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Chenkov can give the special rule "Send in the Next Wave" to conscript squads. However, it lists Chenkov as having that rule as well. Does that mean his squad can use Send in the Next wave as well?

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm afraid not, only conscripts can be replaced. It's not made very clear by both units having the same wording in the list section, admittedly. It's a bit clearer on Chenkov's character page.

It's his special rule that works while he is on the battlefield. Once he's gone it stops working, that is why it's listed on him.

juraigamer wrote:It's his special rule that works while he is on the battlefield. Once he's gone it stops working, that is why it's listed on him.

I don't recall the rules ever saying that it stops working when he dies. It's just required that you have him to be able to purchase the special rule. Once the conscripts have it, they get to keep using it, even if Chenkov dies.

It's in the FAQ. Any unit of conscripts that has an IC attached will have the IC destroyed.

There is a second squad of conscripts waiting off board, not a second Chenkov.

-cgmckenzie

Alright. That makes sense, actually.

It's not like there is an army of Chenkov Clones.

Im just wondering something about that rule (im no ig player) but the ig have a hq that can give a unit infiltrate yes? well if you give that to conscript's and outflank them does that mean that they keep outflanking?

kefer wrote:Im just wondering something about that rule (im no ig player) but the ig have a hq that can give a unit infiltrate yes? well if you give that to conscript's and outflank them does that mean that they keep outflanking?

Creed can give a unit scouts during deployment, which would allow a unit to outflank. Seeing as how the original squad can only be killed after deployment, and therefore replaced after deployment, I don't think it works like that.

Griever wrote:

kefer wrote:Im just wondering something about that rule (im no ig player) but the ig have a hq that can give a unit infiltrate yes? well if you give that to conscript's and outflank them does that mean that they keep outflanking?

Creed can give a unit scouts during deployment, which would allow a unit to outflank. Seeing as how the original squad can only be killed after deployment, and therefore replaced after deployment, I don't think it works like that.

Does the squad count as the original squad for all intents and purposes when it returns? I.E same special rules, wargear etc..? Then they may also retain scout.

They retain Scouts, but you can only declare units as outflanking during deployment. They don't exist during deployment, so can't outflank. There was a recent post discussing all this stuff if you want to check it out. It was concerned mainly with the interaction of Al'Rahem and Chenkov.

Yeah, the outflanking thing was recently hashed out.

As for the OP, I think you're on to something. For the entirety of the entry for the special rule, it says "A unit with this special rule", "Any unit with this special rule", etc. At no point does it say that conscripts are the only unit which may have this special rule, only that conscripts have the opportunity to purchase it, which is non-exclusionary language.

I would argue that because Chenkov and his buddies have the special rule, and that any unit with the special rule can do the thing, that you could use this ability on Chenkov himself.

After all, he may be a special character, but he's not an independent character.

DakkaDakka wrote:

Ailaros wrote:Yeah, the outflanking thing was recently hashed out.

As for the OP, I think you're on to something. For the entirety of the entry for the special rule, it says "A unit with this special rule", "Any unit with this special rule", etc. At no point does it say that conscripts are the only unit which may have this special rule, only that conscripts have the opportunity to purchase it, which is non-exclusionary language.

I would argue that because Chenkov and his buddies have the special rule, and that any unit with the special rule can do the thing, that you could use this ability on Chenkov himself.

After all, he may be a special character, but he's not an independent character.

While this seems odd, I don't see any RAW reason it wouldn't work at the moment after looking it over myself. Chenkov has the Special Rule in question. You can only *buy* the special rule for Conscripts squads, but that doesn't mean only they can use it. Maybe not RAI, but certainly seems RAW. Use this to get special weapons and orders that can support your extra waves of conscripts. Heck, the PCS could get Chenkov without even having Conscripts, basically as a renewable scoring unit. Plasmas on a PCS wouldn't be as much of a waste if they burn themselves to death, just replace them!

If RAW were followed, there is nothing that says he confers SITNW to his PCS. So, you can have a renewable source of Chenkov but not of PCS.

Unlimited Chekov, unlimited power!?

-cgmckenzie

Imperial Guard Codex pg. 65 wrote:
Send in the Next Wave: An army that includes Commander Chenkov may purchase this special rule for its Conscript squads, as described in the army list. A unit with this special rule can, at the start of the player's turn, be removed from play as casualties if the controlling player wishes, counting as destroyed.

Any unit with this special rule that is removed from play may be brought back into play at the beginning of the controlling player's next turn. The new unit moves onto the board from the player's board edge. The unit arrives with as many models and exactly the same armaments as its full strength predecessor - it is treated as a new, identical unit that has just arrived from reserve.

Now why would they state that when conscripts can't take special weapons?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Near as I can tell, this means that Chenkov can come back, and since he's not an IC, if he comes back, he comes with with all the same armaments he had before (his squad).

His squad isn't armaments and only chenkov has SITNW. Nowhere does it say he confers that ability to his squad mates.

Chenkov has it, his squad doesn't.

-cgmckenzie

Is a unit said to have a Special Rule if one of it's models has the Special Rule?

The BRB on pg. 74 has examples of USRs and denotes which ones are lost by ICs joining units without the same rule, so it could be said the exception proves the rule here. The fact that they specify which ones are lost shows that the Special Rule is still present when joined to a unit.

This has the best title I've ever seen, 'An epiphany about Chenkov'

Smitty wrote:
It's not like there is an army of Chenkov Clones.

They're using a Commander named Kubrik Chenkov to create a clone army!

puma713 wrote:

Smitty wrote:
It's not like there is an army of Chenkov Clones.

They're using a Commander named Kubrik Chenkov to create a clone army!

Attack of the Clones! (Vodka edition)

The FAQ specifically says IC attached to a bottomless conscript squad(not as much fun as bottomless soup but alas) becomes destroyed upon SITNW happening. True, Chenkov hasn't joined a conscript squad but SITNW does not say it confers to his squad. That would be like Yarrick giving eternal warrior to his squad just because he joins it.

I am willing to bet my army of SM to say that it doesn't apply to Chenkov. Kinda like how Creed doesn't get to scout because he has tactical genius(not a perfect analogy but close as I can get without digging out more Codexes). They are what enable other units to have these rules, they don't directly benefit from the rules themselves.

-cgmckenzie

The precedent that I can think of off the top of my head is Stealth. Independent Characters don't lose it, and it gets conveyed to the whole squad (per the FAQ). I'm still looking for something more solid.

Chenkov is not an IC, he is a squad upgrade.

ONly Chenkov has the special rule. Noone else does.

There is no "conferring" going on with Stealth, either - because Stealth specifies the whole unit benefits from it as long as one member has the USR.

His squad are not "armaments" - that argument is rediculous.

I probably should have clarified that a little bit, but what I meant was if you were to give squad members special equipment, that would technically count as armaments for the squad, which Chenkov leads. Since the rule states that the unit comes back with the same armaments, I was thinking that the special weapons in the squad could count as armaments for Chenkov. While I thought that at the time, I do not think this is the case now.