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I was reading the SM Codex and it references that he fell during one of the battles. Later reading, it appears that he was off on another campaign after this. Am I confusing the dates or was he actually killed in the fluff?

No.

He was badly wounded but not killed.

You'd be forgiven for thinking he was... it seems every new WH40K stuff that comes out lately has a different captain of the 2nd company (both the Ultramarine movie and Space Marine videogame do anyway).

Tarkand wrote:You'd be forgiven for thinking he was... it seems every new WH40K stuff that comes out lately has a different captain of the 2nd company (both the Ultramarine movie and Space Marine videogame do anyway).

Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

If I had anything to do with it, he would have been.

Dark Apostle 666 wrote:If I had anything to do with it, he would have been.

Not a fan of the good Captain?

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

According to the recent novel Fall of Damnos, he was severely wounded but not dead although they did mention that he's going to be out of the fight for a while, might be a chance a new captain took over temporarily while sicarius went on forced sick leave or something

At first, I assumed he was dead/out of action/promoted when I played Space Marine with Titus as captain of the 2nd Company, but the 40k universe spans a long time, they could be Captain at different times.

Anyway, according to Lexicanum, he survived. "After months of healing and finally returning to active duty Sicarius led the Ultramarines and thirty other Space Marine chapters and Imperial Guard forces during the Zeist Campaign. Sicarius still leads the Ultramarine 2nd Company to this day, and it is believed by many he may be the heir to Marneus Calgar's position as Chapter Master of the Ultramarines."

So no. He's alive and well(ish)

Sadly, he is still alive. Being a dick apparently gives you exceptional resiliance.



Sicarus is the heir-apparent for the Ultramarines. however the honor of being the new chapter master has traditionally gone to the Captain of the 1st, something that Captain Agemmon is most assuredly trying to see continue.

If only he was killed the entire Ultramarines chapter would cheer as Uriel Ventris became Captain of the 2nd company.

Hell the entire universe would cheer.

And somewhere a little kitten would purr for the first time, Kharn would be pleased.

They must be something I'm not aware of, because based on what I know of Sicarus, he isn't any more of a douche than any other Ultramarine?

Lynata wrote:

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

It's silly thought... this will only had more confusion to an already very confusing fluff.

There's also the fact there's 10 company to pick from... why not make Titus (or the guy from the Ultramarine movie) captain of 3-4-5-6-7-8-9 (I guess 10 is out, being a scout company)? It neatly avoid the whole issue.

Tarkand wrote:They must be something I'm not aware of, because based on what I know of Sicarus, he isn't any more of a douche than any other Ultramarine?

Lynata wrote:

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

It's silly thought... this will only had more confusion to an already very confused fluff.

There's also the fact there's 10 company to pick from... why not make Titus (or the guy from the Ultramarine movie) captain of 3-4-5-6-7-8-9 (I guess 10 is out, being a scout company)? It neatly avoid the whole issue.

read the uriel ventris stuff. And just be reading how many honors he has and that the armor he has is from hundreds of dead space marines make him a douche, that and for taking credit for alot of the battles he was in.
He accused uriel ventris of being a heretic for not following the codex astrates.
And sent in marines that kept on dieing.

I'm still reading 'Courage and Honour', but after reading more and more about Uriel Ventris, I wouldn't be suprised if he took over at some point.

However I don't know if it's considered an honor to, say leave the captaincy of the fourth company to command the second. I always assumed that any captaincy other than being captain of the first was equally honorable.

Uhlan wrote:I'm still reading 'Courage and Honour', but after reading more and more about Uriel Ventris, I wouldn't be suprised if he took over at some point.

However I don't know if it's considered an honor to, say leave the captaincy of the fourth company to command the second. I always assumed that any captaincy other than being captain of the first was equally honorable.

Captain of the 2nd is the Master of the Watch, it is a more than the honor of being the master of the armory.
Master of the Watch gets access to everything.

If Sicarius actually did have to have somebody
take over command of the second company for him,
it would actually get rid of the plot hole of "how the hell
is Titus the captain of the second company when it already has a captain?"

Even if someone took over Captaincy duties for a time, they wouldn't have the rank of captain. It would be one of the Sergeants and he would just be given overall command and maybe be called Acting Captain.

Grey Templar wrote:Even if someone took over Captaincy duties for a time, they wouldn't have the rank of captain. It would be one of the Sergeants and he would just be given overall command and maybe be called Acting Captain.

Agreed, he wouldn't wear the rank, but he would be referred to and act with the responsibilities of whatever rank he was holding until he could have been relieved by a superior.

Asherian Command wrote:
read the uriel ventris stuff. And just be reading how many honors he has and that the armor he has is from hundreds of dead space marines make him a douche, that and for taking credit for alot of the battles he was in.
He accused uriel ventris of being a heretic for not following the codex astrates.
And sent in marines that kept on dieing.

Haven't read the Uriel Ventris stuff, so they may very well be something there.

But having many honors =/= douche... it means being good at your job. Most power armor get refurbished as it is, most Marines are wearing armor that has belonged to many other before - doubly so if the armor is of extremely fine make (such as Cato's)... Sicarus isn't any different from the vast majority of marine in this aspect. As for taking credit... again, nothing wrong with that if it's deserved.

So yeah, I guess I'll look up the ventris stuff, because without that information, it sounds like people who dislike Sicarus do so because they are proponents of mediocracy rather than anything else...

Tarkand wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:
read the uriel ventris stuff. And just be reading how many honors he has and that the armor he has is from hundreds of dead space marines make him a douche, that and for taking credit for alot of the battles he was in.
He accused uriel ventris of being a heretic for not following the codex astrates.
And sent in marines that kept on dieing.

Haven't read the Uriel Ventris stuff, so they may very well be something there.

But having many honors =/= douche... it means being good at your job. Most power armor get refurbished as it is, most Marines are wearing armor that has belonged to many other before - doubly so if the armor is of extremely fine make (such as Cato's)... Sicarus isn't any different from the vast majority of marine in this aspect. As for taking credit... again, nothing wrong with that if it's deserved.

So yeah, I guess I'll look up the ventris stuff, because without that information, it sounds like people who dislike Sicarus do so because they are proponents of mediocracy rather than anything else...

Sicarius is a complete asshat to Sergeant Scipio in both the AoBR and Chapter's Due books.
His treatment of Ventris is also stupid and frankly arrogant.

Grey Templar wrote:

Spoiler:

Sicarus wanted Uriel Ventress to be purged and not allowed to return to his captaincy, despite the fact that the Grey Knights had declared him free of taint. It was also he that was the most adament supporter of exiling him.

When the GKs and the Inquisition say you are innocent, only a true D-bag would say otherwise.

So, how do you really feel about Cato Sicarius... the acknowledged uber-hero of the Ultramarines?

I imagine many soldiers that fought with Stonewall Jackson felt that way during the American Civil War. In fact, that's how I see Sicarius... I wonder if he goes into battle eating lemons or keeps one arm up in the air 'to keep the humors balanced' as Jackson was famously (though inacurately) said to have done.

Lynata wrote:

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

Captain Ageman was captain of the second company before he was promoted to captain of the first, when Sicarius takes over, so this actually fits with the fluff. As for titus I veiw him as either being acting-captain while Sicarius was recovering (unlikely), or if GW decides to ever advance the plot, he is the new second company captain in M42 (when Sicarius hopefully dies).

vodo40k wrote:

Lynata wrote:

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

Captain Ageman was captain of the second company before he was promoted to captain of the first, when Sicarius takes over, so this actually fits with the fluff. As for titus I veiw him as either being acting-captain while Sicarius was recovering (unlikely), or if GW decides to ever advance the plot, he is the new second company captain in M42 (when Sicarius hopefully dies).

Are you pointing out that the severus in the movie got promoted to the 1st company to make room for cato? you do know what happened to severus at the end of the movie right?

Viersche wrote:

vodo40k wrote:

Lynata wrote:

Havok210 wrote:Agreed. I originally thought he was only wounded, but other media was pointing towards a different Captain for the 2nd and that had me going

Understandable. But no worries, there's an explanation for everything. For example, the developers of the Space Marine videogame have already stated that their game takes place in a parallel universe, whereas I suspect that the makers of the Ultramarines movie just got the name wrong ("Captain Severus" in their movie, whereas according to Graham McNeill it's "Captain Severus Agemman") and did not realize this guy was still needed somewhere even after Sicarius took over.

Captain Ageman was captain of the second company before he was promoted to captain of the first, when Sicarius takes over, so this actually fits with the fluff. As for titus I veiw him as either being acting-captain while Sicarius was recovering (unlikely), or if GW decides to ever advance the plot, he is the new second company captain in M42 (when Sicarius hopefully dies).

Are you pointing out that the severus in the movie got promoted to the 1st company to make room for cato? you do know what happened to severus at the end of the movie right?

Severus took up the company after Agemann but was killed. Severus is in the 4th edition codex, but he died. Strange thing he had a lightning claw not a chainsword lol. Scarius took that postion up after Severus was killed. Protheius is in the 10th company as a trainer.

No, he is not dead. Yes, he is a douche. There are two kinds of Ultras: Column A are the ones who see the codex as guidelines that should be followed whenever possible, but can be bent (or rarely, totally ignored.) for tactical advantage over the enemy. Survival of humanity takes precedence over all else. See: Titus, Ventris. Idaeus.

Column B are the ones who See: Sicarius, Learchus, Leandros the Douchebag.

Column B Ultras don't have to be over the top, overreacting <CENSORED>s, a lot of rules are there for a good reason...but that's the way they're getting portrayed lately.

Being a dick apparently gives you exceptional resiliance.

Think about anyone in a remotely physical field who routinely acts like a <CENSORED>. A lot of the ones that stay that way can afford to because they DO have an exceptional ability to survive and overcome. The ones without it get that attitude beaten the ------ out of them.

SOFDC wrote:Column B are the ones who

Spoiler:

will advocate shooting you in the face or exiling you for playing Deathwatch to get the job done, or turn you over to the local likely corrupt inquisition (Because, hey, the codex is cool with turning over your CO to the inquisition rather than the Librarius or Chaplaincy.) for having the temerity to not die after stopping both an ork and chaos invasion, during which time you get exposed to warp energy.

See: Sicarius, Learchus, Leandros the Douchebag.

To be fair,

The others are proper douchebags.

EDIT: Sorry, forgot about the spoiler tags.

Molten Butter wrote:

SOFDC wrote:Column B are the ones who

Spoiler:

will advocate shooting you in the face or exiling you for playing Deathwatch to get the job done, or turn you over to the local likely corrupt inquisition (Because, hey, the codex is cool with turning over your CO to the inquisition rather than the Librarius or Chaplaincy.) for having the temerity to not die after stopping both an ork and chaos invasion, during which time you get exposed to warp energy.

See: Sicarius, Learchus, Leandros the Douchebag.

To be fair, Learchus had a point. How would you feel if the guy supposed to lead your unit just said, "Hey guys, I heard there was this cool Deathwatch thing, and there's a slot open. Do you mind just handling the groundwork while I go on a secret mission? This won't hurt morale or anything, right?" It's especially aggravating because Ventris could have easily selected another Ultramarine (or a Mortifactor) to join the Deathwatch team instead of going himself, which would have at least not been a blow to the command structure.

The others are proper douchebags.