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I had great success in this forum working out my starter Grey Knights army list. (Thanks to everyone who helped!) However this army is going to run me less than my estimated budjet so I decided to put the remainer in reserve towards my following army, which is to be Dark Eldar.

So I want to know what are the best builds around? For grey knights my options were clearly Draigo or Crowe lists..so what's the cream of the crop with DE? And what is the basic army composition like?

Example lists are greatly appreciated since it helps me judge how much $ i need to buy into the army. The core units/essentials all that.

Thanks in advance to everyone chipping in their knowledge.

Honestly I would say its just Archon, Homunculus, 2 or 3x Squads of Trueborn, 4+ x Squads of Wyches and 3x Ravagers is what you would be looking for. People could throw lists out but I think if you stick to those units you will be fine.

-Sincerely Viri

which one are the core units from those listed? The ones that i should def start off with first if i were to build up a 1,000 pt start army.

I'm guessing 2 ravagers are the 'must-have' units? OR what do you recommend

Ravagers are the Long Fangs of the Dark Elder. Nothing else in HS comes close all round. If you want to play with exotic stuff like planes or pain engines or whatever, do it. But competitive is Ravagers.

For the rest, "competitive" Dark Eldar is largely about as many Venoms as you can possibly afford, stuffed with whatever you like, and proceed to spam MSU like their is no tomorrow.

No bains, no subtelty, no originality. The trademark of Dark Eldar 5th Edition.

Zweischneid wrote:No bains, no subtelty, no originality. The trademark of Dark Eldar 5th Edition.

I take offense at this. Even if you look at list building alone, getting a Dark Eldar army to fit cleanly into a given point value can be very difficult. Minimum squad size is generally maximum vehicle size, which means that we won't be able to tweak our squads to make the point value. Moreover, most options are either so good as to be mandatory (flickerfields), or so worthless as to be forgotten entirely (envenomed blades). Given these constraints, it's a challenge to even get the point values to line up, nevermind staying within the constraints of the FOC or getting sufficient variety to be TAC.

I'm not even going to dignify the comment with respect to actually fielding the army. I'll let battle reports speak for me in that respect -- because Dark Eldar is anything but forgiving.

I take offense to that as well Corollax but distain is the sign of scars they say, so I won't continue with it. Akaiyou, the MUST have unit is really between Blaster Trueborn and Wyches. Wyches are the Core / Troop of DE and are built to assault ASAP Blaster Trueborn is kind of like IG melta spam but just DE style. I would say avg squad builds are something like...

ELITE
x4 Trueborn, x4 Blasters
Venom, splinter cannon

TROOPS
9x Wyches Hydra Gauntlets or Shardnet & Impaler x2 or mix (Pro people tend to think no additions)
1x Hekatrix, Agonizer
Raider
Flickerfield

HEAVY
Ravager
Flickerfield

Those three will take up most your points and I would say thats about there average build. Archon people like to put a Huskblade & Soultrap but I go for Agonizer & CCW but its just a preference. The Hamuculi goes with a Wych squad of 9(max unit copac on raider is 10 can do this with Archon too.) to give them FNP. Other then that just keep it clean. Unless you want to get artisy. If you want a Jetfighter your okay just keep 2 Ravagers at lowest. Most your points are going to be in Trueborn and Wyches though. Some people do a Tarpit Beast unit but I'm not fond of those. But I think if you stick with just Trueborn Blaster and Wyches you'll be alright. If you are looking to just learn basics. You could fool with a few more points I guess like a jet and maybe an Incubi squad in a venom with the Archon if you want to be a bit more diverse. Some people do 2x Hamuculi instead of Archon, Hamunculi get a pain token to share with a Squad so its just a cheap meanover.

-Sincerely Viri

P.S. I'm watching LOST and not editing my post so please excuse its roughness sorry!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess there is one thing I am forgetting which Zweischneid brings up. The MSU thing with venoms, if you want to SHOOT yes his idea is sound and works wonders with multiple venoms with 2x Splinter Cannon. But if you want to Assault as well as shoot then you want a mix like I was talking about but if your avoiding assault then do Trueborn with MSU venom with Kabalite Warriors. It's really up to you all shooty, all assaulty or mixing best kind of thing. I mean if you want to go all assaulty you could just go with Incubi and Wyches and that would be fairly sound with 2 Ravagers and a Jet.

-Sincerely Viri

Haemi
2 x 3 wracks as troops, in the inevitable double cannon venom, giving reasonable cheap and resilient scoring units
4 x 5 warriors with a blaster, again in venoms
3 x 4 trueborn, blasters, in venoms (shock!)
3 x ravager

For a bit of a change up you may see the baron and 17 hellions, to give you some close combat.

The army scoots and shoots, and tries to avoid combat with anything that isnt hellion.

Like a lot of 5th ed meta armies, it is very, very boring to play against

I also have just started Dark Eldar, and so far my record is one loss, one draw, both against space marines. The difference? In the second game I included two Haemunculi and instead of Wyches I used a unit of Blood Brides. It's amazing the difference between striving to get those first pain tokens and starting the battle with them. However, I am planning to get three Razorwings just so I can have the enjoyment of starting the game off with a punishing missile barrage. If only you could trade one of the weapons on the Venom with a dark lance, I would never play anything but Dark Eldar. (It would be their version of the tried and true Ork Kan Wall!)

I took 2nd this year at our local "ard Boyz. Here was my list:

Baron Sathonyx with 9 hellions/heliarch with agoniser
10 hellions/heliarch w/stun claw
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
20 warriors- blaster, 2 dark lances/ sybarite/ blast pistol/agoniser
10 scourges-4 dark lances, solarite-blast pistol/agoniser
razorwing- splinter cannon, dark lances, monosythe
razorwing-splinter cannon, dizzies, 4 necrotoxin
void raven- 4 shatterfield

I know this list is missing something, but you get the idea. This is the basics of it. A 2 wound fragile commander. Nothing real special about this list, mostly just a good round build.

Just ignore what was said earlier in this post. Apparently he doesn't play the army. And if he does, well....

AzureDeath wrote:I took 2nd this year at our local "ard Boyz. Here was my list:

Baron Sathonyx with 9 hellions/heliarch with agoniser
10 hellions/heliarch w/stun claw
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
20 warriors- blaster, 2 dark lances/ sybarite/ blast pistol/agoniser
10 scourges-4 dark lances, solarite-blast pistol/agoniser
razorwing- splinter cannon, dark lances, monosythe
razorwing-splinter cannon, dizzies, 4 necrotoxin
void raven- 4 shatterfield

I know this list is missing something, but you get the idea. This is the basics of it. A 2 wound fragile commander. Nothing real special about this list, mostly just a good round build.

Just ignore what was said earlier in this post. Apparently he doesn't play the army. And if he does, well....

So is the 20X warriors unit there to camp on objectives? Just wondering.

Honestly, DE are kinda simple when it comes to list building. And for one big reason

Everything needs a transport.

Sure, there are other reasons. For instance you're almost always better taking another troop or elite choice over -any- fast attack. Ravager is just plain amazing for heavy unless you're going against heavy horde, then you might want a flier.

Their units that can't be a, or on, a skimmer, are just not worth taking, confined to gimmick builds like gate rushing. Their HQ are also, to damn good and focused. Having that extra pain token is golden, so about the only thing that can compete with a Haemonculi is the Duke since he helps out the ladies tremendously. Even with an Archon, all your units already do tremendous damage, having one that does tremendously-er isn't as big a boon as the survivability of that extra pain token.

It all comes down to do you want to shoot more or assault more, it all revolved around warrior, wyches, their elite counter parts, wracks, Incubi, and all the various none fast attack skimmers.

warpcrafter wrote:

AzureDeath wrote:I took 2nd this year at our local "ard Boyz. Here was my list:

Baron Sathonyx with 9 hellions/heliarch with agoniser
10 hellions/heliarch w/stun claw
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
10 wyches-1 hydra guantlet, 1 razorflails/hexatrix with blast pistol/agoniser- raider, flickerfield
20 warriors- blaster, 2 dark lances/ sybarite/ blast pistol/agoniser
10 scourges-4 dark lances, solarite-blast pistol/agoniser
razorwing- splinter cannon, dark lances, monosythe
razorwing-splinter cannon, dizzies, 4 necrotoxin
void raven- 4 shatterfield

I know this list is missing something, but you get the idea. This is the basics of it. A 2 wound fragile commander. Nothing real special about this list, mostly just a good round build.

Just ignore what was said earlier in this post. Apparently he doesn't play the army. And if he does, well....

So is the 20X warriors unit there to camp on objectives? Just wondering.

Sometimes they do. Good for fire support as well. With the hellions being troop choices because of the Baron being in the army, if they survive long enough then I have 2 fast units that can claim or contest. Wyches as well but they are mainly to go from unit to unit slaying as much as they can. So effectively I have 5 troop choices.

Basics of a DE competitive army are tons of squads of trueborn with blasters inside venoms covered in splinter cannons. Follow that up with a squad or two of warriors with a darklance in a raider with a darklance, and a squad of wyches for tarpitting. To wrap it all up, 3 Ravagers and the Baron.

The only weakness the army really has is to mass autocannons going first. With the Baron, you can mitigate that quite a bit, or just play all reserves like some DE players. The only disadvantage is that the army hemorrhages killpoints if your opponent can bring any weapons to bear. I was playing a 2000 point game with a friend of mine running this army, and he had something like 23 killpoints in it. I only won because he couldn't quite kill enough of my Orks to make the killpoints happen!

How do i get trueborn?

I didn't see that unit in the games-workshop site so i'm guessing it's convertion only? or is there a model for it somewhere?

If convertion only how is everyone else creating them with blasters?

I made trueborn using wood elf hooded heads and trimmed cloaks, then gave them weapons off a scourges box. Mind you I had a ton of wood elf bits just kicking around. Generally they are just warriors, with more weapon options.

Also a good partner for the baron is a beast master unit. Speedy + stealth + cc = win.

For core, I generally spam as many warrior squads in venoms as possible. Something like 5 warriors with 1 blaster in venom is 125 pts. Nice even number and provides some AT which your venoms can't do. I take 6 of these plus 3 trueborn squads (4 with 4 blasters on venom for 173 each), the beast master plus baron and 3 ravagers. That army has yet to loose a game.

I recently won a local tournament with a dark eldar list that included two small units of incubi, an archon, three warrior squads w/ blasters in venoms, a blasterborn unit in a venom, 6 reavers, a unit of 10 wyches, and 3 ravagers.

I started with Dark Eldar.

First thing you need to know is your top choice for HQs is the Duke. Duke Sliscus the Serpent. He gives you a bonus on your poison weapons with whatever unit he joins, grants you the ability to Deep Strike pretty much any vehicle on your list and gives a 2++ save on a guy in whatever unit he joins until failure.

Second thing you need to know. Kabalite Warriors are your best Troops Choice. They come with Poisoned Ranged Weapons which gives them the potential to take out even the toughest Monstrous Creatures. I have had a single unit of 10 Kabalite Warriors take out a Trygon in a single turn before.

Third thing. Wyches are your best Tank Hunters. Take a unit of 5, load them into a Venom and give them Haywire Grenades. On the charge they take out nearly any vehicle they hit.

As a backup/alternative method for dealing with tanks take a unit or two of Kabalite Trueborn on Venoms and give them 4 Blasters and 1 Splinter Cannon. This allows a mobile shooting unit that can potentially take out even the mighty Land Raider in only a turn or two.

Finally, don't overlook your ally list. If you want to backup your Dark Eldar with real punch, take some allies from the Grey Knight codex. Even though Grey Knights are desperate allies, you can take Inquisitor Coteaz, some Jokaero Weaponsmiths an ADL and the Quadgun. This does 3 things:

1. Re-roll to seize initiative. If you can afford Asdrubel Vect as an HQ, you have a re-rollable seize initiative on a 4+, or if your opponent seizes initiative, they have to re-roll.

2. Coteaz grants the ability to make out of sequence shooting attacks against anything that drops in within 12" of his unit's position. If he's with a unit of even 3 Jokaero Weaponsmiths that is 3 Lascannon shots directed at something before it even deploys! You can take up to 12 Jokaero in a sinlge unit!

3. With the Quadgun, you can shoot down enemy flyers before they even become a threat to you. With the abilities Coteaz grants (which support Dark Eldar extremely well) and because of Coteaz's ability to shoot things when they arrive you get to supplement the shots from the Quadgun with Lascannons (albeit as snapfiring).

Go full Mandrakes.


In all seriousness though all these suggestions sounds pretty devastating. If I ever go to a tournament then I think ill be packing up to go home very early haha!

Lots of raiders full of warriors, lots of blasterborn zipping around in venoms, a haemonculus ancient with a webway portal and 3 big dirty pain engines waiting to come out of the portal and mulch tanks and infantry. Worked well for me, the sudden arrival of 3 very tough monstrous creatures on my board made my opponent really have to rethink his strategies.Oh and the duke to make a truly nasty hornet nest out of one of the raiders.

 HerbaciousT wrote:
Go full Mandrakes.


In all seriousness though all these suggestions sounds pretty devastating. If I ever go to a tournament then I think ill be packing up to go home very early haha!

Yeah I was looking at them and thinking "wow people actually win with those?" Still, I guess it's inspiring to see people can manage with different lists.

The best thing about the Dark Eldar codex is the balance. Competitively yes there is an optimal build and I know that's what you were asking, but aside from that there is basically nothing you can take in the codex that is a straight up "bad unit" that you shouldn't ever be taking (so long as your list supports it of course). Except for Mandrakes. They are just totally outclassed by anything else you would spend the points on to fill the role.

I play comeptetive DE and win regularly. I would strongly recommend Wracks as troops over just about anything else.

I'm not too competitive, but NOT losing all the time is fun, so I'm interested in this as well.

I've heard that Beast Packs + Hellions w/ Baron is a viable alternative to Venom Spam. Ravagers for the pew-pew, and a blob of Kabalites or wyches or wracks to soak up fire and sit on objectives.

My meta has a lot of Eldar and Marines, so I'm considering this strategy.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Haemi
2 x 3 wracks as troops, in the inevitable double cannon venom, giving reasonable cheap and resilient scoring units
4 x 5 warriors with a blaster, again in venoms
3 x 4 trueborn, blasters, in venoms (shock!)
3 x ravager

For a bit of a change up you may see the baron and 17 hellions, to give you some close combat.

The army scoots and shoots, and tries to avoid combat with anything that isnt hellion.

Like a lot of 5th ed meta armies, it is very, very boring to play against

If I were God for a month, I would force the GW rules team to play Tyranids against this list, every day during that month. Go ahead and forge the fcuking narrative, Crudace.

go to the darkcity there are a lot of options.

I play competitively and do v well with a list that has no ravagers! shocking - i admit i do have a few venoms, but is about using the right tool for the job.

I use 3 Talos pain engines and also have 2 squads of 6 reavers with heat lances for anti tank. I also use a squad of Grotesques in raider with either 2 haemonculi or an archon and a heamonculi. I use wracks as my troop mainstay and have a shed load of liquefiers in the list. it hits fast and hard and then moves on.

There is a lot of use in a barron star or using large blob squards of hellions or beast packs.

it is versatile and i think the netlist of 'venomspam' is actually unorigional and very easy to dismantle and has been out there so long its the list you build to counter if you are playing DE


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also blasterborn in venoms is a waste - they become suicidal units because you have too get to close to use them

lol thread revival!

we do some POWERFUL necromancy.

also, i LOVE Dark City, but it doesn't have too much activity sometimes.