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Are vanilla marines still a viable army to play? It seems like with all the different chapters they aren't the chapter to choose when you get the same sort of things from other lists but better. Any reason to still play vanilla marines?

Play a chapter who doesn't have a coded but you still like like imperial fist iron hands. Though if would be nicer if every first founding got a codex it probably won't happen.

Things only vanilla have:

Thunderfire cannons wreck infantry
Army wide fleet is possible
Best way to do a marine biker army
Extremely adaptable to any idea you have, to play any chapter


But in short yes they are. I play against all of the newer codex's with my counts as iron hands vanilla marines and do very well.

Yes, they are still viable. But you might have to trick them up by putting them in drop pods/using one of the characters to give them a special tactic (like using Khan to make them outflank).

juraigamer wrote:
Army wide fleet is possible

Really? I did not know that. Thats pretty awesome!

In short yes. Theres some things SW and BA do better or cheaper. But not everything.

ceku wrote:

juraigamer wrote:
Army wide fleet is possible

Really? I did not know that. Thats pretty awesome!

Take shrike as your hq, then for laughs take mass scouts. Infiltrate to 18.0001 inches away from the enemy. Scout move to 12, first turn use move through cover to get up some, then use fleet, then first turn assault. Who needs power armor?

So one advantage for them is their flexibility in fielding units?

juraigamer wrote:

ceku wrote:

juraigamer wrote:
Army wide fleet is possible

Really? I did not know that. Thats pretty awesome!

Take shrike as your hq, then for laughs take mass scouts. Infiltrate to 18.0001 inches away from the enemy. Scout move to 12, first turn use move through cover to get up some, then use fleet, then first turn assault. Who needs power armor?

I don't think you get to infiltrate then use scout move? But if you can, then thats a pretty nasty tactic....

Every army is playable.

ceku wrote:Are vanilla marines still a viable army to play? It seems like with all the different chapters they aren't the chapter to choose when you get the same sort of things from other lists but better. Any reason to still play vanilla marines?

Just out of curiosity, where did you get the idea that they weren't?

I think he might mean Competitively. In which case either run Shrikes fleet or Pedro Kantors Sternguard Spam (which is what im doing)

GangstaMuffin24 wrote:
Just out of curiosity, where did you get the idea that they weren't?

I'm figuring the same question, but I probably figure it's because so many people whine about BA and SW being overpowered when decidedly few people say the same about Vanilla Marines.

Vanilla Marines are perfectly viable. Their codex is well rounded and has better internal balance than most other codices, and new builds are still rearing their heads to this day. One of the more recent ones is Pedro Kantor with an Honor Guard deathstar since he buffs their attacks so much. While it may not dominate the tournaments like some of the more recent books do, it's still perfectly viable and is a quality book. Also, when people whine about Mat Ward and what he's written, they often forget the vanilla Marine codex, which is one of the better books GW has put out since 5th edition.

KnightOfTheRaven wrote:I think he might mean Competitively. In which case either run Shrikes fleet or Pedro Kantors Sternguard Spam (which is what im doing)

Or Vulkan, the guy who were always the most competetive SM HQ...

rodgers37 wrote:

juraigamer wrote:

ceku wrote:

juraigamer wrote:
Army wide fleet is possible

Really? I did not know that. Thats pretty awesome!

Take shrike as your hq, then for laughs take mass scouts. Infiltrate to 18.0001 inches away from the enemy. Scout move to 12, first turn use move through cover to get up some, then use fleet, then first turn assault. Who needs power armor?

I don't think you get to infiltrate then use scout move? But if you can, then thats a pretty nasty tactic....

No. You can either use infiltrate or your scout move. Otherwise that really would be a nasty tactic.

Lord Rogukiel wrote:

No. You can either use infiltrate or your scout move. Otherwise that really would be a nasty tactic.

Hate to say otherwise, but the move is legal. With infiltrate and the scouts USRs, you deploy, then infiltrate, then make scout moves before anyone tries to seize, and then start playing.

juraigamer wrote:

Lord Rogukiel wrote:

No. You can either use infiltrate or your scout move. Otherwise that really would be a nasty tactic.

Hate to say otherwise, but the move is legal. With infiltrate and the scouts USRs, you deploy, then infiltrate, then make scout moves before anyone tries to seize, and then start playing.

Not to bust your chops or anything, but do you have any battle reports or anything with this? If it's really a viable option, I may want to capitalize on it

I'm assuming you mean still viable at the tournament level. In which case, yes, it is.

I've never seen a particular faction so handicapped as to not be viable at the local level. At the tournament level an army may be more difficult to play efficiently, but any faction can win.

The only time you might see a particular faction completely dominate another is when one player is exceptional.

No armies are trully 'gimped'.

If you aren't playing at top level tournaments play the army you like.

If you suck at playing, your army will suck too. Nothing can remedy that.

No battle reports sadly, it's just an army idea I had at one point, and it's a army list that it seems few others run, but it's not that popular.

If you were to want to do it however, I would suggest using shotguns to capitalize on the fact that your armor save is a 4+ and toss a powerfist in every unit. Even taking 6 full squads with just powerfists and shrike would run only 1185 points, more than enough room to add some other stuff, such as land speeder storms if you really want to capitalize on scout useage and you could add some scout bikers if you wanted.

Adding three land speeder storms with multi-meltas to help deal with tanks would bring the total to 1380, and if you really wanted to make sure you didn't have tank problems, putting combi meltas on each squad wouldn't hurt either, for a grand total of 1440 points, leaving just enough points for a single predator tank or something. You could even add a techmarine to repair any damage to your landspeeder.

Vulcan to Victory !