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I am trying to get back into the game and was thinking something along the lines of this....

Librarian (Shield, Sanguine Sword) - 100

5 Assault Marines (Meltagun, Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon) - 165
5 Assault Marines (Meltagun, Razorback w/ TL Assault Cannon) - 165
5 Assault Marines (Meltagun, Razorback w/ LasPlas) - 165
5 Assault Marines (Meltagun, Razorback w/ LasPlas) - 165
5 Assault Marines (Meltagun, Razorback w/ LasPlas) - 165

Tornado Land speeder (Multimelta, Heavy Flamer) – 70
Tornado Land speeder (Multimelta, Heavy Flamer) – 70
Tornado Land speeder (Multimelta, Heavy Flamer) – 70

Rifleman Dreadnaught (TL Autocannon, TL Autocannon) – 120
Rifleman Dreadnaught (TL Autocannon, TL Autocannon) – 120
Rifleman Dreadnaught (TL Autocannon, TL Autocannon) – 120

Total 1,495

I havent bought anything yet so anything is changeable. And the list will end up scaling up in points up to 2000 but i will deal with that whenever i get to it.

I know its not quite the AV13 spam but similar. I am not fully sold on the speeders but i think i was lacking anti-horde, 3 might be over kill though. Baals were just too expensive if you include heavy bolters. If i were to switch to Auto/Las preds i would have to free up a little space but could drop 1 speeder to do so. I think either of those would be fine. I dont really know what to take for my second power on my Librarian. either. Shield is a no brainer but im not sure what to do with the 2nd. Any comments would be greatly appreciative.

Plenty of spam

Thats a pretty good mech BA.
I prefer the Dreads over Preds, there a bit cheaper for 4 TL AC shots, rather than 2 AC and 2 LC shots. But you do lose some movement.
I think you also have a good balance of anti-tank and anti-horde. With Assault Cannons, Plasmas, Heavy Flamers and Assault Marines being able to deal with troops effectively, and the rest is more than enough to deal with a few tanks.

good fire power but slow

i like it compared to the 6 pred list well done sir hope it wins

what are you going to use to increase it to 2000? i assume anything that can fit in a landraider

Im not really sure what i would do if when i increase to 2000.

Maybe add a Terminator unit in a Land Raider? or Death Company. Would give you a solid assault unit for dealing with tough opposition up close. But i'm not sure how well that would really work in practise. You could probably find a way to add a couple more Razorbacks in with Sternguard or something.

I think you should drop the razorbacks as they draw a lot of fire for having big guns but little armour. I would do this also because I have played with assault marines and there next to useless in groups of five and can do some damage for the first round of combat but need numbers to keep them in

thats not why hes taking them though hes taking assault squads bcuz of the discounted ride

i like it how it is if there was a way to increase it to 2000 without dramtically changing the list i would add another razor squad and priests along with another librarian for starts which gives 300+ points which is a nice chunk of points

geodub wrote:Im not really sure what i would do if when i increase to 2000.

2 Storm Ravens with some upgrades
or 2 LRs

Let us know how this list does. I run a 6 Predator list at 1500, but I could see this being good too.

If you consider Baal Predators in the future, consider taking them without sponsons. Heavy Bolters are crappy weapons, and you'll probably never be able to fire both Heavy Flamer sponsons. I take 3 sponsonless Baals and I've never regretted avoiding the sponsons. I have been using Auto/HB Predators, and have often bitterly cursed the decision to not go with Lascannons.

MrEconomics wrote:Let us know how this list does. I run a 6 Predator list at 1500, but I could see this being good too.

If you consider Baal Predators in the future, consider taking them without sponsons. Heavy Bolters are crappy weapons, and you'll probably never be able to fire both Heavy Flamer sponsons. I take 3 sponsonless Baals and I've never regretted avoiding the sponsons. I have been using Auto/HB Predators, and have often bitterly cursed the decision to not go with Lascannons.

If i ran Baals i would definitely not run heavy bolters. For 30 points they dont seem to do that much. If I do run them instead of speeders I would think that a good horde army would give me fits.

About expanding to 2000, I dont know if Assault terminators and a LR is the right call. That is sooooo many points tied up in 1 unit and its transport. I think I'd rather go with just Assault Marines with a priest. I am not sure if i would need another Librarian or not. I am leaning towards yes since I would have a lot of vehicles and be able to have another shield. But after that I don't really know what to do. As Looks Infected said i would have roughly 300 points to play with, just without much to spend it on unless i wanted to start swapping speeders for Baals. Death Company scares me since it can be kited around by a good player, but maybe some DC in a razor back with the 2nd Libby would be alright. I wouldn't want more than 5 models so i wouldn't need a rhino. I just think that then i would have too much AV 11.

A solid choice in my opinon that would make this list boss that includes the preists another Libby and another razor assault squad would b adding a honor guard w/ 4 Melta or flamers preferably to fill that gap and a razor with assault cannon...

U don't get the discount for the transport but it's the best choice I can think of to get rid of that gap unless you want dc in a razor that's probably never going to get into cc or replace speeders with Baals ... they need speeders in this list IMO

Looks Infected wrote:A solid choice in my opinon that would make this list boss that includes the preists another Libby and another razor assault squad would b adding a honor guard w/ 4 Melta or flamers preferably to fill that gap and a razor with assault cannon...

U don't get the discount for the transport but it's the best choice I can think of to get rid of that gap unless you want dc in a razor that's probably never going to get into cc or replace speeders with Baals ... they need speeders in this list IMO

Do you think it would be better to run it as CC group as apposed to a shooty honor guard. Since it already has a chalice and can run with a librarian for rerolls, It wouldnt be terrible in combat. It wouldn't exactly scare people and would and get destroyed by a death star unit but with FNP and FC it would do fairly well. Especially since it would have the librarian power weapon and probably a fist in there too.

Well, the list looks pretty competitive.
However, I'd consider including two Baal Predators by dropping two Speeders and one troop unit.

I honestly think this list would work better as a Space Wolves list. Long Fangs would be much more effective than those Rifleman Dreads, and they can take 3x Land Speeders and a bunch of Razorback troops with a Rune Priest. Their Razorback troops are also 10 points cheaper with the same exact equipment, and they all have Bolters in addition to the BP/CCW. With a setup like that they will outgun this list for about the same cost or cheaper. Personally I think Predators are the better buy over Rifleman Dreads in the Heavy Support slot for Blood Angels. The extra point of armor makes a much bigger difference than you might think, and they have 3 weapons instead of 2, and better maneuverability due to being Fast. The Dreads pump out more AV10-12 suppression fire, but the AC/LC Preds can suppress Land Raiders and still do a number on light tanks, so personally I would make that switch.

The Land Speeders are an interesting choice in this type of list. That's not something you see very often for Blood Angels considering how useful and versatile Baal Predators are, but it does add fast melta which is always nice. If you made a few adjustments to the list you could run 2x Baal Preds with either AC/HB or Flamestorm, 2x AC/LC Preds and 2x Land Speeders, though you would have to run them as a single unit which may or may not be a good idea.

Pred Spam is a tough build to face at 1,500 points, and this list presents much softer targets for your opponent, so I think from a competitive standpoint the list is below the curve, but could potentially still function.

Just for keeps this isn't a sw list this is a ba list two different ideas of lists

Tbh dreads make dents and stuns on av 12 and below and speeders are perfect: outflank then Melta slag

Switching those choices would mean more points,less troops, less targets

This list isnt something to snicker at

But if I had to say anything 5 troop choices is menace at 1500 ba not sure if I would do it but they do they're job at obj camp and suppression so that is a win in my book

I've played BA for a very long time. Here are my thoughts.

Good:
Spam is good- redundant units are great
This army does not rely on one trick to get the job done. GOOD!
Librarian with shield = good times.
Mechanized infantry are king.

Issues:
Small units get torn apart/shot apart very easily unless you hide them way in the back. If you do that, just make them regular marines (cheap as possible) to get the vehicle spam. Small units do very poorly in assault. Speaking of which:
This army has no real assault power. Yes there is a lot of assault marines (do they have jump packs? Can't tell), but small units get shot to crap riding up, and you have no power fists or power weapons to really land a killing blow when you do get into HTH. The larger the unit, the better your chance of actually getting into assault.
How is your librarian getting into combat? Riding in a razorback? Again I can't tell.
Your mobile assault is crippling it's self. If your riding your assaulter in the razorbacks, then your moving flat out to get toward the enemy ASAP and probably hitting smoke on turn 1. Which means you're not shooting. Which means you're wasting points on your guns because they won't be shooting. Or you'll be moving at partial speed to fire the guns, but keeping your assaulters out of combat in AR11 vehicles. Either way is not a great way to spend your points since shooting is conflicting with moving (same problem a land raider, storm bird, vendetta, etc... all have.)
If you are using your vehicles to get your assaulters into HTH then they NEED extra armor. If you are using them as mobile walls to give a cover save then it's not a must, but still excellent advice.
Single shot weapons are bad. Twin link your las cannons and rethink your single shot multimelta. Double up on the melta guns in your squads. Hands down the single best way to win at 40k is to throw the most dice as possible against the enemy. Single shots almost never get the job done.
How are you getting rifleman dreadnoughts? The only option you can give the 2nd arm is a missile launcher. There is no TL Autocannon x2 option.
Speeders are a weak fire support gun ship- I've killed more with bolter fire than I can remember. These do not last long on the table.

Advice:
BA do extremely well with units that give bonuses to other units. You hit it on the head with the libby shield. Think about a SP for the 6" FNP save + furious charge. You are really not taking advantage of this army's strengths if you don't. This save will keep your assaulters alive to get into combat. Azaroth the Grim for the exact same reason, although I would only use him at 2k points.
Get a unit of Death Company. I run one 7 strong with 2 PW, 1 PF + chaplin in a rhino. They will tear apart anything they charge. I've killed units of plague marines, terminators, deamon princes, greater deamons + many many others apart in one turn. Forget giving them jump packs- that's a foolish amount of points when rhinos work magic. This unit is not meant to hold objectives, it's meant to tear holes in the enemy while the rest of your army gets in place.
Fatten up your squads for survivability.
Give your Vets power fists.
Increase the amount of special guns per squad.
Twin link when you can.
Forget buying terminators. DC and Vanguard will do farm more damage and cost far less.
Only consider Landraider Crusaders or Redeemers- take the fight to the enemy; razor backs are for sitting back and shooting. Even then, I still don't like land raiders- you can get more kills out of your squads than you will with this vehicle.
The BA rhino rush is a live and strong but you will need 3+ rhinos to do it. ALWAYS give extra armor to your troop transports.

Tottaly agreed on everything Moopy said. Actually im playing BA as well for like a year and the army is awesome! I just wanted to say that +1 for all advices Moopy gave. Death company can tear apart everything indeed! I usually grab a sanguinary priest as well for furious charge n feel no pain, and Sanguinor sometimes as my HQ. Good and fast killing and nice overall buffs around him and on a veteran sergeant. In adittion to this, YES, the sergeants need a power fist for sure. Otherwise your assault squad is nothing. Special weapons is the way as well

I vote this man Dakkite of the Year.