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Right. After thoroughly perusing Storm of Magic for the purposes of Lizards I have come to a horrible realisation.

Going by the letter of the rules a Wizard does not need to be stood on a Fulcrum in order to cast Cataclysm spells.

Let me explain and quote some pages for you.

Firstly page 28 (Arcane Fulcrums)

- 'Whilst the model occupies the fulcrum he is considered to 'control' it.'
- '..Control of Arcane Fulcrums empowers Cataclym spells.'

Then page 32 (Cataclysm Spells)

- 'Any Wizard who generates one or more of their spells from the lore in question will also know any Cataclysm spells associated with that lore.'
- 'Unless otherwise stated, all Wizards chose froom the relevant Warhammer army book know all of the spells associated with that army. Furthermore, all Wizards know the Seven Secret Sigils of Summoning spell.'
- 'However, Cataclysm spells require your army to control one or more Arcane Fulcrums.'

Now in none of this does it state that in order to cast a Cataclysm spell you must place the Wizard on a Fulcrum. Sure, the Fulcrums come with plenty of bonuses but they are by no means mandatory. Which leads to the following theory.

Going by the letter of the rule I could do the following.

Place Skink Priests on the Arcane Fulcrums - thus my army is fulfilling and meeting requirements. My army controls the Fulcrums required as Slann are not a seperate army.
In the same respect I can then advance with the Slann and use the Slann's Cataclysm spells - the requirements for controlling fulcrums being fulfilled by Skinks.

Now let's apply this metagame to other armies.

Vampires with Forbidden Lore advancing while Necromancers hold Fulcrums.
Orc Shamans advancing while Goblin Shamans hold Fulcrums.
Warlocks holding Fulcrums while a Grey Seer rides on a Screaming bell.

See where this can go?

Someone out there please find something that disproves this.

As by the letter of the rules above you do not need to sit on an Arcane Fulcrum to cast a spell - merely control it which you can do with a lesser Wizard while your powerhouse or monster Wizards can advance and do their job.

You are correct, the wizard casting the spell deos not need to be on a fulcrum.

If you think about it this makes sense, as some spells require you to have more fulcrums than the enemy

Honestly, It's no big deal and it makes sense as Nos said.

If you are having problem with Skink Priests, Necromancers, Warplocks Engineers, or Goblins on fulcrums, just Wizard Duel them off with their crappy leadership and guess who suddenly has Dominance.

Yep, thats the downside of putting Ld6 priests on there - cold blooded doesnt help you at all in a dual against a Ld8 mage.

Tzeentchling9 wrote:
If you are having problem with Skink Priests, Necromancers, Warplocks Engineers, or Goblins on fulcrums, just Wizard Duel them off with their crappy leadership and guess who suddenly has Dominance.

Who said I was having a problem?

Just means I can advance with my Lore of Light Slann alongside his fellow and the Carnosaurs....

DarkStarSabre wrote:

Tzeentchling9 wrote:
If you are having problem with Skink Priests, Necromancers, Warplocks Engineers, or Goblins on fulcrums, just Wizard Duel them off with their crappy leadership and guess who suddenly has Dominance.

Who said I was having a problem?

Just means I can advance with my Lore of Light Slann alongside his fellow and the Carnosaurs....

Sorry. I read the tone of the original post as a rant. Skink Priests really are easy to to knock off fulcrums though.

True, but it also makes the Becalming Cogitation a much more viable option - shutting 6s off with a mobile frog is much more effective than the idea of a stationary frog.

I'm just wanting to make sure I got that right.

Uh yeah that was pretty straightforward in the rules man allowing you to do everything you just brought up. Personally I like placing plague priests on the fulcrums because they are a lot more durable and can actually smack back with a flail

gabehowlett wrote:Uh yeah that was pretty straightforward in the rules man allowing you to do everything you just brought up. Personally I like placing plague priests on the fulcrums because they are a lot more durable and can actually smack back with a flail

I think you mean plague censor.

-Matt

Either will do

Keep in mind that since Fulcrums are supposed to be apart from each other, certain spells (like the DE spells that destroys Fulcrums) wouldn't work if you had to be ON a Fulcrum to use it.

HawaiiMatt wrote:

gabehowlett wrote:Uh yeah that was pretty straightforward in the rules man allowing you to do everything you just brought up. Personally I like placing plague priests on the fulcrums because they are a lot more durable and can actually smack back with a flail

I think you mean plague censor.

-Matt

No I meant a flail. I don't like paying for a plague censor because most of the armies I run against are high toughness and it isn't worth it

gabehowlett wrote:

HawaiiMatt wrote:

gabehowlett wrote:Uh yeah that was pretty straightforward in the rules man allowing you to do everything you just brought up. Personally I like placing plague priests on the fulcrums because they are a lot more durable and can actually smack back with a flail

I think you mean plague censor.

-Matt

No I meant a flail. I don't like paying for a plague censor because most of the armies I run against are high toughness and it isn't worth it

You wouldn't pay 12 more points to force a Toughness test at the start of combat with no risk to you? I wouldn't do it in normal games, but in a game where the Plague Priest is just standing on a tower with his 3+ ward, and not touching any friends; it's nothing but free hits on the opponent. Even T8 models fail on a "6", and that's not too bad for just an extra 12 points that doesn't come out of your magical allotment.
Having Magic attacks isn't too bad either; have you seen the new picks of the soon to be released banshee and wraith models?

-Matt

If you don't have to be atop an arcane fulcrum to cast cataclysm spells, then what's the point of the 'Arcane Fulcrum Miscast Table' used when you miscast??

It's called this for reason I believe, otherwise it would just be called the 'Cataclysm Spell Miscast Table'. Bearing in mind that a lot of the outcomes destroy the fulcrum you are supposedly standing on.

I think that you DO have to occupy the fulcrums to cast cataclysm spells as technically the wizard is using the fulcrum to channel the winds of magic through HIM. How is he/she meant to pass that channeled power on to other wizards in your army that are not actually embracing the extra power granted by being on top of these magical lightning rods?

I wouldn't be surprised if this is a misprint/wording error and will be FAQ'ed very very soon.

The Decapitator wrote:If you don't have to be atop an arcane fulcrum to cast cataclysm spells, then what's the point of the 'Arcane Fulcrum Miscast Table' used when you miscast??

To counteract the 3+ ward save, immunity to stomp and thunderstomp, immunity to psychology and only being able to be taken out by a single model in combat? Oh, plus the 360 degree line of sight through a higher vantage point. That's the point of that miscast table - to present some risk for the shiny goodness you get.

Plus, when you look at it some of the spells do seem to be better suited for being off the Fulcrum - the Dark Elf ones specifically.

DarkStarSabre wrote:

The Decapitator wrote:If you don't have to be atop an arcane fulcrum to cast cataclysm spells, then what's the point of the 'Arcane Fulcrum Miscast Table' used when you miscast??

To counteract the 3+ ward save, immunity to stomp and thunderstomp, immunity to psychology and only being able to be taken out by a single model in combat? Oh, plus the 360 degree line of sight through a higher vantage point. That's the point of that miscast table - to present some risk for the shiny goodness you get.

Yes but as you have to roll on the table whenever you miscast using a cataclysm spell, regardless if you are on a fulcrum or not, it doesn't make sense to call it the Arcane Fulcrum Miscast Table does it? Plus if the rules do actually mean that you don't have to be on top of one to cast, then as proven if this post, the majority of people will use cheap expendable wizards to hold the fulcrums and let their more powerful mages run wild. So the 3+ ward and all the extra goodies don't really come into play as the hard to destroy wizards won't get all these goodies anyway.

I'd put money on it being a misprint, it doesn't really make sense as an expansion otherwise.

The Decapitator wrote:Yes but as you have to roll on the table whenever you miscast using a cataclysm spell, regardless if you are on a fulcrum or not...

But this is where you are mistaken. Check p.28. To paraphrase, Wizards controlling Arcane Fulcrum also use Arcane Fulcrum miscast table, other Wizards use the standard miscast table as normal. Also, while on Arcane Fulcrum, you use additional table whether casting Cataclysm spells or normal spells.

UltraPrime wrote:

The Decapitator wrote:Yes but as you have to roll on the table whenever you miscast using a cataclysm spell, regardless if you are on a fulcrum or not...

But this is where you are mistaken. Check p.28. To paraphrase, Wizards controlling Arcane Fulcrum also use Arcane Fulcrum miscast table, other Wizards use the standard miscast table as normal. Also, while on Arcane Fulcrum, you use additional table whether casting Cataclysm spells or normal spells.

And to further clarify you roll on the Arcane Fulcrum miscast table in addition to the standard miscast table.

Everyone else is as normal.