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Say, what's your take on giving an opponent advice? Do you often help your foes or trick them?

I personally help on occasion when the match has started "you should put the other combat squad on the objective" and allow them to make a puny redeploy. then by the end, especially if I'm losing badly, I might trick them "you forgot to make this unit assault"

Magic the Gathering
-hey, look, if you get all your flying monsters to attack, I can't block them so you'd win
-OK, I'll do that *start picking up cards*
-nah, I stop all damage this turn with this card and attack you while your defenses are down - WIN

though I guess most of you are nice enough to remind people of a rule they may have forgotten "isn't this unit with a Slaan immune to Psychology?"

Of course, even I'd think you're a bad person if you did it chronically to new players.

Lawful Evil tricks that is, not blatant lying or cheating.

i dont think it pays to be a douche to the other player. Especially a newbbb. I play with my friends and I always try to help them out not screw them over. But if i was playing with a guy i dont know at the comic book store the only thing I'd correct him with are the rules of the game. So if he decides that his raider can move 36 inches because its a skimmer hes got another thing coming.

i generally stay neutral on this point until i begin to win, then i will give them real advice (close games are always better)

If I'm going to suggest things to my opponent, I'm going to suggest to them what I genuinely believe is the best course of action.

If you are trying to trick a player at any time, nevermind if you are being beaten by them you deserve to lose.

i dont give advice at all when losing, because they are blatantly better (or more lucky) than me!

i dont take advice ever, i prefer to win (or lose) of my own accord

notprop, the OP was probably seeing if people give advice when playing, i do, i think its a perfectly normal question.

I don't give advice, how are they to learn if they do not make mistakes?

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake" - Napoleon

how about Good Advice that's bad for you tactically just because you want your mean HQ unit to survive?
"say, wouldn't you much rather fire that artillery at this dangerous looking assault squad than these guys who are all the way over here?"

or maybe the opposite
"say wouldn't you rather use those basilisks to target my 2+Sv HQ instead of that cheap assault squad?"

or a mix
"my IG Command Unit is within site you should target them. but they do have camo cloaks (the cloaks are not moddeled on so I'm inclined to repeat that), so they'll be harder to kill induvidually"
just so I have a 50% chance one something else survives instead. then if he targets the Command Squad I get them to duck for a 2+ Cover Save, because, well, it feels neccessary, regardless of how tactical it is.

do you remind them that the unit with 'Stealth' they just moved won't get a cover save from your nearby heavy flamers?

should it be repeated that you're deploying this unit of Genestealers and your opponent seems to have completely forgotten so they're deploying thier own infiltrators within assault range?

do you say that thier Orks can get another round of shooting when they say they're going to run instead?

do you tell your opponent that thier Railgun won't 'Instant Death' your Daemon Prince?

If I'm comfortably winning mid game then I help and vice versa. when the opportunities arrise of course.

shadowsnip wrote:But if i was playing with a guy i dont know at the comic book store the only thing I'd correct him with are the rules of the game. So if he decides that his raider can move 36 inches because its a skimmer hes got another thing coming.

As a new player who isn't learning the game from a friend, I'm kinda relying on insights from strangers to learn the game. I have no problem with making mistakes because I'm inexperienced, this is bound to happen and I don't expect people to hold my hand through everything, but some friendly advice from experienced players or explanations of why what I did was a mistake would definitely be appreciated.

I'm not criticizing you for not helping a fair opponent (especially if they're boasting), just asking that if a player explains to you that they're new to the game, you give them the time of day.

Uh, if I'm giving advice, then I'm giving them the advice that I genuinely think will be best for them. Are any of your situations what I genuinely think will be the best course of action for my opponent? If so, then yes, I would suggest it.

Melonfish wrote:I don't give advice, how are they to learn if they do not make mistakes?

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake" - Napoleon

So much fail with that statement.

I think it's fine for the tournament scene. If I'm playing a casual game though, it's more about completely understanding what's going on. I frequently will openly share my thoughts about what I'm planning on doing and ask my opponent what he's thinking as well. It's awesome for understanding the mentality of a player of an army that you don't yourself play.

I will offer advice only if I feel they are making an error out of ignorance of something in my army. Like forgetting where my KFF is or that my BW has a deffrolla when the tourney has us remove them.

I don't want them to waste stuff doing something that is going to waste his time due to a 'trap card' bs.

Also, if the game is 'over' where someone clearly has the advantage, I like to reiterate the objectives so we both remember what we need to be playing for. I don't like when someone has clearly beat me but then loses because the TO announced "time almost up" and he forgets to move something to an objective. Interrupting the game breaks people's train of thought and he would have clearly been able to move to that table quarter or objective.

I think if you are at top tables, and games matter, then advice is much less flowing.

My stance of the handing out of advice:

If you are teaching someone/learning yourself, then it's all fine and dandy to dish out/receive rules corrections and tactical advice (because we are learning, and this kind of thing is important to the learning process).

Between two learned and experienced players, no tactical advice should be given until the game has finished. Only rules corrections may be given/received (e.g. "this guy moves 8","no he doesn't, BRB pg XY). If my opponent makes a bad move, that is his tactical decision to make, similarly, I do not expect to receive any in return (I should learn from my mistakes).

I will only give advice or reminder if I think my opponent have forgotten something:

"I think you forgot to move that unit".

I never give tactical advise nor do I try to trick them, simply because I don't like it when the other guy do it...

I play an army that many of my opponents are unfamiliar with (Daemons), so I'm generous with the advice I'll give. It's never in the form of "you should do exactly this" or "that was a bad move, do this instead," which just comes off as condescension to me---I prefer to just give casual reminders: e.g., "Hey, remember my Fiends have Hit & Run" or "Keep in mind Bloodthirster's WS10, so you'll be hitting on 5's..." if it looks like they're thinking about charging. I want them to know my army as well as I know theirs. Once the game is through, I'll give general advice (like, "these probably would've done better deployed here"), but until then I like to let my opponent command their own army.

If you're just exploiting an opponent's mistakes (or allowing them to happen), I think you're playing for a meaningless win. If an opponent forgets to move, run, shoot, cast a psychic power, whatever, I will usually remind them of it (or let them go ahead with the move if they remember too late). They will often extend me the same courtesy and we will have a good, even fight. Added bonus, you'll never have to hear anyone griping "Oh if I'd only remember to move/shoot/assault with this, it would've been a totally different game..." and the satisfaction that you defeated them on strategy, not on silly memory games. I can understand why people play cagier in competitive environments, but for casual play it's just ridiculous.

*Edit: As for deliberately trying to mislead people, I think it's a pretty absurd trick to pull. If your goal is to antagonize a person you're supposed to be having fun with, then I guess it's a great idea.

daedalus wrote:If I'm going to suggest things to my opponent, I'm going to suggest to them what I genuinely believe is the best course of action.

Exactly. I play with my friends.

To remind them to do something or point out a potential move so I can screw them with it would be a dick move.

Don't be a dick.

To the OP, do you also suggest your friends start night school so that you can get alone time with their wife/girlfriends?

I give advice after the game or if I'm teaching a new player. I'll remind my opponent of things he's missed sometimes, but if you give too much advice you run the risk of basically playing against yourself.

Depends if it's welcome. If you constantly point stuff out that you think the other player is getting 'wrong' (tactics not rules) you'll just annoy them, and rightfully so.

I only give advice if I'm teaching someone how to play or if my opponent is very unfamiliar with the army I'm playing. Even then, I'll merely explain their different options to them, making sure they know the different capabilities of different units, and let them make up their own mind.

Other than that, I'll usually remind someone if they've forgotten to do something, but I don't usually give any kind of advice.

In my opinion, giving "advice" with the deliberate intention of misleading your opponent into doing something to their own detriment is unsportsmanlike. If I knew someone were attempting to do that to me, I'd exercise my right to not play them anymore.

When I'm not playing in tournaments I play open handed, meaning I remind my friends of missed things, and or miss interpretations, but its seldom needed. Sometimes I even voice my tactics aloud and see if my gambles pay off, as a sort of friendly challenge!

In tourneys I say nothing.

In a friendly game I would hope information would flow in both directions, especially if someone is learing the game, new army, etc...

In a tournament, probably much less so.