unit size, they can try to pop tanks if your oblits fail. Khorne Berserkers are assault specialists, but with a Power Fist on the champion they can pop many light vehicles, and with 3 plasma pistols (though this is expensive) they can do some nasty shooting against terminators and monsters from up close.

I say stay away from Rhinos,

anything can pick them off from a distance including heavy bolters, auto cannons etc

Aso whats with your username?

yiffstar?

Sheesh like we need more furries -________-

at least you're not playing space wolves

Well, I started with a terminator lord and two basic CSM squads and a Rhino. Then I got plague marines, termies, obliterators, daemon prince (mark of tzeentch, powers and wings) and vindicator.
Both berzerkers and plagues are great, just depends on if you want to theme your army or not. Myself, I'm IW orinted by Death Guard too, and I'm taking some slaaneshi things too ^^

Welcome to chaos! At least you're not running ultramarines (too) -.-

Yeah I'm hoping to have about 500 point army sometime next week...won't be fully painted though! I am going to head to some local retailers and see if there is anyone that wants to stomp my head in. Like mentioned above, it'll help me learn a lot.

Thanks for the warm welcomes and I'm glad to be part of Chaos. The advice is great and I'm glad there is a good community to help noobs like me.

And my name, WELL I also play WoW, and I have a worgen named Yiffstar. It's a joke name, but it grew on me. Not a furry....sorry folks!

ArtfcllyFlvrd wrote:I don't think anyone says it's the weakest dex.

Thread starter has apparently had people say it to him, which is why I mentioned it.

2xbezerkers in rhinos, fisty champ and no other upgrades
2x 10 man csm squad, 2xmelta
2x2 oblits

is a very good basis force

If you want - go plagues for holding objectives. They dont kill much in combat, and units with power weapons can go through them like butter.

For their points my fave DP is the beat stick: Khorne + Wings. 140 points of cheap killyness, that can either go forward as a distraction (generally the same weapons that would kill your rhinos want to kill your DPs) or stick around threatening outflankers.

I prefer regular CSM over their cult versions - they are cheaper so you can put more of them on the table for the same cost.

My favorite combination however is winged DP + MoN, with a "bodyguard" of 5 raptors with 2 meltas. The raptors act as a charge sheild and pop vehicles so that the DP can charge the squishy content.

I run 2 of these combinations and they are great, especially on very cluttered boards as they can hide behind scenery, hop over buildings and hills etc, moves that some people do not expect.

The MoN makes a hard to kill model even harder to kill as well.

SilverMK2 wrote:I prefer regular CSM over their cult versions - they are cheaper so you can put more of them on the table for the same cost.

My CSM have surprised me on occasion, but I usually prefer cult troops. Regular CSM are not fearless and don't have "And They Shall Know No Fear", so they -will- run if they get shot up by Long Fangs or charged by CC specialists, and keep going right off the board. Also, you need a full 10 to get the 2 special weapons, so plague marines actually bring more for less on that front with added survivability.

I love the idea of a small Raptor wing guarding the Prince and popping transports for him, though. If only I had the point to spare...or the models.

If you're getting into Chaos, please, please, please for the love of all that is unholy, get your hands on this codex...

... if you haven't already. To paraphrase the fears of many... "I'm worried that this generation of Chaos players will think that Khorne and Slaanesh are friends. Khornate bezerkers and Slaaneshi noise marines holding hands skipping down their way to assaulting Terra."

Fluff is your friend.

Sephyr wrote:

SilverMK2 wrote:I prefer regular CSM over their cult versions - they are cheaper so you can put more of them on the table for the same cost.

My CSM have surprised me on occasion, but I usually prefer cult troops. Regular CSM are not fearless and don't have "And They Shall Know No Fear", so they -will- run if they get shot up by Long Fangs or charged by CC specialists, and keep going right off the board. Also, you need a full 10 to get the 2 special weapons, so plague marines actually bring more for less on that front with added survivability.

I love the idea of a small Raptor wing guarding the Prince and popping transports for him, though. If only I had the point to spare...or the models.

MoCG = 1/144 chance of running to long fang shooting.

Defilers are a good option,the kit is a bit pricey though.

But in the game they are quite cheap and have a great gun plus they can run and still assualt,you opponent won't know what hit him.

IronChaos wrote:
Welcome to chaos! At least you're not running ultramarines (too) -.-

Maybe I should have painted my Chaos boys as fallen smurfy marines, the laugh potential calls to me... I'll have to do a squad sometime

PLauge marines are the best bet for objective holding, and Khorne Zerkers are best for taking them. CSM are great just regularly.


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Oh, and chosen for infiltrating.