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I would like to start a fantasy force as i am getting bored of my marines

ATM i'm torn between high elves, Empire and skaven i think i'll just get a battalion or island of blood once i've decided

Hello neigbour.

You have to ask what style youd like to play ie shootig, magic, combat. I suspect less shooting coming from marines.

Perhaps a 'bad guys' army too, coming from marines^

Skaven seem to be the most competetive atm, well rounded, lots of powerful toys, hordes and magic. It would be expensive though and very time consuming.

Id say wait for the new ogres in October, maybe get some core for the time being. Seems like youre mainly 40k, so ogres are a nice choice to satiate your needs when you fancy some WHFB.

Ogres man, Ogres. Great potential for conversions, paint-schemes, possibly getting a new Army Book later this year, and their Battalion and core units are possibly the best value for money boxes currently out.

Empire, a mix of everything.

I am in a similiar dilemma, i have done 40k for a while, and have always really liked the bretonnians, but i hear they are really underpowered right now, is this how everyone else feels?

That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

i will just wait until the update, still workin on IG

I play Lizardmen and Ogres in Fantasy. I would say the most competitive armies out there are: Skaven, Orcs, Dark Elves, WoC. It just depends on how you want to play. I would say the worst army book is probably Wood Elves, but they have always been shafted. On ebay the cheapest starter armies I have found to buy are Skaven and High Elves. I saw a 3000 point Skaven army on ebay (with 3x $50 war machines in it) sell for only $280. I almost bought it, had I not just dropped $300 recently buying an Ogre Army.

What type of play style you looking to get into? War machines and artillery? Rank and file troops? Mounted Troops? Powerful Magic? Shoot'em up army? Some are more well rounded than others and some armies really only good at one thing. Like Warriors of Chaos pretty much just run forward and hack and slash everything in their way, but they have arguably the best core troops in the game.

iproxtaco wrote:That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

I would love an update for my Wood Elves but loosing all my magic arrows for a 1 page magic item sheet.

rockerbikie wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

I would love an update for my Wood Elves but loosing all my magic arrows for a 1 page magic item sheet.

It will be worth it and all your good items will still be there. I mean look at your only rank and file troops they are over double the cost of a saurus warrior and extremely inferior. Once you get some good block troops, and maybe some special rules for wood elf skirmishers they will again be a contending army. 8th edition is sort of heading away from herohammer, but then again, with the new expansion they released they are seemingly going back to hero hammer almost.

Crom wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

I would love an update for my Wood Elves but loosing all my magic arrows for a 1 page magic item sheet.

It will be worth it and all your good items will still be there. I mean look at your only rank and file troops they are over double the cost of a saurus warrior and extremely inferior. Once you get some good block troops, and maybe some special rules for wood elf skirmishers they will again be a contending army. 8th edition is sort of heading away from herohammer, but then again, with the new expansion they released they are seemingly going back to hero hammer almost.

The problem with that is there will be no cheap Magic Bows or ward saves. It feels like they are draining the individuality of each army.

rockerbikie wrote:

Crom wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

I would love an update for my Wood Elves but loosing all my magic arrows for a 1 page magic item sheet.

It will be worth it and all your good items will still be there. I mean look at your only rank and file troops they are over double the cost of a saurus warrior and extremely inferior. Once you get some good block troops, and maybe some special rules for wood elf skirmishers they will again be a contending army. 8th edition is sort of heading away from herohammer, but then again, with the new expansion they released they are seemingly going back to hero hammer almost.

The problem with that is there will be no cheap Magic Bows or ward saves. It feels like they are draining the individuality of each army.

I dunno man I play Ogres and Lizardmen and there are enough items to give my characters a ward save, and heck some of them come with a ward save. I'd be willing to bet some of the Wood Elf heroes get dodge, like a war dancer hero/lord character would most likely get dodge.

The main problem with WE right now is that if I get any one of my block units from either army up to yours, you are pretty much dead. Skirmishers get shafted in 8th edition, they get no rank bonus and can lose combat by basic ranked units. You should have played back in 4th edition where you could give any character anything you wanted. I built 1,000 point character gods that would just completely imbalance the game. There were also no limits on how many points you had to spend on core, so I could just go all elites and lords and just stomp people.

It isn't taking away individuality, because each race has it's own unique things. It is toning down the power of hero characters, which in all honesty I think is the right way to go. There is no reason one Lord character should be able to wipe out half an army by himself, and I have seen it happen a ton, but not as much in 8th with steadfast, ranks and out numbering your opponent.

Crom wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:

Crom wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:That's the general feeling, but them, Wood Elves, and Ogres are supposed to be the armies that are next in line for an 8th edition up-date. I would gamble on Ogres being first, then Bretonnia, the Wood Elves.

I would love an update for my Wood Elves but loosing all my magic arrows for a 1 page magic item sheet.

It will be worth it and all your good items will still be there. I mean look at your only rank and file troops they are over double the cost of a saurus warrior and extremely inferior. Once you get some good block troops, and maybe some special rules for wood elf skirmishers they will again be a contending army. 8th edition is sort of heading away from herohammer, but then again, with the new expansion they released they are seemingly going back to hero hammer almost.

The problem with that is there will be no cheap Magic Bows or ward saves. It feels like they are draining the individuality of each army.

I dunno man I play Ogres and Lizardmen and there are enough items to give my characters a ward save, and heck some of them come with a ward save. I'd be willing to bet some of the Wood Elf heroes get dodge, like a war dancer hero/lord character would most likely get dodge.

The main problem with WE right now is that if I get any one of my block units from either army up to yours, you are pretty much dead. Skirmishers get shafted in 8th edition, they get no rank bonus and can lose combat by basic ranked units. You should have played back in 4th edition where you could give any character anything you wanted. I built 1,000 point character gods that would just completely imbalance the game. There were also no limits on how many points you had to spend on core, so I could just go all elites and lords and just stomp people.

It isn't taking away individuality, because each race has it's own unique things. It is toning down the power of hero characters, which in all honesty I think is the right way to go. There is no reason one Lord character should be able to wipe out half an army by himself, and I have seen it happen a ton, but not as much in 8th with steadfast, ranks and out numbering your opponent.

I agree with that. I put all glade guards in unit sizes of 10 so they can flee if they get charged. Yes, Skirmishers don't get ranked bonuses. It means I have to carefully plan my charges and use a treeman as a lineholder.

From the responses i'm leaning towards skaven my only question is are they fun to play as well as competitive ?

Depends on your definition of 'fun.'

You have to have a sense of humor, because most of your stuff has a tendancy to blow up, fail to work, or otherwise turn on you. You have to be ready to laugh at the moment when your Warp-lightning cannon blows itself (and something else vital to your game plan) into bits.

You also need to be willing to paint lots... and lots.... and lots of rats.

Oh goody blowing stuff up i love blowing stuff up even if it's mine
the rats well you have to paint em
Skaven are my decision

Good call those guys are sweet and once you paint up a nice horde or 2k+ it looks reallyimpressive man.

Go with iob that's the best thing and trade off the HE for skaven.

Remember tho if you can't laugh at yourself or when yourstuff explodes stay away from their machines since they can do that

Hahahaha will do cowpow16

Excellent good luck and cheers to many great and funny memories

Cheers