Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I am playing in a tournament late July and though I'm pretty happy with my list overall, I find myself flip-flopping on my third Troops choice between a Fire Warrior team and a Kroot squad. The Kroot would be good for camping on an objective in cover, but they're completely vulnerable outside of it. Within 24, they are slightly better at shooting than their points-equivalent in Fire Warriors, too, but falter against monstrous creatures and vehicles. I'd also be taking a squad too large to fit in a Devilfish, should the need arise.

Anyway, onto the list:
HQ
132: Shas'el w/HW Drone Controller, HW Multi-Tracker, Missile Pod, Plasma Rifle, Shield Generator, Gun Drone, Shield Drone

Elite
241: Crisis Battlesuit (3): Team Leader w/Bonding Knife, HW Drone Controller, HW Multi-Tracker, Bonding Knife, Missile Pod, Plasma Rifle, Shield Generator, Gun Drone, Shield Drone. Two suits with Missile Pod, Plasma Rilfe, Multi-Tracker.

241: Crisis Battlesuit (3): Team Leader w/Bonding Knife, HW Drone Controller, HW Multi-Tracker, Bonding Knife, Missile Pod, Plasma Rifle, Shield Generator, Gun Drone, Shield Drone. Two suits with Missile Pod, Plasma Rilfe, Multi-Tracker.

Troops
60: Fire Warrior (6)

60: Fire Warrior (6)

126: Kroot Carnivore (18) or
125: Fire Warrior (11) w/Shas'ui and Bonding Knife

Fast
60: Pathfinders (5)
105: Devilfish w/Gun Drones, Disruption Pod, Flechette Discharger, Multi-Tracker

60: Pathfinders (5)
105: Devilfish w/Gun Drones, Disruption Pod, Flechette Discharger, Multi-Tracker

Heavy
170: Hammerhead w/ Railgun, Burst Cannons, Disruption Pod, Multi-Tracker, Target Lock

195: Broadside Battlesuit (2): Team Leader w/Bonding Knife, Smart Missile System, HW Drone Controller, HW Target Lock, Advanced Stabilization System, Gun Drone (2). One suit with Smart Missile System, Advanced Stabilization System

195: Broadside Battlesuit (2): Team Leader w/Bonding Knife, Smart Missile System, HW Drone Controller, HW Target Lock, Advanced Stabilization System, Gun Drone (2). One suit with Smart Missile System, Advanced Stabilization System

Total: 1750/1749 with Fire Warriors in place of Kroot.

I take shield generators on my Crisis team leaders because in my local meta there is a lot of plasma mixed in with all the bolters so I find being able to soak some wounds on the team leader is valuable. The gun drones are for cheaper ablative wounds, and my Broadsides are usually in cover so I thought I could save points there. My Shas'el is joined to a Crisis team, so I tend to run with a squad of four and a squad of three. Going down to 1500, I would remove one broadside team and either a pathfinder team or reduce the third Troops unit, not sure yet.

Steps to fix list.

Step one, leader too expensive, cant mix drones. Hop him behind crisis, if they shoot at him 4+ cover save anyway. Drop the drones

step 2, split 2 3 man teams into 3 2 man teams, drop bonding knife. When one dies your never below 50 precent, just at 50 precent. Drop shield gens.

Step 3, EITHER 6 fire warriors, or spend some points on kroot and kroot hounds. I bits ordered 16 hormagaunt bodies and 16 kroot heads off ebay for 8 bucks, and shipping. Some bases and you have converted hounds, which soak wounds great for the points AND do decent in meelee. I run 12 kroot, and 6 hound squads. In forests impossible to remove without flamer help/removing cover.

Cant complain about the broadsides, pretty much how I run them, though Im sure there are better ways. Use the leftover points to field a piranha or 2 mabye? Fusion and charge blocking can come in handy.

Okay, I'm going to have to disagree with some of your opinions.

1) Drones can be mixed. See page 26 of the Codex, "a model wtih a drone controller must take one or two Gun, Marker, or Shield Drones, in any combination."

2) Drones count for 50% unit strength for the purpose of regrouping with the latest FAQ, don't they? As such if I run groups of two suits and two drones with no knife, I can't regroup if I'm down to just the team leader.

As I mentioned, my local meta is quite heavy on plasma, seemingly less so on melta, so why are you advocating for ditching the shield generators? I can't always get in position for a cover save.

Splitting my Crisis teams into three groups of two, and running the commander independently, really nerfs my Markerlights. I find skilled players will target the Pathfinders first so I'd like to maximize their benefit while possible. Attaching the commander to a team of three suits, with my current list, also gives me five wound allocation groups - commander, team leader, grunts, gun drones, and shield drones.

3) Six unmounted fire warriors will die very quickly. I don't have the points for an extra Devilfish unless I cut back on the Pathfinders.

The Hounds are a good idea, and it would definitely give a Kroot unit more versatility if I'm playing a mission where I don't need to objective camp.

I just think If you trim the fat some, you can get more in your list. Sure shields and gun drones are neat, but whats more neat, them or say a pathfinder and devilfish you couldnt afford before. In my typical 1750 list I run 2 units, and put the fire warriors in the devilfish. It may not play the way you like, its up to you. But I find and many experienced players feel the same, that the shield drones and shields dont pan out for their price. Look at this somewhat changed list, minimalist to pack in some nice stuff. And with 2 units in a group, you cant drop below 50 precent due to a death.

HQ:

Shas'el plasma riffle, missile pod, multi tracker, t. array, 97

Elite:

2x XV8 Crisis battlesuits missile pods, plasma riffle, multitracker, team lead, fusion, t. array 151

2x XV8 Crisis battlesuits missile pods, plasma riffle, multitracker, shasui, cyclic ion blaster, t. array 159

2x XV8 Crisis battlesuits missile pods, plasma riffle, multitracker 124

Troops:

6x Fire warriors 60

6x Fire warriors 60

12x kroot carnivores, 6x kroot hounds 114

Fast attack:

6x Pathfinders, devilfish, disruption pod, multi tracker, smart missile system 187

6x Pathfinders, devilfish, disruption pod, multi tracker, smart missile system 187

Heavy Support:

Hammerhead Gunship, railgun, 2x burst cannons, disruption pod, multi tracker, target lock 170

Hammerhead Gunship, railgun, 2x burst cannons, disruption pod, multi tracker, target lock 170

3x XV88 Broadside battlesuit, Advanced stabalization systems, team leader upgrade, hard wired drone controller,
2x shield drones, hard wired target lock 280

1750

Also a better use for pathfinders now a days than boosting your BS is to take away something elses cover saves. There all over the place now, and once you take it away, it counts for your whole army shooting at that unit. So you can light up at least 2 units, and with 6 markers thats an average of 3 hits. Thats enough to take away the cover of whatever you need dead. That I find is their best use.

Orock, I like your list more than the original, so I'll give advice for it.

First of all, at 1750 points I would suggest less hammerheads and more broadsides. Full 12-man fire warrior units would really be better to go with the D-fish, so that you can zoooom around, dump at the fire warriors, and then pump 31 S5 shots into your enemy for each Fire Warrior unit.

Also, that is a lot of fireknives, I'd suggest getting other variants in there.


HQ:

Shas'el plasma riffle, missile pod, multi tracker, t. array
97 Pts.

Elite:

3 Fireknives and TL w/ TA
201 Pts.

3 Fireknives and TL w/ TA
201 Pts.

2 Deathrains w/ TAs
106 Pts.

Troops:

12 Fire warriors
120 Pts.

12 Fire warriors
120 Pts.

Fast attack:

6 Pathfinders
Warfish
192 Pts.

6 Pathfinders
Warfish
192 Pts.

Heavy Support:

2 Broadsides
A.S.S.
Team Leader w/ TL
170 Pts.

2 Broadsides
A.S.S.
Team Leader w/ TL
170 Pts.

2 Broadsides
A.S.S.
Team Leader w/ TL
170 Pts.

1739 Pts.

Would you mind explaining what's wrong with my original list? I've already scraped out points by replacing Shield Drones with Gun Drones, as my past lists were always Shield Drones. Same with my Devilfish, they used to be Warfish before the latest FAQ.

Is splitting the Crisis suits into groups of two for the sake of saving points on bonding knives worth the extra markerlight hits needed to get the same benefit per suit?

Here is a briefing, I probably missed a lot:

You should never take drones on crisis suits. Markerdrones are over-priced, gun-drones do what fire-warriors do better, and shield drones are (imho) too expensive for what protection they give crisis suits, and they should only be taken with the expensive broadsides.

Shield generators are over-priced, and you should never take them on your normal crisis suit units, and I would suggest never taking them on your commander.

If you want drones to keep your broadsides alive, spend the extra points to get shield drones instead of normal drones.

There is no merit in having extra wounds available to a Crisis team? Fireknives are nearly as expensive per model as ASS Broadsides.

The Broadsides should always be in cover, so the gun drones get a 4+ cover save, which is just as good as a shield drone, except against the few weapons that are low-AP and ignore cover.

Not when you are paying 15 points for an extra wound on a ~50 pt. model.

I never make the assumption there will be cover for the broadsides to go in. It is really quite a stretch assuming you will get a nice piece of terrain for them every game without having any complications.