Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm going for a list with plenty of target saturation as my opponents focus on killing the most important units. To me this list works because i have so many people on the feild that 30+ lascannon spam is no worry and catch my opponents with a lack of anti inf power


HQ

2x mekboy, KFF,PK 110x2

6x 29 slugga boyz, PK nob, stikbombz 242x6

2x 3 nobs + painboy, 2 PK, 1 Big choppa 165x2

Basically its a pure horde Meks go with Nobs and hide in boyz until they reach their target(big baddies that need many PK's)
Boys tarpit MC's and use stickbombs on tanks while just plain covering the board

What ya think
and yes i enjoy rolling 736 dice in a single turn

If you're footslogging up the board, give them Shootas.

The only thing I'm thinking is that the PK is rather useless on the Big Meks. I've tried it, and it just did not work out well for me, here's why.
Being IC's, they can be singled out in CC, even if you have them in a squad, and with only 2 wounds, and only a 6+ save (since his KFF doesn't work in CC), he's going to get wrecked before you get the chance to get to the I1 stage.

A burna, on the other hand, would give him not only a shooting weapon that never uses his horrid bs skill (and in fact always hits), ignores cover saves, and acts as a power weapon in CC.
You'll have to choose between using it as one or the other each turn, but it's usually pretty obvious which one you need to do.

Or, you could ditch giving them any upgrade other than KFF, and use them solely for support, which nets you 50 extra points, 40 of which you can use for Cybork bodies on your nobs, and 10 for whatever else you may think is important ('Eavy armor on your Big Meks wouldn't be a bad idea.)

Also, something I forgot to mention, which bombboy beat me to saying, is shootas. Statistically, footslogging shootas will get more kills in shooting + assault phases combined than sluggas would.

noted input on the PK meks
however i wont run shootas for a simple reason
they are slower
if i have to stop and shoot i will loose as i play shoot heavy opponents.
i need to reach him and stunt his shooting
also when im shooting ANYONE can shoot me back
getting into combat 1 turn faster is safer for me

It's a different take on a green tide and I like it. But yes as stated meks are really there for the KFF, some people will even have the meks detach from the unit before assaulting to prptect them, but in reality go either way once they have made it to the lines they have done their job. I would run them in an upside down triangle from your board edge, 2 boyz mobs in front and one in the rear, this would give your meks in the nobz a 4+ cover save with the boyz in the front add on feel no pain and they will hopefully hang in there as only 4 strong means 1 death and you have a panic test to deal with. I would drop the stikkbombs and run them with shootas and big shootas as well if possible. If you really want Ork Saturation you could drop 2 units of boyz maybe 1, throw in a unit or 2 of 29 gretchin pit the meks in the front giving them a 5+ and the boyz behind a 5+ then maybe boosting the nobz units and diversifying them with a painboy for shenenaigans. You'll recoup the Pks lost with the boyz nobs with these nobs groups and they would just destroy in close combat.

docbrown wrote:noted input on the PK meks
however i wont run shootas for a simple reason
they are slower
if i have to stop and shoot i will loose as i play shoot heavy opponents.
i need to reach him and stunt his shooting
also when im shooting ANYONE can shoot me back
getting into combat 1 turn faster is safer for me

Shootas are assault weapons IIRC....I NEED TO FIND MY DARN ORK CODEX....has to be around here somewhere
so you don't need to stop and shoot

I think he means he wants to run every turn rather than shoot.

Obrek wrote:I think he means he wants to run every turn rather than shoot.

Aaaaah I see, but he said he had to "stop" to shoot, if you move that's not really stopping now is it?

But if you really want slugga boyz, at least take 2 mobs of shoota boyz to sit on objectives, it's hard to dislodge 30 models off an objective...

You'll get kited to death be DE with their OMFG HOW MANY SPLINTER CANNONS DO YOU HAVE? spam

Just to clarify.
When I say saturation I mean every unit is basically the same in terms of capacity. Everything has stilbombs so anything can cc a vehicle. Everything has power claws for high armor.
As for the shooting it's cause I want that extra bit of ruunning as opposed to shooting. I'm safer if I'm in cc as its 1v1. As for objectives. 30'orks can magically cover allot of ground. As an ex tau player I do lengthy screens well and can stretch the board. Defending objectives at 18 in is easy with sluggas odds are my objectives will get pot shotted from 48 or more. I'd rather be able to demolish charging hormagaunts then annoy pot shooting guardians.

The other thing is our board is constricting and hard for vehicles to rum around in. Getting cc on a vanquisher is easy. Some normal tactics are unnecessary on this table. Plus this army is nice for 3 4and 5 player games when everything is high powered type stuff.

Do not take stikbombs.
Do take something that can actually kill.

You'll win for the wrong reasons. Either the army can take out this many models or it can't.

Watch out for purifiers and blood talons.

I think you'll probably win games because you have so many damn Orks! However you don't have anything at range for armour, so mech lists will be a big head ache, especially as you have limited power klaws. A decent shooting army i.e mech Guard should be able to focus it's fire power and easily take out a horde within two turns, when you get close that should increase to two hordes thanks to all the heavy flamers on the tanks. I also think D.E will be a problem thanks to splinter cannons.

Other wise I think it's a interesting list, apart from the Nobz, no point in them in this list. A min unit of Lootas would be great.

Dark Eldar? Hah, throw in some Lootas and laugh as he breaks down and cry

If my math is right your at 2002? lol

we have a 3pt over flex and a 5 pt differential flex

docbrown wrote:however i wont run shootas for a simple reason
they are slower
if i have to stop and shoot i will loose as i play shoot heavy opponents.
i need to reach him and stunt his shooting
also when im shooting ANYONE can shoot me back
getting into combat 1 turn faster is safer for me

I was going to point out that you'll deal more damage in the long run with shootas, but I understand your want to get stuck in quickly. I'm assuming that you aren't mechanized because of the 30+ lascannon spam? So, let's say 30 lascannons to start with. 15 of them hit. 2.5 glancing hits and 2.5 penetrating hits. After the KFF, it's 1.25 glancing and 1.25 penetrating hits. At 2k points, you can easily field 4 battlewagons. Just a pointer. We expect to lose a BW or two on the charge, but getting 2-3 units of 20 boyz stuck in that soon is....well, you know

Hargus56 wrote:It's a different take on a green tide and I like it. But yes as stated meks are really there for the KFF, some people will even have the meks detach from the unit before assaulting to prptect them, but in reality go either way once they have made it to the lines they have done their job. I would run them in an upside down triangle from your board edge, 2 boyz mobs in front and one in the rear, this would give your meks in the nobz a 4+ cover save with the boyz in the front add on feel no pain and they will hopefully hang in there as only 4 strong means 1 death and you have a panic test to deal with. I would drop the stikkbombs and run them with shootas and big shootas as well if possible. If you really want Ork Saturation you could drop 2 units of boyz maybe 1, throw in a unit or 2 of 29 gretchin pit the meks in the front giving them a 5+ and the boyz behind a 5+ then maybe boosting the nobz units and diversifying them with a painboy for shenenaigans. You'll recoup the Pks lost with the boyz nobs with these nobs groups and they would just destroy in close combat.

It's not a bad idea, but I'd veto the gretchin. You need a lot of room to provide that cover, and you mentioned that your battlefield is cluttered.....they could very well make it take ANOTHER round for your boyz to get stuck in.

I'd drop the stikkbombs normally. You've got 180+ points tied up there, which is another unit. Again though, with the cluttered battlefield, you know better if they will actually help you for assaults(IG), because quite often, orks go last anyway.

bombboy1252 wrote:
Shootas are assault weapons IIRC....I NEED TO FIND MY DARN ORK CODEX....has to be around here somewhere
so you don't need to stop and shoot

Yes, you have remembered correctly, they are assault 2.

docbrown wrote:
noted input on the PK meks
however i wont run shootas for a simple reason
they are slower
if i have to stop and shoot i will loose as i play shoot heavy opponents.
i need to reach him and stunt his shooting
also when im shooting ANYONE can shoot me back
getting into combat 1 turn faster is safer for me

AchillesFTW wrote:You'll get kited to death be DE with their OMFG HOW MANY SPLINTER CANNONS DO YOU HAVE? spam

Shootas would help against this, but not fix the problem. A horde of 180+ boxes a lot of things in, the question is whether they can leapfrog you far enough away to avoid assault the following round.

docbrown wrote:Just to clarify.
When I say saturation I mean every unit is basically the same in terms of capacity. Everything has stilbombs so anything can cc a vehicle. Everything has power claws for high armor.
As for the shooting it's cause I want that extra bit of ruunning as opposed to shooting. I'm safer if I'm in cc as its 1v1. As for objectives. 30'orks can magically cover allot of ground. As an ex tau player I do lengthy screens well and can stretch the board. Defending objectives at 18 in is easy with sluggas odds are my objectives will get pot shotted from 48 or more. I'd rather be able to demolish charging hormagaunts then annoy pot shooting guardians.

The other thing is our board is constricting and hard for vehicles to rum around in. Getting cc on a vanquisher is easy. Some normal tactics are unnecessary on this table. Plus this army is nice for 3 4and 5 player games when everything is high powered type stuff.

Does this same board pose problems maneuvering a Green Tide army?

MFletch wrote:Do not take stikbombs.
Do take something that can actually kill.

You'll win for the wrong reasons. Either the army can take out this many models or it can't.

Watch out for purifiers and blood talons.

Again, a lot of points that can be used on something else.

I'd like to say that units of 4 nobs probably do very little for you here. They suffer from instant death with lascannon hits, and FNP will be meaningless. They'll sustain focused fire from all those cannons and be out of the picture quickly. At 165 a pop, they're only fielding 8 wounds, or 4 lascannon hits.

Some options to consider:

Kommandos: With Snikrot, it's a time-bomb, particularly for Infantry IG. With so many HWT's, you're bound to have targets to go after. With all the terrain clutter, you're bound to benefit from move through cover. This can occasionally work as fear tactics, people may deploy further from the table edge, and closer to your vanguard because of this.

Lootas: Instant long range dakka. Good against DE, and light vehicles, and still has some value as anti-infantry.

Deffkoptas: Single koptas can assault a HWT squad of three and expect to come out of the turn without a single wound. Even if it's only killing them slowly, it's destroying their chance to shoot in the next turn! 35 points is cheap for that, or for 45 points, the TL-Rokkit launcha will instant kill a HWT! I still like the idea of 105 points tying up 9 Lascannons.

One more point: When you assault the vehicles, your boyz are attacking 4 times each at S4 with furious charge.....better than a single S4 grenade attack. Don't forget that PK nob with his 4 S9 PK attacks too. Ignore the tank-popping that stikkbombs don't really provide. Vehicles aren't locked in combat so you assault each time, negating the idea that stikkbombs give you S4 every round against vehicles. With dreads as an exception to getting "stuck in", the stikkbombs don't matter because you're typically looking at AV12(front armor) in CC against them.

Just some thoughts.

Stickbombz are only s4?
If so ya il dropem
As for what I'll spendem on I don't know
The board is not to constricting for troops as the more constricted the path the safer it is. And I can always charge across dangerous ice lake if I need open space

I'll probably just use the points to beef the nobz up. I don't want trukks or bw's. The guys at our table rip peices into a unit worth 300+ and can be killed via 1 shot. Keep in mind vendettas ect can get aide and rear armor. No matter what it takes important trannies go down and often tale their riders with them. The people that use meq armies hate land raiders because they never manage anything for them.

As for the nobz increasing their size will help but yes they are vulnerable. That's why there not leading the charge

Ps how can you get 4 battlewagons there's 3 slots

Yes, stikkbombs are frag grenades, which are assault grenades: S4+d6....it's in the box in assaulting vehicles.

3 Heavy Support Slots.

Each Nobz or Meganobz unit can have a battlewagon as a dedicated transport.

Theoretically, a list could field 8 battlewagons. 3 Heavy Support, 3 Elite Nobz/meganobz units with battlewagons, and with 2 warbosses as HQ's, 2 more nobz/meganobz units as troops with battlewagons. The problem is, you can't get those KFF Big Meks if you're taking warbosses.

I dont subscribe to must have kffs. As tau I used to get that for 5points so I find that setup expensive. Although I might consider a bw spam army one day

I don't always take it, depends on the game and my mood, but I'm often sacrificing efficiency when I don't.

Yes, it's cheaper for Tau, but they fight differently too. A PF in IG only costs 15 points as opposed to 25 for Marines because it's more effective on a marine sergeant. Likewise the KFF on the Big Mek. Trust us greenskins.....the KFF is efficient. Kan Wall lists are an incredible example of how efficient the KFF is.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean, being able to give 11 vehicles a 4+ cover save that in turn provide 120+ more models a 4+ for 100 points?

Boris420 wrote:Dark Eldar? Hah, throw in some Lootas and laugh as he breaks down and cry

Lootas which can only target max 3 units a turn? . No Lootas in this list (which are needed), so wouldn't be a worry for D.E.