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Hey Dakkaites,

I'm a bit unsure which way my templars should go in the not too distant future. Until now i got about 2k pts (or more if i made use of some wargear ^^) but i got the typical take what you like choice of units since i never played that army competitively up to this day. SO now I'm trying to figure out which way to go:

a) A mix of LRCs with troops and a couple of AC Dreads as well as Las/las Preds (for 145 i guess they're okay ) should make for quite a balanced list. Land Speeder Typhoon or Tornado might be an option, but i'm unsure whether they wouldn't be wasted as the only vehicles with AV 10...

or

b) MSU style with deepstriking termies: 5 man squads of twin AC goodness up the board and cyclone toting squads in the back, upped by good old Las/Plas or Plas/Plas Squads. Yeah, there are no vehicles plus the anti psyker vow for a possibly better setup over an underused preferred enemy rule .

Points values should range between 1500 and 2000, nooto here.
Sadly I don't think low AV mech play is really an option with rhinos and razors at the 4th ed price tag. Simillarly I don't think a cc focussed list might work out with BTs as there are little ways except for the expensive LRC to get the squads in the opponents face and footslogging assault units aren't what they used to be with all the firepower shooty lists bring to bear these days.
So the essential question is what do you think would work better in competitive environments? Are there builds for BTs i left out though viable?
(And PLEASE don't comment on C:SM, i want to stick to C:BT.)

IMHO for a competitive templar build you want all the toys that templars and only templars get.

This means tank hunting twin cyclone termies, 145 point trilas preds, las/plas 5 man troop squads, and cheap typhoons if you have the points.

The reason you shouldnt bother with assault cannons on the templar termies is that GK do s7 assault cannon spam miles better than templars. The reason you shouldnt take land raiders for troops is because BA get redeemers as dedicated troop transports AND get a 35 point discount to boot. I say no to autocannon dreads because GK have cornered the dreadnaught market.

Now, this advice does not mean templar LRC or auto dreads are worthless, BUT if another army does something better, and you are trying to decide on templars, why step on another armies toes? Templars still have areas that they outperform all other MEQ armies... focus on only these and the Templars emerge as a competitive force, if a bit limited in options.

Templar LRCs get more stuff for cheaper. 265 for MM pintle AND extra armor!? Sign me up.

Also, TECHMARINES.

You can run a 2000-pt army with 2x Landraiders and a Rhino full of troops using the techmarines.

Their two wounds and access to the armory, combined with IC status and single-transport-slot ability, means they mesh well with LR heavy armies:

1) Can attach to any squad already in LRC.
2) Can be a combat monster with Servo-Harness, Storm Shield, Thunder Hammer.
3) Can repair LRC while riding in it if need be.
4) Meltagun missing? Techies come with signums!

I seriously encourage every BT player to consider bringing a Techmarine. Meshes very, very well with the LRC or LR heavy list.

I second the techmarine but not for vehicle repair but for cc awesomeness. Preferred enemy with his various power weapon and fist attacks makes him pretty nasty.

BT can do some really nasty Terminator spam. At 1,850 I'd run...


HQ

EC w/ AACNtO

Elites

5 Terminators, 2 Cyclones, Tank Hunters

5 Terminators, 2 Cyclones, Tank Hunters

5 Terminators, 2 Cyclones, Tank Hunters

Troops

5 Initiates w/ Lascannon and Plasma gun in Rhino w/ Searchlight & Smoke Launchers

5 Initiates w/ Lascannon and Plasma gun in Rhino w/ Searchlight & Smoke Launchers

5 Initiates w/ Lascannon and Plasma gun in Rhino w/ Searchlight & Smoke Launchers

5 Initiates w/ Lascannon and Plasma gun in Rhino w/ Searchlight & Smoke Launchers

5 Initiates w/ Lascannon and Plasma gun in Rhino w/ Searchlight & Smoke Launchers

Fast Attack

Typhoon

Typhoon



So you're putting out 12 S9 CML shots at range, plus S5 Storm Bolters (lol) from the Terminators. The Initiates can chill out putting out 5 Lascannon shots and 5 PG shots at 24". The EC chills with one of the Terminator squads. If you want, you can deploy the Initiates in cover, and use the Rhinos for cover for the Terminators in case they run forward for taking a casualty. Also, you could leave gaps in your Rhino wall to prevent your Terminators from getting assaulted by things they don't want assaulting them, while still allowing them to fire through.

Then you've got 2 Typhoons chillin in the backfield, another 4 S8 shots per turn plus some Flat-out Objective Capping power.

The whole army has preferred enemy, so it's no slouch in assault either.

Thanks for the input so far.

Techmarine isn't that bad an idea, i think i might tinker around with one of these bad guys

I'm not entirely sure whether I should take any speeders at all. Though i got and LOVE the models, for the points of 2 Typhoon Speeders i get one Pred with tripple Lascannons. I'm not sure yet whether it'd be better to have 4 S8 shots which can also be split or three S9 one tl. But I'm pretty sure I prefer one AV 13 over two AV 10 vehicles Think I'll do some mathhammer here.

By AC Dreads i spoke of assault cannons, which come in at 115 with a HF on a dread, so cheaper than other chapters No Autocannons for BT at all, sadly.

And big thanks to Nuggz for I never realized stormbolters on tankhunter squads were S5 for AV, that is ooooo lights out for Av 10 side/rear armor when deep striking... how in the world could that have gotten past me? ^^

Thanks to everybody for all that sound advice, as soon as I got some representative results I'll let you know (which might take some time though )

Preds with machine spirit are cool. Typhoons are too cheap to worry about av10. Then lazorback spam to support furious charge termies in a land raider.

So I am going with option A.