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Hello folks! Fledgling starting out in the new edition after a lengthy pause from the hobby. I'm formulating my first army so I can start slugging it out with my more experienced friends and learn the ropes again. Now I'll throw the composition and numbers at you, but I'm going to include the logic and theory behind my army at the bottom. Consider it optional reading, if you'd like to correct my forethought or suggest better options to fit my concept. Thanks in advance!


HQ Space Marine Captain – 155
Space marine bike
Power weapon, melta bombs

TR Bike Squad (5) – 170
Power weapon and melta bombs
2x Flamers

TR Bike Squad (5) – 170
Power weapon and melta bombs
2x Meltaguns

TR Scout Squad (5) – 100
4 sniper rifles, heavy bolter, cloaks

FA Land Speeder Storm - 50

FA Land Speeder Squadron (2) – 180
Typhoon pattern

HS Whirlwind – 85

HS Predator – 90
Heavy bolters, dozer blade


** What I was aiming for with this list was a highly mobile force that forces the enemy to play on my terms. Originally it was almost completely bikes, but I realized early that because my numbers would be so few due to high unit cost, I would need to strike hard and avoid as many losses of my own troops as possible. The bikes have the turbo save and an extra toughness point to guard them, but they'll be alone on the front lines, so I geared a lot of the army towards heavy fire support. The land speeders act as mobile firing platforms and can use krak missiles against armor, the whirlwind and predator can lay down a lot of hate, and the scouts can use the Storm to quickly deploy on objectives. Most importantly, the Whirlwind and snipers use the Pinning rule, making enemy squads easier prey for my bikes should they fail their rolls. Most units also have the ability to attack enemy vehicles, should the need arise.

Greetings!

Having only one of a unit will make target prioritising easier for your opponent to manage to shoot your units down, for example your land speeder storm.

The armour you have in your list all tend to be low values, and therefore will be easier to take down for a determined adversary, so referring to my above point: take 2 units, otherwise they become handy target practise!

You have no ranged abilities to take down heavy armour such as land raiders, monoliths, etc etc etc, and meltabombs, while good on paper only get one attack, which against a moving target may prove insufficient. For example: a vehicle moves 12", now you need 6s to hit (unless I am mistaken). Meltabombs give you one attack, therefore you have a low chance to hit. The occasional sneaky powerfist could help mitigate this problem

Walkers may also prove difficult for you to handle for similar reasons listed above, a powerfist *may* prove superior in this case. mitigate this problem

Walkers may also prove difficult for you to handle for similar reasons listed above, a powerfist *may* prove superior in this case.

At a low points level the above points could be rendered incorrect, but there will be those occasions where you will wish you had more meltaguns or lascannons.

Other than that, interesting list and good luck!

The issues you are going to run into with this list are a lack of dedicated anti-tank (only 4 Missile Launcher shots, 2 Autocannon shots, and 2 Meltagun shots is a little light) and a general lack of bodies. You will be surprised how little protection +1 toughness affords your bikes, and if they are turbo-boosting around to get saves, they are not shooting.

If you want to run a biker list, you need more bikes and possibly a Command Squad on Bikes to ride with your Captain and give him FNP. I would ditch the Land Speeders and the tanks for Attack Bike Squadrons with Multi-Meltas, and as many Meltaguns as you can get on your bike squads. Either that, or consider Ravenwing Dark Angels since they get cheaper Land Speeder Typhoons.

That said, biker lists are not generally that effective, and they tend to be heinously expensive to purchase. When you say mechanized, I assume I'm going to see a bunch of Tactical Marines in Rhinos, possibly a Land Raider with Assault Terminators, and maybe even Vulkan. Thats certainly not the ONLY way to play Space Marines, but it is a damned effective way.

As your list stands right now, you will likely lose your Land Speeders and your other vehicles early in the game, leaving you with some underwhelming bike units that will get picked off by missiles or massed Bolter fire.

Aldarionn wrote:

That said, biker lists are not generally that effective, and they tend to be heinously expensive to purchase. When you say mechanized, I assume I'm going to see a bunch of Tactical Marines in Rhinos, possibly a Land Raider with Assault Terminators, and maybe even Vulkan. Thats certainly not the ONLY way to play Space Marines, but it is a damned effective way.

Thanks to both of you thus far, the issues you've addressed are certainly some of the bigger ones I've been grappling with.

Aldarionn, specifically in regards to your above quote, this is the other manner in which I was consider playing my army, but I wasn't sure they would be mobile enough to tackle a fight head-on. The bike army, I know, is hellishly expensive per-unit, and one of the only ways to improve them I've seen is with White Scars rules. On the other hand, the Rhino/Raider armies always strike me as being vulnerable to early anti-armor strikes; losing two tac teams to lucky strikes on my Rhinos would certainly hurt my chances of victory.

So in that vein of thought, a new question to y'all; setting aside that 1000pt isn't going to be a huge army to begin with, is there a way to combine offensive armor like the Predator and Whirlwind with fast transport, without making myself an easy target?

Thanks again!

Absolutely! It's called Blood Angels! All of their vehicles are fast, and they have Assault Squads as troops that cut 35 points off the cost of their transports if you remove the Jump Packs. Also, they get Land Raiders as dedicated transports for higher point levels, so they can field insanely fast, high armored spearheads with strong melee capabilities. If you want a highly armored fast list, Blood Angels is the way to go.

For instance:

Librarian (Shield of Sanguinius, Another Power) - 100
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Meltagun, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 165
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 155
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 155
Baal Predator (TL Assault Cannon, Sponsion Heavy Bolters) - 145
Baal Predator (TL Assault Cannon, Sponsion Heavy Bolters) - 145
Predator (Autocannon, Sponsions Lascannons) - 135
Total 1,000

This list has a ton of offensive ranged firepower and everything is fast! The Predators can move 6" and fire everything, or 12" and one weapon. The Razorback can move 12" and fire a Lascannon shot or a Plasma Gun shot (or 2 shots if within 12"), and they can move 6" and fire both. The Baal Predators can also take an 18" flat-out scout move and be right in your opponents face on the first turn, and if they pop smoke on their scout move, they retain in against your opponents shooting even if they move and shoot on your turn (the way smoke is worded, they gain the cover save on "your opponents next shooting phase", meaning if you go first you get it on your opponents turn, and since it was used on the Scout Move, you can shoot on your turn). At 1,500 you basically add more of the same, and at some point you can add a Land Raider or two with a large unit inside. With Sanguinary Priests and Unleashed Rage from a Librarian, such units can tear through opposing troops without much trouble.

If you are concerned about the choice of Chapter, most people won't mind if you paint them however you want and just use the Blood Angels rules, as long as you are 100% clear about what codex you are using at the start of the game.

Hope that's what you're looking for!

Someone should whirlwinds are very limited.

Rhinos charging forward with three preds supporting would work.

Dev. squads with bikes could work.
numerous typhoons with bikes could work.
Outflanking bikes would work.

You could do a bike and dread list but that would have to be slower than your needs.

Aldarionn wrote:Absolutely! It's called Blood Angels! All of their vehicles are fast, and they have Assault Squads as troops that cut 35 points off the cost of their transports if you remove the Jump Packs. Also, they get Land Raiders as dedicated transports for higher point levels, so they can field insanely fast, high armored spearheads with strong melee capabilities. If you want a highly armored fast list, Blood Angels is the way to go.

For instance:

Librarian (Shield of Sanguinius, Another Power) - 100
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Meltagun, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 165
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 155
5 Assault Marines (No Jump Packs, Razorback w/ Lascannon & TL Plasma Gun) - 155
Baal Predator (TL Assault Cannon, Sponsion Heavy Bolters) - 145
Baal Predator (TL Assault Cannon, Sponsion Heavy Bolters) - 145
Predator (Autocannon, Sponsions Lascannons) - 135
Total 1,000

This list has a ton of offensive ranged firepower and everything is fast! The Predators can move 6" and fire everything, or 12" and one weapon. The Razorback can move 12" and fire a Lascannon shot or a Plasma Gun shot (or 2 shots if within 12"), and they can move 6" and fire both. The Baal Predators can also take an 18" flat-out scout move and be right in your opponents face on the first turn, and if they pop smoke on their scout move, they retain in against your opponents shooting even if they move and shoot on your turn (the way smoke is worded, they gain the cover save on "your opponents next shooting phase", meaning if you go first you get it on your opponents turn, and since it was used on the Scout Move, you can shoot on your turn). At 1,500 you basically add more of the same, and at some point you can add a Land Raider or two with a large unit inside. With Sanguinary Priests and Unleashed Rage from a Librarian, such units can tear through opposing troops without much trouble.

If you are concerned about the choice of Chapter, most people won't mind if you paint them however you want and just use the Blood Angels rules, as long as you are 100% clear about what codex you are using at the start of the game.

Hope that's what you're looking for!

Mercy, that's an evil looking force. I wish I'd read up on Blood Angels before, that looks like exactly the kind of army I wanted! Thanks very much, sir.

I already went to the trouble of selecting a personal chapter color scheme and some fluff, but considering I haven't actually bought more than a bike so far, it wouldn't be much trouble to tweak some things to my own needs. I'll see what I can wrangle up.

Thanks again, everyone! If you have any more advice for a mechanized fledgling's tactica, I'd still be most grateful.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Er, hate to do it but, a quick bump for a question that's been itching my brain... isn't a Predator with sponson lascannons 120pts? 60 for the predator, 60 for the lases? Do BA's have different point values than the basic SM codex?

For that matter, if I'm right and there's an extra 15 points in there, should I add something else? Storm bolter, equip some dozers to get to the enemy faster, switch the predator out for a whirlwind or vindicator or summin'?