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BLACK TEMPLARS 1,75K

HQ1: Emperor's Champion w/ Accept any challenge no matter the odds [140pts]
HQ2: Marshal w/Terminator Armor, Storm Shield, Adamantine Mantle, Power Fist, Tank Hunters, Auspex [185pts]
HQ3: 4 Sword Brethren Terminators (Command Squad), 2 Cyclone Missile Launchers, Tank Hunters [222pts]

Troop1: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop2: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop3: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop4: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]

Fast Attack1: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]
Fast Attack2: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]
Fast Attack3: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]

Heavy Support1: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]
Heavy Support2: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]
Heavy Support3: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]


Total [1749]

Will this work?

Kylis wrote:
Will this work?

I love the list just a few critiques i have.
For your High Marshall if you are going to give him the CS give him Auspex as well so you can shoot at infiltrators one of the best part of the CS. Second IMHO i dont like plasma guns in a squad that will be in the backfield the entire game i would drop all the Plasma guns and upgrade the High Marshalls PF to a Chainfist then buy a SS for your Veteran in the CS and give him the CML then with the xtra points buy bionics for the High Marshal. otherwise this list looks alot like my 2k shooty term list but i max elite term.

Just a note alot of people dont like taking the CS unless the elites are maxed but i like this better it gives your HQ a better chance of living as he cant be spot out.

Plasma guns are there because the area between armies after deployment is 24" so they can shoot in the first turn and also they are there for taking down deepstriking terminators etc.
But thnks for the advice on the auspex, it is cheap and will work on many cases. I would take bionics, but I don't have points and its not that great after all.

I don't really see a problem with the plasma (its an old build)...ah good ol las/plas...so I would just drop the searchlights on the preds as NF you won't be close enough to use them anyway, and get an auspex. Remember the CML can be fired frag too.
On the Initiates I'd keep them with bolters for the range. Otherwise looks good.

P.S. you may want to delete the extra point cost for upgrades before a mod sees them.

up to late lol

Akroma06: we run off the old Search Lights so we dont have to role to see the models

Kylis: I cant see ur list anymore but make at least 1 a bolter so you can stack wounds on him

Nettik189 wrote:up to late lol

Akroma06: we run off the old Search Lights so we dont have to role to see the models

Kylis: I cant see ur list anymore but make at least 1 a bolter so you can stack wounds on him

I think now you are able to see the list again. I took auspex and the single bolter for all crusader squads.

Nettik189 wrote:up to late lol

Akroma06: we run off the old Search Lights so we dont have to role to see the models

Kylis: I cant see ur list anymore but make at least 1 a bolter so you can stack wounds on him

Really because I just reread it and it says that you must follow normal night fighting rules to pick out a target (2d6 x3) but noone else has to, and that vehicle can be shot at without night fight rules next turn. That is the searchlight rules and why I don't really like to have to pay for them...if them come stock on something fine but I'm not going to zoom a pred up to try and shoot a lascannon when I am now out of position and the need to throw it in reverse to avoid being charged by an alpha strike (koptas, DE, etc).

Akroma06: you are right my bad i play SoB they have the better Searchlights

Kylis: Technicaly your list is illegal like this your High Marshall has 102 points worth of wargear so what you should do is give the CS Sergeant the Auspex and you should be good to go. Also i would suggest buying a SS for him too (the Veteran) and give him a CML.

Nettik189 wrote:Akroma06: you are right my bad i play SoB they have the better Searchlights

Kylis: Technicaly your list is illegal like this your High Marshall has 102 points worth of wargear so what you should do is give the CS Sergeant the Auspex and you should be good to go. Also i would suggest buying a SS for him too (the Veteran) and give him a CML.

Yeah sisters searchlights...gross.

BTW this isn't illegal.
HQ2: Marshal w/Terminator Armor, Storm Shield, Adamantine Mantle, Power Fist, Tank Hunters, Auspex 185pts
its 40pts from the single handed weapons list and 62pts from the wargear list, and the codex states "In additon to weapons, you can pick up to 100 points of wargear per model." So he's good.

You know something i have been playing BT since they came out and i never noticed plus weapons!

Not a bad list, only a few changes I would make would be...

Drop the PF on the Marshal and give him a Lighting Claw, 4 refoll to hit and to wound is nice. Not to mention the rest of the CS already has PFs.

The predators... I haven't had much luck with them in the past, I would just drop them for 2 vindicators with power of the machine spirit for 160 each with extra armor. That should free up some points to give a few of your crusader squads rhinos to you can run to an objective.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Actualy enough points for 1 rhino... But it's still worth it IMHO.

I agree with EC...even one rhino would give a squad some survivability. If you have to move on to go get an objective or something. Does that squad need a lascannon at that point?
I kinda like predators but only if I can give them PoMS. I guess its a hangover from the pre-faq but the ability to fire 2 shots at tank A and a TL shot at tank B just makes me feel better in my options. Plus I don't have to get as close as with a Vindicator. Although they can be gross in their own right with PoMS.

Power of the Machine spirot costs too much to buy for three tanks. And I rather have 3 Predators than 2 Vindicators which have too short range and a single penetrating hit that does 3+ effect makes it useless.

I would suggest maybe droping a crusader squad for 2 rhinos and reserve to other one. Also make ur High Marshall have a LC

If you want to make this a shooty list try

HQ - Emperor's champion - Accept. 140

HQ - High Marshall, SS, PF 120

EL - 5x terminators:, 3x PF/stormbolters, 2x CML/ stormbolter, Tankhunters. 265

EL - 5x terminators:, 3x PF/stormbolters, 2x CML/ stormbolter, Tankhunters. 265

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

HS - Predator Destructors LC Sponson 125

HS - Predator Destructors LC Sponson 125

1745

This is more your average shooty BT list though. if you dont like the Predators make em Vindicators but this way you have alot of anti tank and anti horde

Nettik189 wrote:I would suggest maybe droping a crusader squad for 2 rhinos and reserve to other one. Also make ur High Marshall have a LC

If you want to make this a shooty list try

HQ - Emperor's champion - Accept. 140

HQ - High Marshall, SS, PF 120

EL - 5x terminators:, 3x PF/stormbolters, 2x CML/ stormbolter, Tankhunters. 265

EL - 5x terminators:, 3x PF/stormbolters, 2x CML/ stormbolter, Tankhunters. 265

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

TP - Crusader Squad x 5 LC 95

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

FA - Land Speeder x 2 Typhoon Missile Launchers x 2 140

HS - Predator Destructors LC Sponson 125

HS - Predator Destructors LC Sponson 125

1745

This is more your average shooty BT list though. if you dont like the Predators make em Vindicators but this way you have alot of anti tank and anti horde

I loose one predator and one troop in exchange for termie squad: fine. But I also loose 4 plasma guns which sucks against deepstriking terminators or similiar MEQ units. Also that second terminator unit costs twice as much as a predator... And why are people even recommending those vindicators for a tournament list.

Kylis wrote:Power of the Machine spirot costs too much to buy for three tanks. And I rather have 3 Predators than 2 Vindicators which have too short range and a single penetrating hit that does 3+ effect makes it useless.

Just get 2 vindicators and 1 rhino. The vindicators will have a 48 inch range due to the POTMS. Two vindis rolling up and pie plating something is evil. Trust me, ignoring stun and shaken with extra armor and POTMS is nice.

The plasma guns arent reli needed, got it there are deepstrike units that can get close to you but all your troops will be bubble wrapped by your terminators also you have AAC so you have prefered enemy too. I run my 2k list like below but i have 3 Terminator squads and its pretty effective. People like the Vindicator with PotMS seeing how you can move 12in and still shoot the Demolisher cannon its very aggressive and effictive if you can roll a hit otherwise it is going scatter pretty far. What the Vindicator basicaly does is ignore stun shaken and movement restrictions so you can use it as cover and a huge gun. I personally dont run them unless i am going assualt based with my BT.

EmperorsChampion wrote:

Kylis wrote:Power of the Machine spirot costs too much to buy for three tanks. And I rather have 3 Predators than 2 Vindicators which have too short range and a single penetrating hit that does 3+ effect makes it useless.

Just get 2 vindicators and 1 rhino. The vindicators will have a 48 inch range due to the POTMS. Two vindis rolling up and pie plating something is evil. Trust me, ignoring stun and shaken with extra armor and POTMS is nice.

>48"
>12" movement & 24" range weapon


Seriously dude, Vindicators aren't that great, because weapon destroyed means the tank is worthless, immobilised means its worthless, wrecked and exploded makes it useless, so there's a 66,6...% of it being useless when it someone penetrates it with anything.

I like vindicators since you can roll up 12" and drop a plate on someone. Who cares if it gets Immobilised after that since it should be making a 24" bubble around it. Nothing will come in there (yes I know its fire arc). Protect its flank with Predators and Teminators and no transport will get close to you...not even DE with all their speed and lances. It really is a nasty combo that people don't see coming.

Like the list a lot, It's got lots of anti-tank, lots of anti-infantry. I would try and get 1-2 combat squads in there, since I doubt the Termie squad will be assaulting.

Kylis wrote:
BLACK TEMPLARS 1,75K

HQ1: Emperor's Champion w/ Accept any challenge no matter the odds [140pts]
HQ2: Marshal w/Terminator Armor, Storm Shield, Adamantine Mantle, Power Fist, Tank Hunters, Auspex [185pts]
HQ3: 4 Sword Brethren Terminators (Command Squad), 2 Cyclone Missile Launchers, Tank Hunters [222pts]

Troop1: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop2: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop3: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]
Troop4: 5 Initiates, 2x bolt pistols & close combat weapons, 1x Bolter, 1x Lascannon. 1x plasma gun [101pts]

Fast Attack1: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]
Fast Attack2: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]
Fast Attack3: 2 Land Speeders w/2 Typhoon Missile Launchers [140pts]

Heavy Support1: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]
Heavy Support2: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]
Heavy Support3: Predator Destructor w/Sponson mounted lascannons, Searchlight [126pts]


Total [1749]

Will this work?

So after all of our discussion about pred or vindicator this still is a good list. I agree with woodbok on maybe some sort of CC dedicated unit. I guess you could turn two of the crusader squads into CC squads with a Power Fist and a flamer instead of plasma and lascannon.
Honestly not a whole lot should make it too you since those missile can also be fired frag plus the autocannon from the preds.

Akroma06 wrote:I like vindicators since you can roll up 12" and drop a plate on someone. Who cares if it gets Immobilised after that since it should be making a 24" bubble around it. Nothing will come in there (yes I know its fire arc). Protect its flank with Predators and Teminators and no transport will get close to you...not even DE with all their speed and lances. It really is a nasty combo that people don't see coming.

Still 50% chance of it bein useless when It gets penetrated by the enemy and immoblised is still a bad result for the Vindicators. Also they 160 points, which is more than predator and its not better at tank hunting, since it only fires one shot which on average roll misses 3"-4". Pf course it can fire terminators and stuff but so can Plasma guns. Predator is a better tank hunter since it fires 4 shot instead of one.

Kylis wrote:

Akroma06 wrote:I like vindicators since you can roll up 12" and drop a plate on someone. Who cares if it gets Immobilised after that since it should be making a 24" bubble around it. Nothing will come in there (yes I know its fire arc). Protect its flank with Predators and Teminators and no transport will get close to you...not even DE with all their speed and lances. It really is a nasty combo that people don't see coming.

Still 50% chance of it bein useless when It gets penetrated by the enemy and immoblised is still a bad result for the Vindicators. Also they 160 points, which is more than predator and its not better at tank hunting, since it only fires one shot which on average roll misses 3"-4". Pf course it can fire terminators and stuff but so can Plasma guns. Predator is a better tank hunter since it fires 4 shot instead of one.

4 shots? How does it fire 4? I can see your point. I have somewhat of a hybrid list and the Vindicators with PoMS and EA make for great cover for my assault marines. So I guess I have a cheery outlook on them, but yes they cost more. The Vindicator even if it misses will only deviate 3" on average and it still would should be able to pop open a tank. The main reason I only suggested one is it is great in tournaments since I've seen one be responsible for tabling a decent 'cron list on turn 2. Str 10 ordnance is nothing to shy away from.

Akroma06 wrote:

Kylis wrote:

Akroma06 wrote:I like vindicators since you can roll up 12" and drop a plate on someone. Who cares if it gets Immobilised after that since it should be making a 24" bubble around it. Nothing will come in there (yes I know its fire arc). Protect its flank with Predators and Teminators and no transport will get close to you...not even DE with all their speed and lances. It really is a nasty combo that people don't see coming.

Still 50% chance of it bein useless when It gets penetrated by the enemy and immoblised is still a bad result for the Vindicators. Also they 160 points, which is more than predator and its not better at tank hunting, since it only fires one shot which on average roll misses 3"-4". Pf course it can fire terminators and stuff but so can Plasma guns. Predator is a better tank hunter since it fires 4 shot instead of one.

4 shots? How does it fire 4? I can see your point. I have somewhat of a hybrid list and the Vindicators with PoMS and EA make for great cover for my assault marines. So I guess I have a cheery outlook on them, but yes they cost more. The Vindicator even if it misses will only deviate 3" on average and it still would should be able to pop open a tank. The main reason I only suggested one is it is great in tournaments since I've seen one be responsible for tabling a decent 'cron list on turn 2. Str 10 ordnance is nothing to shy away from.

2 Autocannon shots, 2 Lascannon shots.

Oh geez there destructors?

Don't know how I missed that. The list still looks good though.