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Now I was wondering if any other SM codex than BA uses assault marine squads in competetive play, since I almost never encounter assault squads in competetive army lists? If not, some of you may enlighten me why. Too many points for the job they do/ fail to do? Worst choice among the other possible assault options?

I have seen them in a raven guard list with shrike seems some what effective the 12 inch move the fleet and the assault plus the infiltrate that way they can close the gap real quick.

Down side is they can not take melta guns which I as a BA player find super effective because they are mobile and just pop tanks all over the place.

Better assault options would be assault termies for SM in a lr.

A definite lack of Big Nasty Weapons like melta, but still pretty good against infantry.

That and most marine players that use them do silly things with them like a few games ago my vindi decided to introduce himself to 9 out of the 10 marines 90% kill rate on that squad.

point being lack of can openers hence making them less than desirable amongst todays mech armies.

AM are the core of a DoA army. It is not a premium assault unit and if they charge a tougher enemy unit, you'll be disappointed.
But if you take them as can opener (2 meltas plus inferno pistol) or charging the enemy shooters you'll get good results.

cowpow16 wrote:[...]
point being lack of can openers hence making them less than desirable amongst todays mech armies.

That is what I wanted to know. So as long as they don't get a makeover in terms of AT or price reduction there is no point in getting them, right?

Well if you have strong anti tank at the back of your army they should do fine ish maybe.. The reason BA AM are better is priests and that they are troops.

AM need a bit of an update for normal marines but then again they are meant to only fight rather than open tanks so they kind of are what they are supposed to be for SM.

Anyways rambling again.

SM AM in a competitive list just not going to happen.
Will that change... Maybe.

I used to always run 2, with one Chaplin w/ LC. Of course that was back in the good ole 4th edition days. But I feel like the same principle applies in a way. A character like a Chaplin that lets you re-roll, or any other IC with buffs really helps out. If you send them in alone I feel like you'll be dissapointed. In any case I haven't seen them in a SM list in awhile, only BA, cause there are better, and tougher, SM units that you can dedicate to assault.

you could try something like this, sorry i do not have the book on hand:

HQ
Kantor -175

Elites
Sternguard, 3 combi-, 2 heavy weapons, Las/plas Razor -225ish
Sternguard, 3 combi-, 2 heavy weapons, Las/plas Razor -225ish
Sternguard + Kantor, 3 combi-flamers, 2 HF, Razor -190ish

Troops
Tac, combi-flamer, PF, Las/plas Razor -200
Tac, combi-flamer, PF, Las/plas Razor -200

Fast attack
Assualt Marines (10), 2 flamers, pair of LC -215ish
Land Speeder, HF, MM -70

Manly a shooty army. Amarines are for counter assualt, just try to keep them in the +1A bubble.

DEEPSTRIKE!!!!!
and get those pesky guys behind cover and in the back or detroy a transport. The only promblem is, they can't carry the meltagun and you could use a cheaper scout sqaud to do it.
But then again, I don't know if im giving you good advice or bad advice

The Black Templar assault marines can take meltabombs, but at the price of the grenades plus the marines themselves it's just too expensive to be practical. 120pts for 5 marines with meltabombs to hopefully deepstrike and take out one vehicle at most, not really worth it.

It is mostly that they do the job ok, but there are things in the codex that do the same thing better. Namely assault termies. They do have there place, I take a squad of 5 in a few of my lists as a quick response unit, to help out Tac squads on objectives. Give the sarge a PF, leave the flamer at home......

Caminoman wrote:The Black Templar assault marines can take meltabombs, but at the price of the grenades plus the marines themselves it's just too expensive to be practical. 120pts for 5 marines with meltabombs to hopefully deepstrike and take out one vehicle at most, not really worth it.

Yes, that is what I was thinking, since I'm playing BT. It just bothers me that I bought 2 boxes of them back then in 3rd addition. At that time, they actually seemed pretty nice. But I guess using Landspeeders with cyclones is a way better option for the same points... unfortunately, because I really enjoyed CC with them.

For AM to be worthwhile you have to do something to them to make them better. BA have sanguinary priests for furious charge and FNP, as well as librarians that can give the whole unit preferred enemy. Without tricks like these, they just can't fight orks, space wolves or other good assault armies hand to hand.

Assault marines are not a competitive choice in a true tournament army. The reason being that they are simply inferior to true assault units in other armies. There are too many units with higher initiative and weapons that ignore power armor.

Even with FnP, furious assault, etc. they still get destroyed by genestealers, harlequins, bloodcrushers, etc. This is why any army that relies on Assault Marines to do the heavy lifting will ultimately fail as all it takes to defeat them is a superior stat line. And there are lots of units out there that will beat them in combat and are cheaper.

The only consistently effective assault unit in the SM codex are TH?SS termies. These are going to be good against the majority of units you face and can actually engage powerful assault units and either tie them up or win. Assault marines will not.

For my BA I have managed success with my assault troops (it is a fluffy/fun/competitive im not a cheesy _____ list )

But played right you can do a lot of damage and even pull out a win with those marines.

But against cheesed up armies I dont know how effective they would be I know it can take mech heavy guard surprisingly pulled out a few wins against a friend.

For sm they are not worth it for BA play em right and keep em supported and they will do wonders for you.

That's the thing, even a normal Daemon or Tyranid army will table DoA BA with nearly no effort. You can't "cheese" out nids anyway (I hate that term, BTW, people who play competitively with good armies are not bad people, they just enjoy a different aspect of the hobby).

I play in tournaments with my bugs all the time and my friend plays Daemons. 100% of our games against DoA BA are complete wipe outs with nearly no effort.

Why?

Even if the BA charge bugs or Daemons, they swing last (even with furious assault) in most cases and get destroyed as both bugs and daemons ignore their FNP and 3+.

To add insult to injury, the assault marines with all their kit and priests, etc. cost more, too.

They are just inferior assault units compared to the truly competitive assault units in the game. They will do alright against a lot of armies, but as the OP asked if they were competitive or not, in a tournament environment the short answer is no. They will be a liability in a lot of games which makes them a poor choice.