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This query is not so much about the technique of "Washing" "Glazing" or "Inking," but more about the wash, glaze or ink being used.

Fundamentally, whats the difference?
Am I right in thinking these are all just three fancy names for "watered down paint?" (and are basically the same thing.)

Or are inks and washes different?
Or glazes and washes?

Thanks.

Glazes are generally used to change the hue of colours already painted whereas washes/inks are used to sink into the crevices of the model to darken the shades. Not sure what the difference is between the old GW inks compared to their washes now though, I never had a chance to use them.

Chris P Bacon wrote:Glazes are generally used to change the hue of colours already painted whereas washes/inks are used to sink into the crevices of the model to darken the shades. Not sure what the difference is between the old GW inks compared to their washes now though, I never had a chance to use them.

The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%). Once a ink wash was on there if you got the model wet ( putting more ink on, wet-blending) again the ink would run. As you said they where designed to run and pool into the crevises on models where you would want a strong shade ( like a shadow or a fold in cloth).

The washes are just like you said, to change the hue of already painted areas. They dry flat (ie no glossy) and once dry can be painted over or have more wash applied over it without it running. =o]

Man do I miss the Inks... anyone know where to get something comparable to the old GW inks? Or of a way to make something similar?

http://www.dickblick.com/products/daler-rowney-fw-acrylic-water-resistant-artists-ink/

Not too terrible price wise, but how do they compare?

JoeyHeadwounds wrote:Man do I miss the Inks... anyone know where to get something comparable to the old GW inks? Or of a way to make something similar?

I think Vallejo has some inks in their Game Color range. Not sure though, if they have discontinued them in favor of their new washes, same as GW did.

Cheers,


IK-Painter

FabricatorGeneralMike wrote:

Chris P Bacon wrote:Glazes are generally used to change the hue of colours already painted whereas washes/inks are used to sink into the crevices of the model to darken the shades. Not sure what the difference is between the old GW inks compared to their washes now though, I never had a chance to use them.

The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%). Once a ink wash was on there if you got the model wet ( putting more ink on, wet-blending) again the ink would run. As you said they where designed to run and pool into the crevises on models where you would want a strong shade ( like a shadow or a fold in cloth).

The washes are just like you said, to change the hue of already painted areas. They dry flat (ie no glossy) and once dry can be painted over or have more wash applied over it without it running. =o]

This still doesn't clear up my confusion. Are they essentially the same thing? Watered down paint, just different colors?

For example; if you want to glaze an area with a darker color, could you use a wash or an ink and just use the glazing technique?

Or if you wanted to change the shade of a color in crevices, could you just use a glaze with the washing technique?

I know inks are supposed to "dry glossy." But if you sprayed some matte varnish over it, at the end of the day, would it be any different than a wash?

The difference would be the ink is a little stronger than the wash. With the matte varnish it would look roughly the same but the effect would be "deeper". Glazing is somewhat similar yet a bit different as well. Glazing is more of putting the wash/ink/watered paint on the surface as a whole, for example a blue ink/wash on silver to give a metallic blue rather than say applying a turquoise one in the recesses of bronze to create verdigris effect. They're very similar and in fact both could probably be considered a glaze, sort of how the NMM technique is more of a mix of blending and feathering.

The name likely just stuck with it to simplify the explanation.

n0t_u wrote:The difference would be the ink is a little stronger than the wash. With the matte varnish it would look roughly the same but the effect would be "deeper". Glazing is somewhat similar yet a bit different as well. Glazing is more of putting the wash/ink/watered paint on the surface as a whole, for example a blue ink/wash on silver to give a metallic blue rather than say applying a turquoise one in the recesses of bronze to create verdigris effect. They're very similar and in fact both could probably be considered a glaze, sort of how the NMM technique is more of a mix of blending and feathering.

The name likely just stuck with it to simplify the explanation.

Like n0t_u said, the main difference is, that the inks are stronger that the washes. They both have the same consistency, but the inks contain much more pigment than washes. Therefore inks should be applied much more sparingly than washes.

Cheers,


IK-Painter

FabricatorGeneralMike wrote:


The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%).

I would be very interested in buying these washes for cheaper from windsor & newton but my google-fu is weak. Could you help point me in the right direction?

Kouzuki wrote:This still doesn't clear up my confusion. Are they essentially the same thing? Watered down paint, just different colors?

Well, from a ingredients point of view, none of them could be considered to be "watered-down paint", as such.

A glaze has ingredients (such as flow-aid) which allow it to drop water surface tension down to a negligible effect, allowing you to cover the model with a thin, equally strong layer of colour over all the areas. Think of a glaze as a colour-filter on the parts of the model you give it to.

Example of a brown glaze over a white undercoat (scales only):-


A wash has ingredients which increase the water tension properties, meaning that it clumps together in crevices and the lower parts of the model as much as possible. They are used for shading mostly.

Example of Devlan Mud wash over a white undercoat:-


An ink is an interesting one because it's not really been made for model painting out of the box, the old inks were used because there was not really anything else available at the time. Not to say they are bad, but that they weren't really suited for simple miniature painting. Inks' main feature, which helps artists who use them (myself included) is a very strong rich colour which requires very few coats to become vibrant (due to high pigment content) and that they are transparent. You can put as many coats of ink onto a model as you like and it will increase the tone and hue but will not become opaque at any time. Inks on models tend to do both a glaze and wash effect at the same time.

Example of a straight ink over a white undercoat:-

Kouzuki wrote:

FabricatorGeneralMike wrote:

Chris P Bacon wrote:Glazes are generally used to change the hue of colours already painted whereas washes/inks are used to sink into the crevices of the model to darken the shades. Not sure what the difference is between the old GW inks compared to their washes now though, I never had a chance to use them.

The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%). Once a ink wash was on there if you got the model wet ( putting more ink on, wet-blending) again the ink would run. As you said they where designed to run and pool into the crevises on models where you would want a strong shade ( like a shadow or a fold in cloth).

The washes are just like you said, to change the hue of already painted areas. They dry flat (ie no glossy) and once dry can be painted over or have more wash applied over it without it running. =o]

This still doesn't clear up my confusion. Are they essentially the same thing? Watered down paint, just different colors?

For example; if you want to glaze an area with a darker color, could you use a wash or an ink and just use the glazing technique?

Or if you wanted to change the shade of a color in crevices, could you just use a glaze with the washing technique?

I know inks are supposed to "dry glossy." But if you sprayed some matte varnish over it, at the end of the day, would it be any different than a wash?

Essentially the same thing? To a certain degree since their consistencies are somewhat similar but their uses are much different. (Edit: by that I mean they're both much thinner than Acrylic paint but their ingerdients are still different. This is usually where people get confused about the two, assuming they're both "just watered down paint")
If you tried to glaze an area with a wash the general colour would change a little bit but wouldn't have the best results, you'd end up with blotchy areas on your flat surfaces and most of the wash would run into the deeper parts of the model (at least that's what's happened when I have tried that).
If you wanted to change the colour of your shades in crevices with glazes, you most certainley could, but generally that's what washes/inks are used for.

Les Bursley touches upon the subject in his tutorial on Crimson Fists, he uses both techniques and explains the difference between the two. I recommend watching this if you're still confused, seeing him apply the two techniques and listening to him explain the difference should give a pretty clear understanding.
The tutorial's here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tvtgIGHPoM
He explains the difference around 4:37.

Oakenshield wrote:

FabricatorGeneralMike wrote: The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%).

I would be very interested in buying these washes for cheaper from windsor & newton but my google-fu is weak. Could you help point me in the right direction?

It's interesting, but I've spent a little while on the W&N site myself looking for these mythical washes but haven't found a trace of them. If they do exist (and searches on Google for "acrylic wash" come up with tutorials on how to mix acrylic paints with various mediums for the effect on paper, no stores) then I'm certain they're not Winsor&Newton.

However, you can make your own washes using acrylic inks and some mediums. Take a look here.

FabricatorGeneralMike wrote:

Chris P Bacon wrote:Glazes are generally used to change the hue of colours already painted whereas washes/inks are used to sink into the crevices of the model to darken the shades. Not sure what the difference is between the old GW inks compared to their washes now though, I never had a chance to use them.

The old GW ink where just that ink's. They dry glossy not flat like the 'new GW washes' (which are just repackaged W&N acrylic washes with apporperate GW mark up...like 600%). Once a ink wash was on there if you got the model wet ( putting more ink on, wet-blending) again the ink would run. As you said they where designed to run and pool into the crevises on models where you would want a strong shade ( like a shadow or a fold in cloth).

The washes are just like you said, to change the hue of already painted areas. They dry flat (ie no glossy) and once dry can be painted over or have more wash applied over it without it running. =o]

I'm also curious as to this W&N acrylic wash you mention. Can you provide a link to it?