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Hey im looking to start a grey knight army and im going for a 1000p to start with. This is my first Warhammer 40k army.

List:

HQ: 150
Castellan Crowe

Elites: 315
5 Paladins
4x Nemesis Halberds
2x Psycannons
1x Daemon Hammer

Troops: 280
1st Purifier Squad:
9 Purifier
1 Knight of the Flame
Nemesis Halberds
Psybolt Ammo

2nd Purifier Squad: 133pts
4 Purifiers
1 Knight of the flame
4 Nemesis Halberd
1 Nemesis Daemon Hammer

Heavy Support:
1 Dreadnought 145
Twin Linked Las Cannons

The list is 1023 Points right now and i need help optimizing it and getting it down to 1000

Paladins should go, Purifiers are just as good and at 1k you don't have the points to spend. Concentrate on Purifiers at 1k and diversify later.

Take Psycannons everytime you can on every unit that can take them (dreads aside).

Which is better anti-tank 1 S9 shot or 4 S8 shots, because the later is 10 points cheaper! So dump the twinlinked lascannon on the dread for 2 twinlinked autocannons and psybolt ammo. It is a steal for 135 points and FDreads work best in pairs. So something like this:

Crowe 150

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

Dreadnought: 2 Twinlinked autocannons, Psybolt ammo 135

Dreadnought: 2 Twinlinked autocannons, Psybolt ammo 135

Thats 978 points giving you 20 points to get 2 extra stormbolters on the rhinos (upping their survivability) or psybolt on one squad (not sure if it is worth it for just 3 stormbolters).

You have 8 S8 twinlinked shots and 24 S7 rending shots. The 2 posycannons can shoot out of the Rhinos so turn 1 you drive into midfield and pop smoke. Turn 2 plus you sit inside the Rhinos shooting everything to death.

Using fortitude to mean you can't be supressed and in assault the I6 power weapons and cleansing flame should mean you clean house against MEQs or Hordes .

A list that is entirely on foot is not likely to be successful in the 5e environment. Make use of the dedicated transports option. Vehicles to cover the advance are nearly indispensable.

I'd advise you cut paladins entirely, give your purifiers Rhino/Razorback support, and decide what you want your dreadnought to do. A lascannon and a doomfist makes him unfocused. If you don't mind either being not completely WYSIWYG or can make the parts, arm it with two twinlinked autocannon with psybolt ammunition, the 'psyfleman' pattern. The main reason you want to do this is to give you a unit with a strong threat range outside 24", and this is the main weakness of marine-based grey knight armies.

In a smaller list your purifiers should be carrying some psycannons. Even though you're trading force weapons for it, Grey Knights play best as a midfield shooting army with the ability to mop up in assault, so you would rather shoot them to pieces and assault the remnants instead of getting to assault asap. You'll want to keep a hammer in each squad as well to make MCs and walkers not completely comfortable assaulting them.

This is the core I have been experimenting with for 1k: Crowe, two squads of 6 purifiers with 3 halberds, 1 hammer, 2 psycannons, and a dedicated Razorback, with psybolt ammo on the razorbacks, and two venerable psyfleman dreadnoughts. It's nice and straightforward to use, while having room to explore in other directions by reverting one or both dreads to normal and dropping squad sizes. One other variation can be 3 squads of 5 with rhinos and normal dreads.

Nice i like the feedback =). How would a list containing paladins look like?


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@Fling:

I could use the 20 points to get atleast a Daemon Hammer in each squad

I could use the 20 points to get atleast a Daemon Hammer in each squad

ou don't need a daemon hammer in any squad as you've 6 Psycannons and 2 Psyrifle dreads. No Walkers should get anywhere near combat with you and nor are any MCs gonna survive long, personally I wouldn't give up the I6 attacks for the daemon hammer.

Paladins aren't viable at 1k.

Well i didnt mean in a 1k list i just want to see a paladin list maybe 1500-2000 point list or something like that

There are plenty of Paladin lists out there, but in a competitive environment, everyone seems to advocate losing paladins for more models. Purifiers seem to be gaining ground as the 'must have' army.

I don't win all the time, like some of the more experienced posters; but I like 1,500-2,250 with paladins. I tend to run a GM for grand strategy, a librarian for shrouding/summoning, an interceptor squad with psybolt, a paladin squad as an anvil rocking psycannons hammers and halberds, a gentle dreadknight, the ubiquitous psydreads, a couple of strike squads in transports as minimal objective holders + warpquakers. The volume directly correlates with the points, but I try to fill up that paladin and interceptor squad first and build around them.

I get to playtest a 2250 in a couple of days as part of a 2v2 battle, it looks like this... It's a risky hammer/anvil list, but if I get initiative, I'll be pretty happy.

Librarian - Summoning, Shrouding, MoT, VoD, Teleport Homer, Halberd - 190
GM - Rad Grenades -190
GKSSx5: 1xPsycannon, 2 halberds, 1 hammer, Rhino - 165
GKSSx5: 1xPsycannon, 3 halberds, 1 hammer, Rhino - 170
InterceptorX10: Psybolt, 6 Halberds, 2 Hammers, 2 psycannon - 350
InterceptorX10: Psybolt, 6 Halberds, 2 Hammers, 2 psycannon - 350
DreadKnight: PT, Hammer, Incinerator - 245
Psyflenought - 135
Psyflenought - 135
Paladin x 5 - 2xPsycannon, 4xHalberds, 1xHammer - 320

Junk whats the point on the teleport homer on the Libby? Literally nothing in your army would use it? Also why take a libby and no Quicksilver?

Paladins can work but you need a GM or Draigo to make them scoring as they are such a huge points investment.

I don't think Purifiers and Paladins are a viable build together, it really is a one or the other choice.

The teleport homer is use summoning without scatter. I actually got to test the list a few hours ago against a lascannon spamming SM army. It was a 2500 point game, so the list was a little different, mainly because for some reason one of my dreadnoughts didn't show up to play. So I bumped the pally squad up to 10, sliced off some wargear, and threw in a vindicare (who did nothing useful all f***ing game)

It was spearhead, capture and control, with a LOT of covering terrain, and each player had an AV13 building in their corner... naturally those became the objectives.

I deployed my army as close to center as I could, with one Strike squad in my building, the second one in rhino chilling in the backfield. The empty rhino provided cover through the only LOS that could see from his corner to mine; all my interceptors jumped into his area terrain and managed to all but wipe out 2 devastator squads with combined fire, while the Dreadknight became a heatsink for all that ugly lascannon fire; almost everyone was under the shrouding umbrella... the following turn, the librarian recalled one of the interceptor squads who took the rhino and continued to be pretty good harrasers for another 2 turns.

With all the halberds, I didn't really miss quicksilver. The librarian's whole job was really just to keep a midfield anvil and allow me to constantly redeploy units from the center of the board. It was definitely a situational strategy and in this particular situation, it worked pretty well.

I'm still not sure how I feel about using those interceptors as a mini alpha-strike. The summoning thing was fun though.

junk wrote:The teleport homer is use summoning without scatter. I actually got to test the list a few hours ago against a lascannon spamming SM army. It was a 2500 point game, so the list was a little different, mainly because for some reason one of my dreadnoughts didn't show up to play. So I bumped the pally squad up to 10, sliced off some wargear, and threw in a vindicare (who did nothing useful all f***ing game)

I am afraid that the Homers does NOT work with Summoning. (it lists exactly what is can be used for and summoning is not on the list.

Yeah Summoning and Teleporters have no impact on each other. So that explains whyyou picked that wargear and perhaps why your strategy worked. Summoning is a poor power as you are just too likely to misshap due to proximity to your own Libbies unit. Particularly on infantry units with large footprints.

Ah, yes, summoning is terrible without that to mitigate the scatter. Right, so that's a useless ability unless you just always get summoned into servo skulls, and even then you can still mishap. Wow, yeah, crappy.

FlingitNow wrote:Paladins should go, Purifiers are just as good and at 1k you don't have the points to spend. Concentrate on Purifiers at 1k and diversify later.

Take Psycannons everytime you can on every unit that can take them (dreads aside).

Which is better anti-tank 1 S9 shot or 4 S8 shots, because the later is 10 points cheaper! So dump the twinlinked lascannon on the dread for 2 twinlinked autocannons and psybolt ammo. It is a steal for 135 points and FDreads work best in pairs. So something like this:

Crowe 150

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

5 Purifiers: 3 halberds, 2 Psycannons, Rhino 186

Dreadnought: 2 Twinlinked autocannons, Psybolt ammo 135

Dreadnought: 2 Twinlinked autocannons, Psybolt ammo 135

Thats 978 points giving you 20 points to get 2 extra stormbolters on the rhinos (upping their survivability) or psybolt on one squad (not sure if it is worth it for just 3 stormbolters).

You have 8 S8 twinlinked shots and 24 S7 rending shots. The 2 posycannons can shoot out of the Rhinos so turn 1 you drive into midfield and pop smoke. Turn 2 plus you sit inside the Rhinos shooting everything to death.

Using fortitude to mean you can't be supressed and in assault the I6 power weapons and cleansing flame should mean you clean house against MEQs or Hordes .

I think this is a fantatic Purifier list at 1k. And would do well against most any army.

I like FIN's list for 1,000 points, but I think I would spend that last 20 points on a Daemon Hammer in each Purifier unit, and a Master Crafted weapon on one of the Justicars, but that's just me.

A paladin list at 1000 points... it is POSSIBLe, but you lack so much versatility.

it would definately be a deep strike list, and a risky one at that.

the model count would be low, so they would most likely get focus fired to death,

after that you have to worry about the lack of versatility in equipment they can carry, and will most likely be footslogging.

yeah, 1500 points is where paladins make a good appearance, 2000 is where they REALLY start hurting.

At 1000, I think your only option is Draigo for 275 and 10 well equipped paladins at 660, 65 points left over become an 11th paladin with a hammer who just kind of hangs out, looking at the other paladins, trying to figure out why he came along.

He's pretty bummed out, because everyone else is having so much fun, and he's stuck hanging out back at the base, babysitting the objective or something while draigo, who's back from his extended vacation in the warp, is leading all of his pals on a crusade against evil.

Meanwhile, there's like 150 Boyz out there, stomping and fleeting around, and here's this paladin, Scott the Paladin, and all he's ever wanted was a psycannon, but he couldn't get one because the dude at the psycannon store wouldn't sell it to him because he didn't bring four friends along. All the psycannon guys got to go with Draigo. The psycannon guys get anything they want... storm-ravens, land raiders, psybolt ammunition, apothecaries, bannermen... what does scott get? An initiative 1 hammer that won't do him any good against the mob of 30 boyz charging his objective.

Well, at least he's got his holocaust... man why couldn't he at least have had falchions... no body ever takes falchions, they've got like 300 falchions still sitting on the sprue back with the fleet... if he had those falchions in here, he could have spent this whole time filing and painting them during the 20 minutes it took the ork general to move his 30 boyz...

Draigo's probably out there cracking battlewagons open with his bare hands and doing ninja magic all over the place, and Scott has to sit by the door and think to himself "no perils, come on scott, no perils..." until the orks arrive.

Well i think i will be playing Fins list at 1000 points and then start collecting a good pally army for higher point fieldings . I would like more suggestions though on good pally lists ? Someone gotta have one they like ^^

junk wrote:At 1000, I think your only option is Draigo for 275 and 10 well equipped paladins at 660, 65 points left over become an 11th paladin with a hammer who just kind of hangs out, looking at the other paladins, trying to figure out why he came along.

He's pretty bummed out, because everyone else is having so much fun, and he's stuck hanging out back at the base, babysitting the objective or something while draigo, who's back from his extended vacation in the warp, is leading all of his pals on a crusade against evil.

Meanwhile, there's like 150 Boyz out there, stomping and fleeting around, and here's this paladin, Scott the Paladin, and all he's ever wanted was a psycannon, but he couldn't get one because the dude at the psycannon store wouldn't sell it to him because he didn't bring four friends along. All the psycannon guys got to go with Draigo. The psycannon guys get anything they want... storm-ravens, land raiders, psybolt ammunition, apothecaries, bannermen... what does scott get? An initiative 1 hammer that won't do him any good against the mob of 30 boyz charging his objective.

Well, at least he's got his holocaust... man why couldn't he at least have had falchions... no body ever takes falchions, they've got like 300 falchions still sitting on the sprue back with the fleet... if he had those falchions in here, he could have spent this whole time filing and painting them during the 20 minutes it took the ork general to move his 30 boyz...

Draigo's probably out there cracking battlewagons open with his bare hands and doing ninja magic all over the place, and Scott has to sit by the door and think to himself "no perils, come on scott, no perils..." until the orks arrive.

LAWL HOLY HADES!!!! I am gonna have scott in each of my armies now, just cause of this post!

junk wrote:At 1000, I think your only option is Draigo for 275 and 10 well equipped paladins at 660, 65 points left over become an 11th paladin with a hammer who just kind of hangs out, looking at the other paladins, trying to figure out why he came along.

He's pretty bummed out, because everyone else is having so much fun, and he's stuck hanging out back at the base, babysitting the objective or something while draigo, who's back from his extended vacation in the warp, is leading all of his pals on a crusade against evil.

Meanwhile, there's like 150 Boyz out there, stomping and fleeting around, and here's this paladin, Scott the Paladin, and all he's ever wanted was a psycannon, but he couldn't get one because the dude at the psycannon store wouldn't sell it to him because he didn't bring four friends along. All the psycannon guys got to go with Draigo. The psycannon guys get anything they want... storm-ravens, land raiders, psybolt ammunition, apothecaries, bannermen... what does scott get? An initiative 1 hammer that won't do him any good against the mob of 30 boyz charging his objective.

Well, at least he's got his holocaust... man why couldn't he at least have had falchions... no body ever takes falchions, they've got like 300 falchions still sitting on the sprue back with the fleet... if he had those falchions in here, he could have spent this whole time filing and painting them during the 20 minutes it took the ork general to move his 30 boyz...

Draigo's probably out there cracking battlewagons open with his bare hands and doing ninja magic all over the place, and Scott has to sit by the door and think to himself "no perils, come on scott, no perils..." until the orks arrive.

OK I still have not recovered from laughing at this. I think a signature is in order linking to this post proclaiming my support for Scott the Paladin!

Scott the paladin is the epic One Man Army of the imperium! Hail Scott!

Wow, under 100 posts and I've already made it into a veteran's sig. Now I actually have to make a Scott model.

That post was pure gold. I think I might kit out a custom Scott the Paladin model myself. If only I could figure out a way to make him sitting down on his base with the hammer propped next to him as he sharpens a falchion.

How exactly are 5 man squads considered competitive? Because they offer a lot of kill points.

Aldarionn wrote:That post was pure gold. I think I might kit out a custom Scott the Paladin model myself. If only I could figure out a way to make him sitting down on his base with the hammer propped next to him as he sharpens a falchion.

rofl, I might try and do the same... prolly gonna tweak him using green-stuff except.. I think I will give him a partially painted falchion and put a tiny paintbrush in his hand.

MSU lists are relatively common these days, and while they do offer up more KP's than other variants, they usually make up for it by breaking up enemy fire and allowing you to over-saturate your opponent with firepower on different targets. I usually run 6 man units with 2x Psycannons in Razorbacks myself, and with the right melee equipment those units can pack a punch and hold their own in combat. Their high cost keeps the KP's down but it's dangerous because they are no more durable than standard Space Marines. They have to make up for it with pure firepower.

That said, I don't like running MSU exclusively. I enjoy having a couple of those small units in my list, but I also like having a 10 man unit in a Land Raider from time to time, or a couple of them in Rhinos depending on what I want the list to do.

thanks. makes sense. Mine got destroyed. I probably didnt need three dreads and the two daemon princes and the pbliterator squad destroyed my transports



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It was a proxy units game. Im still trying to come up with a good 1,000 point list to run

Scott the Paladin?