Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Lets say you are in combat with a weak unit and you are expecting a flank charge from a stronger unit. After combat, can you combat reform and show your weaker enemy your flank in anticipation of the scarier attack.

Was thinking no for some reason, but BRB pg. 55 specifically mentions "...to allow the unit to turn to face its enemy..."

Just can't use it to move someone who was in btb out of it.

You can do that show the weak unit your flank and the front to the strong unit.

The thing is you must leave all models in base to base with the enemy where they are they can turn but you cannot take them out of combat.

So the answer would be no since you can't have command models in the second rank or further?

the answer is maybe. if all of the models in base are regular guys then yes you can do this. ive done this with a horde that was fighting a lone character model since none of the command was in b2b.

cowpow16 wrote:You can do that show the weak unit your flank and the front to the strong unit.

The thing is you must leave all models in base to base with the enemy where they are they can turn but you cannot take them out of combat.

No,
RnF model A (Front Rank, 1 guy) is the same RnF O (3rd Rank, 5 guy). The same model is in combat. For Command Models the same way except for the Champian. Since Banner and Musician cannot be targeted, putting another RnF in its place will statify the rules. A Character can not be moved around where its lesses the atacks on him.

Because you have to have the same number attacks on the models you may no beable to face a pending charge. The only way you can face a pending charge is if you have as many ranks as you do front. (5x5). After the charge and you win or (lose with a passed test using break modifier roll) can reform to face the flank. model just has to be in base contact with someone.

Actually the command models must allways be in the first rank, so if they have base to base with the weak unit reforming them to another facing would be impossible (as you take at least 2 of them out of combat).
Unless maybe you only have one of them that might be doable.

Sorry this happened to me the other day. But it was a horde of marauders against skele archers or warriors 5 wide and a unit with a prince was set up to flank them and none of the command was in base to base (there was no one to challenge in the skele unit in cc).

So the reform was doable took no one out of cc and faced them other warriors.

That does work tho as far as my opponent and I figured no one moved out of cc the skeles and they would all get their attacks soo that was all good.

Yea in that case it works, pretty neat too.

I am pretty sure it is yes provided you have no more or no less models in btb with the unit engaging you after the the reform than before it.

Looks like a combat reform is a normal reform in all respects, minus the restriction mentioned above. So, really, as long as you keep the same models in b2b, you can shuffle the unit around however you want, minus characters and champions, yes-yes?

A 10X5 unit of Marauders in combat with a 5Xwhatever unit could become a 7X7 unit with its front facing a new foe. And it better do so before the charge, since you can't make combat reforms when you're engaged on two sides.

Warpsolution wrote:.... since you can't make combat reforms when you're engaged on two sides.

Which really sucks when the one side only has 1guy left and you want to reform to the muilti rank flanking unit.

I thought that command members could be in the back ranks, you just didnt get the benefit of them and they counted as a normal rnf. If that's the case, a reform would be possible. Even if it isn't possible, what would prevent you from having your command (and any characters in the unit) from 'making way'? Do the make way rules state you cant make way to a second charge if you're already engaged? I'm at work and can't check my BRB.

the models that are in B2B must remain in B2B and command models may never be in the second rank of a unit (exception Bretonnian lance). Non-characters can't make way and this includes the standard, musician, and the champion.

Sooo... in other words, combat reforms are specifically prohibited if you have paid points for HQ?

Seems silly to me.

Not entirely. You can still combat reform to add or remove ranks. For instance, if you start off 5wide, 8deep and are fighting a monster with no ranks, you can switch to a 10 wide horde to get another rank of attacks. Similarly, if you are in Horde and are fighting a much smaller unit (say, a horde of 25mm bases against a 5 wide unit on 20mm bases, you can remove the excess files to add ranks for CR and to combat Steadfast.

Hellstorm wrote:the models that are in B2B must remain in B2B and command models may never be in the second rank of a unit (exception Bretonnian lance). Non-characters can't make way and this includes the standard, musician, and the champion.

Command models can be in the 2nd rank of the unit if a character has displaced them, although it will rarely happen outside of Monsterous infantry units or a unit that has 5 characters in it.

Grey Templar wrote:

Hellstorm wrote:the models that are in B2B must remain in B2B and command models may never be in the second rank of a unit (exception Bretonnian lance). Non-characters can't make way and this includes the standard, musician, and the champion.

Command models can be in the 2nd rank of the unit if a character has displaced them, although it will rarely happen outside of Monsterous infantry units or a unit that has 5 characters in it.

No actually the command displace characters to the back (brets excluded), the character can however make way and displce a command model when combat occurs.

I meant with Make Way.