Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So I asked for a game by an empire player the other day and during deployment he puts down a unit of 40 Flagellants. Following conversion ensues:

Me: You know that unit is illegal right?
Him: No, I saw it in a book.
Me: *Gets Empire book* See? The unit size is 5-30.
Him: *Flips through Rulebook* Look, they have a unit of 50 here.
Me: That's part of special fluff battle report. Kind of like Apocalypse.
Him: It must be in the FAQ.
*We both check*
Me: Nope.
Him: They wouldn't do it if it wasn't legal!
Me: Fine. *Proceeds to steamroll his army WAAAGH! style.*

How do you deal with this?

Explain the differance between a staged picture designed to look cool and one that is functionally demonstrating the army rules. Otherwise I am thinking he may have other problems than this game...

Dont play with him again?

Even if you dealt with this issue next time, similar things will happen over , and over again.

LunaHound wrote:Dont play with him again?

And warn others about him.

Just bring 5 hydras. Say your army is led by some great beastmaster, and that your fluff supports your army, so it's legal.

No, seriously, you shouldn't have let him get away with that. Now he's probably going to do it again, to someone else...

Sounds like a misunderstanding. I would let him play with it for that game, assuming that you did not have the time/models to rewrite lists.

Though next time I would insist that he makes sure he sticks with the unit limits stated in the rule book/codex.

Tzeentchling9 wrote:
Him: *Flips through Rulebook* Look, they have a unit of 50 here.
Me: That's part of special fluff battle report. Kind of like Apocalypse.

How old is he?

keep explaining that it is illegal and photos =/= rules.
i can get REALLY stubborn when i want to be, especially when i know i'm right.

LunaHound wrote:

Tzeentchling9 wrote:
Him: *Flips through Rulebook* Look, they have a unit of 50 here.
Me: That's part of special fluff battle report. Kind of like Apocalypse.

How old is he?

About 20 I think.

This is not the first time he's done this either, I'm pretty sure I'm the first one to call him out on this though.

In that case, he is old enough to know better, and well done on calling him on it, just dont give in for the sake of cheating (thats my personal take on stuff like this though).

Smash his face in with a chair and then smash all of his models with said chair. Tell him it's legal and that you saw it happen in a book once.

Naah tell him you saw it on TV.
More believable

Lawl - also, to all MODs, I was certainly joking. Please don't give me a warning. /pretty please

Tell him the codex trumps the rulebook, then smack him with the codex open to the Flagellants page. Or just refuse to play him and convince others to do the same until he fixes his illegal list, which ever you prefer.

Since he's 20, he should be able to just rewrite his list without acting like a 5 year old. And tell him not to act like a 5 year old if he whines.

Joke solution: Write "[Your Name here] wins!" on a piece of paper and take a foto of it. Next time you play him say you allready won, if he questions the validity say you saw it on a foto. And they wouldn´t make a foto of it if it wasn´t true.

Serious solution: Talk to him. If he´s about 20 he should be able to distinguish between "adherent to the rules" and "because it looks cool" or fluff. Tell him that GW is not above making mistakes, even in battle reports or tactical advise they give.

Show him all the illegal configs GW has shown on their website,

like the unit of 10 Leadbeltchers.



Pictures do NOT equal the rules.

the Rules on the pages are what matters, not the pretty pictures.


that said, it would make sense that flagellents wouldn't be limited, but that is the rules.

Tell him it's okay to ignore certain rules for the sake of fun, that GW does this all the time especially for their big scenarios, and that doing so can add a lot more spice to games, but that it is really important for both players to agree to the change before the game.

To be honest, a unit of 50 flagellants sounds really flavourful, hardly overpowered, and I'd like to take it on, but I would expect to be asked first.

Honestly, I really didn't care that much. I was just hoping to let him know nicely so it wouldn't be a terrible shock when told by someone else.

sebster wrote:Tell him it's okay to ignore certain rules for the sake of fun, that GW does this all the time especially for their big scenarios, and that doing so can add a lot more spice to games, but that it is really important for both players to agree to the change before the game.

To be honest, a unit of 50 flagellants sounds really flavourful, hardly overpowered, and I'd like to take it on, but I would expect to be asked first.

This is so true and never really done anymore. Having a narrative driven game with a change to a unit for that narrative can make a game really fun, though obviously agred to by both parties. It's just not done now. Everything is RAW. All the time. Not every game is a tournament game

-Loki- wrote:Everything is RAW. All the time.

Because having a medium that both players are expected to agree on is bad why?

I don't mind ways to improve the game, but you have to ok it by me first.

I have had fun in games that involved strange rules like i had a single unit and they ran around blowing up stuff with stealth fields. quite funny when i got found out.

Tzeentchling9 wrote:

-Loki- wrote:Everything is RAW. All the time.

Because having a medium that both players are expected to agree on is bad why?

I don't mind ways to improve the game, but you have to ok it by me first.

If you read what I put before your quote, and ignored my little spelling error...

-Loki- wrote:Having a narrative driven game with a change to a unit for that narrative can make a game really fun, though obviously agred to by both parties.

I'd tell him that is was illegal, point it out and keep playing.

It's happened to me before, some kid I was playing kept saying it was completely legal, then began to actually start hitting me and threaten me into letting him to it.

However, I'm not a nice guy, so when he punched me again, I kneed him in the stomach. Whilst he was nearly in tears, he quickly took the illegal models off of the board.

Wolfun wrote:However, I'm not a nice guy, so when he punched me again, I kneed him in the stomach. Whilst he was nearly in tears, he quickly took the illegal models off of the board.

What you couln't slap the back of his head like a normal adult.
whend dealing with brats i find that locking them in the can ti'll they cool off usually works wonders, and i get less flak.

HoverBoy wrote:

Wolfun wrote:However, I'm not a nice guy, so when he punched me again, I kneed him in the stomach. Whilst he was nearly in tears, he quickly took the illegal models off of the board.

What you couln't slap the back of his head like a normal adult.
whend dealing with brats i find that locking them in the can ti'll they cool off usually works wonders, and i get less flak.

The kneeing was a little more subtle (no one else seemed to notice). It was also more of a "I'm bigger than you, I'm higher on the food chain" strike.

Plus, I've seen people do that (slap to the back of the head) before and get in trouble. If you don't get seen, you can't get in trouble!