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Got a game in with Dave Wednesday just gone, not played Dave for about 6 months so will be interesting to see how it goes. I brought Dark Eldar because I am fething evil

Dark Eldar "Kabal of a Thousand Cuts" - 2,000 points


HQ

Baron Sathonyx

Elite

4 x Kabalite Trueborn w/ Venom - 4 x blasters - Venom w/ splinter cannon
4 x Kabalite Trueborn w/ Venom - 4 x blasters - Venom w/ splinter cannon
3 x Kabalite Trueborn w/ Venom - 3 x blasters - Venom w/ splinter cannon

Troops

5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon
5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon
5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon
5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon
5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon
5 x Kabalite Warriors w/ Venom - blaster - Venom w/ splinter cannon

Fast Attack

Beastmasters - 3 x beastmasters, 5 x khymerae & 4 x razorwing flocks
Beastmasters - 3 x beastmasters, 5 x khymerae & 4 x razorwing flocks

Heavy Support

Ravager - flickerfield
Ravager - flickerfield
Ravager - flickerfield


Tyranids "Hive Fleet Purple" - 2,000 points

HQ

Hive Tyrant - twin-linked devourers
Tyrant Guard - lash whip
Tyranid Prime - lash whip & bonesword

Elite

3 x Hive Guard
3 x Hive Guard
2 x Hive Guard

Troops

Tervigon - toxin sacs, adrenal glands & catalyst
Tervigon - toxin sacs, adrenal glands & catalyst

10 x Termagants
10 x Termagants
8 x Genestealers + Broodlord
8 x Genestealers + Broodlord


Fast Attack

10 x Gargoyles

Heavy Support

Carnifex - 2 x twin-linked devourers
Mawloc


Game: Annihilation + Dawn of War

Deployment

I won the roll off and decided to go second, reason for this is I can see where Dave deploys and hopefully can out deploy him. Plus when I go second in dawn of war I deploy nothing and everything rolls on turn 1, so Dave will lose a turn of shooting and I can target almost whatever I want, I love night vision!

Dave deploys the Hive Tyrant and Tyrant Guard mid field. Everything else will roll on.

I deploy nothing, sneaky sneak Dark Eldar!

* Tactical Notes

Dave has deployed the Hive Tyrant on it's own mid field behind a ruin. I'll wait and see where he puts the rest of his stuff, but to be fair his Tyranids aren't going to be in range probably until turn 3. I think I will deploy in the centre to avoid Genestealers (which are outflanking) and I will blast the Tyrant to kingdom come, then I will focus on whatever I can see and is also a threat i.e Hive Guard.

Turn 1

Dave brings his Tyranids in in the centre and left flank. In the centre is a Tervigon, Hive Guard and unit of Termagants all bunkering in a ruin, though some of the Termagants are out in front, and also the Carnifex-Prime unit, 'Fex is outside the building. On the left flank is the other Tervigon, Termagants and both Hive Guard units. In reserve are both Genestealer units, Mawloc and Gargoyles.

Shooting, Dave has nothing to shoot at so just runs his gribblies into cover etc.

I roll all my skimmers on the centre, moving Venoms 12" from the table edge (Trueborn ones at the front) while the Ravagers roll on behind using the Venoms as cover. Both Beastmaster units move into a large ruin in the centre for cover.

Shooting, I blast the Hive Tyrant with splinter cannons and a blasters and both big bugs are dead and I earn two kill points. I fire remaining splinter cannons at the Carnifex (some are out of range due to night fighting) and put a wound on the 'Fex and one on the Prime if I remember right.

Kill points - Dark Eldar: 2 Tyranids: 0







* Tactical Notes

Ok, a decent start and I've capitalised on Dave's mistake, which was hanging the Tyrant out to dry and letting the big fella and his buddy getting gunned down. I've put some wounds on the Fex-Prime unit, really just because they was there.

Now I've seen Dave's deployment I will move up a little bit and focus my fire power on the units of Hive Guard. Once they have been dealt with I will move up and poison and blaster to death the Tervigons, then kill the remaining Termagants. The reserve units I will deal with as and when they arrive.

Turn 2

Dave rolls for reserves and the Mawloc, Gargoyles and unit of Genestealers arrive - 'Stealers outflank on the left flank. Gargoyles land near my Beastmasters on target and the Mawloc lands among my skimmer fleet causing damage only to a single Trueborn Venom, which is immobilised.

Tyranid movement, I think the bugs just move move into terrain to block LOS or get cover. Tervigons cast feel no pain on Hive Guard units.

Shooting, Genestealers run towards the Beastmasters with Baron, but looks like they are out of assault range. Gargoyles fire at the other Beastmasters, Beastmasters make the cover saves. Everything else is out of range.

In assault Genestealers are out of range.

Dark Eldar second turn, I split Baron from the Beastmasters and he moves towards the Gargoyles while the Beastmaster unit moves out of terrain ready to counter assault the Genestealers. The other Beastmaster unit gets bogged down in terrain and stays there. I move my Venoms about, three move 12" to draw LOS on the Genestealers while others move 6" so can fire the blasters. Ravagers reposition ready to blow the Mawloc away.

Shooting, I run the Beastmasters out of terrain so they are now clear altogether while the other Beastmaster unit is still stuck in terrain - good job the Gargoyles are pretty close! The three Venoms blast the Genestealers, though they get cover as I am firing through the Gargoyles - 50% of the unit is lost, but they pass morale. Baron shoots the Gargoyles but doesn't kill any. Ravagers blast the Mawloc followed by the Trueborn in their immobilised Venom, Trueborn kill the Mawloc and gain a kill point. Remaining splinter cannons gun down the Carnifex and Tyranid Prime.

In assault, Baron charges the Gargoyles and the Beastmasters in terrain make it into the fight - Gargoyles do nothing to my Beastmasters and are slaughtered. Other unit of Beastmasters charge the Genestealers, the Broodlord does his funky power and stops a Khymerae from fighting, though it's not enough and Beastmasters kill the Genestealers..

Kill points - Dark Eldar: 7 Tyranids: 0





* Tactical Notes

That was some serious kill point gainage that turn! Weight of fire cut down the Fex-Prime, and the Genestealers had some bad luck, though the Gargoyles Dave deep striked way too close to me, which let me just walk up and punch them in the face. He would have been better deep striking them away and then next turn fire into a Dark Eldar infantry unit.

Next turn I will start moving up and taking out Hive Guard units. There is only a single unit of Genestealers to arrive from reserve, if they come on the left flank they will assault a unit of Beastmasters and probably Baron, if Dark Eldar lose the combat then splinter cannons will gun them down. If they come on the right flank then they can only possibly reach a Ravager, again they will be exposed to splinter cannons. It's a lose lose situation for Genestealers, at least the way I see it.

Turn 3

Dave rolls for reserves and the last Genestealer unit arrives on the left flank and heads towards my Beastmasters.

I don't think there's much or any movement from Tyranids this turn.

Shooting, Genestealers run towards my Beastmasters a whole 1", so it looks like Baron is safe for this turn. Hive Guard blast a Venom and it is wrecked - Warriors pass pinning test.

In assault the Genestealers charge and rip through my Beastmasters, Beastmasters lose combat and are destroyed by sweeping advance.

Dark Eldar turn, I move my fleet of skimmers towards the Tyranid lines to get my guns into range of the exposed unit of two Hive Guard on the left flank - I also position Venoms to blow away some Genestealers. Baron moves into terrain on the left flank, my plan is for him to move up the left flank and tie up some Hive Guard.

Shooting, I blast the Genestealers to soften them up for Beastmasters and half of them go down - they pass morale. I blast the unit of two Hive Guard with dark lances and splinter cannons, they die. I fire some splinter cannons and blasters through the window of the large ruin on the left flank at the bunkered down Hive Guard, one remains.

In assault the Beastmasters charge and kill the Genestealers, they consolidate and end up behind the Venoms moving up the centre.

Kill points - Dark Eldar: 9 Tyranids: 2





* Tactical Notes

Things seem to be going well for me and not so well for Dave, but at least he has some kill points now! I was a bit surprised the Genestealers beat my Beastmasters in assault, but I guess it worked out for the best as I was able to shoot them next turn and then counter assault to finish them off. I've also thinned out the number of Hive Guard on the board, left flank has a single Hive Guard and the centre still has a full unit. Problem with the centre is the Hive Guard are behind a ruin and I cannot draw LOS on them.

Next turn I will be risky and split my army. In the past this tactic has failed me, however I think I've caused enough damage on Dave so I will be ok. Realistically on the left flank he could take down two vehicles with a Hive Guard and Tervigon. On the centre he just has the Hive Guard to threaten me. So what I will do is move half the army flat out across to the right flank so they then can move about the turn after and draw LOS on the critters hiding away.

Turn 4

No movement from Dave, if he comes out to play then he's dead!

Shooting, the triple Hive Guard unit blast a Ravager and break off a lance and immobilise it. The single Hive Guard instagibs Baron, poor ginger bastard :(.

Dark Eldar turn, I move two Ravagers and two Venoms flat out over to the right flank but also keeping out of Tyranid range best I can . Left flank I move up the skimmers as Beastmasters follow behind, I leave a gap for them to slip through so they can assault the Termagants who are not in terrain.

Shooting, blasters and lances fire at the Tervigon on the left flank, it gets cover but takes some wounds. The last Hive Guard is dead thanks to splinter cannons. Beastmasters run, but looks like assault maybe close. Splinter cannons fire over at the other Hive Guard in the centre through a window and manage to kill two Hive Guard.

In assault the Beastmasters are 2" out of assault range, damn.

Kill points - Dark Eldar: 10 Tyranids: 3





* Tactical Notes

Things are going very smoothly for me at the moment. The left flank has been neutralised almost, just a Tervigon which can threaten my vehicles, but it is on borrowed time. A pity my Beastmasters couldn't reach the Termagants. I am now hoping the other half of the fleet can hold out on the right flank, though thanks to splinter cannon from the opposite flank the Hive Guard have been thinned out.

Turn 5

Tervigon on the left flank moves just a little bit, that's it I think.

Shooting, Tervigon fires at a Venom but does nothing. Single Hive Guard attempts to instagib some beasts, but it out of range. Other Tervigon is out of range of the skimmers which moved flat out.

Dark Eldar turn, skimmers on the left move up as do the Beastmasters. Skimmers on the right move up 12" with Trueborn bailing out their Venom ready to nuke the Tervigon.

Shooting, on the right flank Trueborn and the two Ravagers smoke the Tervigon - it kills some of the Termagants, they pass morale and stick around. The last Hive Guard eats splinter cannons and it is dead meat. On the left flank the Trueborn nuke the Tervigon and it kills some Termagants in the psychic backlash, the Termagants fail morale and leg it off the board!

Kill points - Dark Eldar: 14 Tyranids: 4

We roll for game and mercifully it ends for Dave. Dark Eldar pick up a victory.







Summary

I know Dark Eldar is a tough match up, but I didn't expect Tyranids to drop down so fast. Dave did play defensively, but really there was only a single unit of Hive Guard I couldn't draw LOS too, so this would have held him back not getting those Hive Guard units into range. Other mistakes I think he made was deep striking the Gargoyles as they did absolutely nothing, placing the Hive Tyrant high and dry as that was two easy kill points and firing the single Hive Guard at the Beastmasters when a Venom which I hadn't moved flat out was directly in front of him.

The mistake I made is I totally forgot about the Mawloc and bunched up my skimmers, which made a very nice target for Dave. Luckily my mistake only cost me a immobilised Venom so it wasn't too bad and the Mawloc ended up giving me a kill point and a pain token

Tough go at it for the nids this game. I question the use of gargoyles in his list. They provide a decent screen but on their own a group of ten without upgrades are weak. In my experience gargoyles beg for upgrades and like to run with a Flyrant. A max'd out unit is nice too since they can be squishy.

As far as his heavy support choices go, I think this can be optimized. The carni is shooty, the mawloc is stabby. Perhaps choose one or the other: shooty or stabby? That way you can take more carni's or mawlocs in order to focus on a single aspect of combat instead of just being mediocre (at best) in two.

I like the hive guard!

The DE list is dirty, soo much shooting. It would offer a tough match for any CC oriented list, especially nids. Not to mention hitting on 6's (fast skimmers I'm assuming?) is painful.

All in all a great battle report, Mercer!

The Gargoyles I agree with you, I see zero point of them in this list. They really cannot do a fat lot. They would be better double the size and giving cover to something, or flank attack. I know in the past Dave has used them with the Parasite, but even then 10 isn't enough.

The Carnifex goes with the Prime, a little deathstar unit. In the past Dave has run more Dakkafexes and this is the way I went when I played Tyranids. If you're going combat then the Trygon is the way to go, the Mawloc is just a gimmick unit and it fails at that.

The D.E list is pretty evil, I just put up a report with me using it against Tau. Against any form of infantry it wrecks face, it's evil. It only struggles against mech Guard. And yes, the Venoms are fast skimmers.

Thanks mate!

Can't say I'm surprised at the result in the Slightest. You're playing Dark Eldar, which is already a tough match up for Nids. Bringing your Tournament competitive Venom spam list is just overkill.

I don't like the Nids list much either. Carnifexes are a waste IMO, and so is the Mawloc. 30 more points nets you a Trygon, which is vastly superior in every way, without paying for the silly gimmick ground burst. TMC don't have a chance against Venom Spam, regardless though.

10 Gargoyles are too few, there is no point bringing them at all unless you have fast synapse, buy Adrenal Glands and Toxin sacs for them, and have a large brood. I'm also not a fan of Broodlords. You can get can get nearly 3 Genes with Toxin sacs, for the price of a single Broodlord.

Well, Good battle report Mercer, also love it when you have pictures!

I'm currently reading through the Tau report.

I agree on the mawloc; didn't comment on it since I figured perhaps the nid player has some liking for the mawloc. If that is the case, or he has seen success with it in the past, arguing against him using it is pointless. But, given the situation, I agree 100%- the mawloc is the weak, pale and not as handsome half-brother of the Trygon.

I really like Dave's Troop choices. Seems like a solid core to build a list around.

Sasori wrote:Can't say I'm surprised at the result in the Slightest. You're playing Dark Eldar, which is already a tough match up for Nids. Bringing your Tournament competitive Venom spam list is just overkill.

I don't like the Nids list much either. Carnifexes are a waste IMO, and so is the Mawloc. 30 more points nets you a Trygon, which is vastly superior in every way, without paying for the silly gimmick ground burst. TMC don't have a chance against Venom Spam, regardless though.

10 Gargoyles are too few, there is no point bringing them at all unless you have fast synapse, buy Adrenal Glands and Toxin sacs for them, and have a large brood. I'm also not a fan of Broodlords. You can get can get nearly 3 Genes with Toxin sacs, for the price of a single Broodlord.

Well, Good battle report Mercer, also love it when you have pictures!

The Dark Eldar list is just my list. I don't have a seperate list for tournaments or just playing, every game to me is just playing. The way I see it is I just take the best stuff in the codex and make a army out of it .

I agree on the 'Nids list, it could be better. Carnifexes are cool when tooled up with double devourers, that's why I shot that one first.

Mawlocs are pretty rubbish. It really is a one shot deal as a shooty army would gun it down or a assault army would lock it in combat. Each time this has happened against me the Mawloc has died sharpish.

I agree on Gargoyles. They was out of synapse straight away.

I am also not a fan of Broodlords. For 46 points (I think) plus a Genestealer you can stop a single model from fighting and get a better armour save, but you lose the extra attacks compared to equal number of Genestealers in points.

Thanks about the report.

OIF Knight wrote:I'm currently reading through the Tau report.

I agree on the mawloc; didn't comment on it since I figured perhaps the nid player has some liking for the mawloc. If that is the case, or he has seen success with it in the past, arguing against him using it is pointless. But, given the situation, I agree 100%- the mawloc is the weak, pale and not as handsome half-brother of the Trygon.

I really like Dave's Troop choices. Seems like a solid core to build a list around.

Dave does like the Mawloc. He knows it's crap. He even said to me it has never really done anything, in the games he's played me using it the most it has done has killed a Chimera. It is actually modeled as a Trygon .

The troops are solid, well apart from the Broodlords IMO.

Wow I didn't even notice the brood lords in there. I agree for 46 points they aren't worth it. There powers are neat but by no means necessary. If I had the spare points I would take them, I suppose.

Cheers to Dave for sticking to a unit that he just 'likes' even knowing its garbage. Players like that inevitably find a way to make rubbish units like that work in some odd way

The thing is, he doesn't make it work

Sasori wrote:Can't say I'm surprised at the result in the Slightest. You're playing Dark Eldar, which is already a tough match up for Nids. Bringing your Tournament competitive Venom spam list is just overkill.

I don't like the Nids list much either. Carnifexes are a waste IMO, and so is the Mawloc. 30 more points nets you a Trygon, which is vastly superior in every way, without paying for the silly gimmick ground burst. TMC don't have a chance against Venom Spam, regardless though.

10 Gargoyles are too few, there is no point bringing them at all unless you have fast synapse, buy Adrenal Glands and Toxin sacs for them, and have a large brood. I'm also not a fan of Broodlords. You can get can get nearly 3 Genes with Toxin sacs, for the price of a single Broodlord.

Well, Good battle report Mercer, also love it when you have pictures!

Mawlocs are actually not a bad unit at all, I think your comment is quick and poorly thought out. My brother plays nids and used the mawloc in a tournament environment with great success. It's "silly" ground burst attack through opponents off objectives in two different games. It's all about picking when, where and how to apply your tools. Most people simply smash there big bugs into the enemy and hope for results, this game was a gleaming example of that. I think his list is a casual/friendly list and he forgot who he was playing.

I do however agree with you that bringing a tournament venom spam list when you know your opponent is nids is just cruel. Shame on you mercer you even did it facing that beautiful Christmas tree

Not to start this whole debate again, but aren't Tyrant and Guard 2 HQ units for DoW purposes?

Anyways, poor guy should have walked that tyrant on. Don't know what he was thinking. Also, that army doesn't even seem like 2000 points to me. Feels more like 1500.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Red Corsair wrote:I do however agree with you that bringing a tournament venom spam list when you know your opponent is nids is just cruel.

I know you're being jokey here, but mercer has said he doesn't have 'tournament' and 'non-tournament' lists. I think a lot of us are like that. The nid guy will never learn if he is coddled. I spent my first couple years and tons of games playing 40k getting my teeth kicked in. That's how you learn.

Red Corsair wrote:

Sasori wrote:Can't say I'm surprised at the result in the Slightest. You're playing Dark Eldar, which is already a tough match up for Nids. Bringing your Tournament competitive Venom spam list is just overkill.

I don't like the Nids list much either. Carnifexes are a waste IMO, and so is the Mawloc. 30 more points nets you a Trygon, which is vastly superior in every way, without paying for the silly gimmick ground burst. TMC don't have a chance against Venom Spam, regardless though.

10 Gargoyles are too few, there is no point bringing them at all unless you have fast synapse, buy Adrenal Glands and Toxin sacs for them, and have a large brood. I'm also not a fan of Broodlords. You can get can get nearly 3 Genes with Toxin sacs, for the price of a single Broodlord.

Well, Good battle report Mercer, also love it when you have pictures!

Mawlocs are actually not a bad unit at all, I think your comment is quick and poorly thought out. My brother plays nids and used the mawloc in a tournament environment with great success. It's "silly" ground burst attack through opponents off objectives in two different games. It's all about picking when, where and how to apply your tools. Most people simply smash there big bugs into the enemy and hope for results, this game was a gleaming example of that. I think his list is a casual/friendly list and he forgot who he was playing.

I do however agree with you that bringing a tournament venom spam list when you know your opponent is nids is just cruel. Shame on you mercer you even did it facing that beautiful Christmas tree

I admit I am not a fan of the Mawloc mainly because there is better units out there. Against mech it's not that awesome as needs 4+ to glance, so only got 50/50 chance and the AP2 counts for nothing. It's better against infantry where it can wound easily and kill units with the AP2. Blasting units off a objective is what it would be best for. Btw this list is what he took to the recent tournament I placed third in, he came seventh. Only difference was 1,750 points so he had no Tyrant. I believe the rest was the same.

Sorry dude, but I am a cruel donkey-cave

pretre wrote:Not to start this whole debate again, but aren't Tyrant and Guard 2 HQ units for DoW purposes?

Anyways, poor guy should have walked that tyrant on. Don't know what he was thinking. Also, that army doesn't even seem like 2000 points to me. Feels more like 1500.

I know you're being jokey here, but mercer has said he doesn't have 'tournament' and 'non-tournament' lists. I think a lot of us are like that. The nid guy will never learn if he is coddled. I spent my first couple years and tons of games playing 40k getting my teeth kicked in. That's how you learn.

I believe you're right about the Tyrant Guard, they are two units, though while the Guard doesn't take a HQ slot it is still a HQ choice. And definintely the Tyrant should ave walked on. When he deployed it I did think WTF.

Should be 2k mate unless I have missed something, and I don't think I have. It's his 1,750 list plus a Tyrant. I can tell you that the big bugs along with the Prime and Hive Guard cost 1,500 ish points. Add in two units of Genestealers and Gargoyles and you're looking at 2,000 points.

I agree a lot with your last paragraph. I teach a fair few people how to play 40k and tactics etc (Dave was one of them) all of them (apart from Dave) run tough lists like mine, and all have said that if I wouldn't have used such tough lists in that first place they wouldn't have learnt and never gotten better. Metallicarule on here I play often, and when I first played him he had the most fluff Eldar list ever - he got smashed. Now he runs a very tough wave-walker list, he has been keeping track of our games and I have won one more than he has over the times he has beaten me and we have drawn one game. This shows that he has learnt a lot from facing tough lists, it's not like I whoop his ass week in and week out. Another fella on here is the same, he has had 7 games with me (plays Tau) he hasn't won one yet, but each game he is getting closer and has scored a draw. You can actually see Poddy in the Tau report observing on my left, he's not observing the Tau player he said, he's watching me for our game on Tuesday!

When I used to play 40k a few years ago I ran lists with what I liked i.e Meganobz. Then I started playing with a more competitive crowd and I would get my ass whooped. It taken me quite some time to beat them, but in the end once I had adjusted my lists (made better, not taliored!) and got my tactics sorted the tables soon turned.

mercer wrote:

I admit I am not a fan of the Mawloc mainly because there is better units out there. Against mech it's not that awesome as needs 4+ to glance, so only got 50/50 chance and the AP2 counts for nothing. It's better against infantry where it can wound easily and kill units with the AP2. Blasting units off a objective is what it would be best for. Btw this list is what he took to the recent tournament I placed third in, he came seventh. Only difference was 1,750 points so he had no Tyrant. I believe the rest was the same.

So you don't use it to pen armor He has the Hive Guard for that.

What else is he going to use it against when facing mercer and it comes up turn 2? I guess he could have hit the beasts with it.... /shrug

Red Corsair wrote:

mercer wrote:

I admit I am not a fan of the Mawloc mainly because there is better units out there. Against mech it's not that awesome as needs 4+ to glance, so only got 50/50 chance and the AP2 counts for nothing. It's better against infantry where it can wound easily and kill units with the AP2. Blasting units off a objective is what it would be best for. Btw this list is what he took to the recent tournament I placed third in, he came seventh. Only difference was 1,750 points so he had no Tyrant. I believe the rest was the same.

So you don't use it to pen armor He has the Hive Guard for that.

I wouldn't use it to pen armour. As I said it's better for smashing infantry. Beastmasters were on foot and massively bunched together, he would have caused some damage on them.

pretre wrote:What else is he going to use it against when facing mercer and it comes up turn 2? I guess he could have hit the beasts with it.... /shrug

Beastmasters would have been better. I had two units in a 12" x 6" ruin and a total of 25 infantry models, the Mawloc would have hurt them. Though I guess they would have got a cover save, but better target on them than the vehicles as the S6 would have I.D'd stuff.

Red Corsair wrote:

Sasori wrote:Can't say I'm surprised at the result in the Slightest. You're playing Dark Eldar, which is already a tough match up for Nids. Bringing your Tournament competitive Venom spam list is just overkill.

I don't like the Nids list much either. Carnifexes are a waste IMO, and so is the Mawloc. 30 more points nets you a Trygon, which is vastly superior in every way, without paying for the silly gimmick ground burst. TMC don't have a chance against Venom Spam, regardless though.

10 Gargoyles are too few, there is no point bringing them at all unless you have fast synapse, buy Adrenal Glands and Toxin sacs for them, and have a large brood. I'm also not a fan of Broodlords. You can get can get nearly 3 Genes with Toxin sacs, for the price of a single Broodlord.

Well, Good battle report Mercer, also love it when you have pictures!

Mawlocs are actually not a bad unit at all, I think your comment is quick and poorly thought out. My brother plays nids and used the mawloc in a tournament environment with great success. It's "silly" ground burst attack through opponents off objectives in two different games. It's all about picking when, where and how to apply your tools. Most people simply smash there big bugs into the enemy and hope for results, this game was a gleaming example of that. I think his list is a casual/friendly list and he forgot who he was playing.

I do however agree with you that bringing a tournament venom spam list when you know your opponent is nids is just cruel. Shame on you mercer you even did it facing that beautiful Christmas tree

My comment is Well thought out, and I've tested the Mawloc plenty of times. Compared to the Trygon, it sucks. It's a waste of 170 points. I'm glad that your brother has had Great success with his, but the anecdote is pointless. The Mawloc is a massively overcosted TMC, that relies way to much on his ground burrow to do anything. At most it can Use that ability 4 times, and that's only with good rolling. You have just as much chance to scatter off what you were planning to Hit as well. In a real Tournament list, I don't want to relay on that much chance, for such an expensive MC.

I'm not alone in my thoughts about the Mawloc either. Most of this board, and most of the people in this thread as well, Agree that it is simply not a good unit. So, do you consider the overwhelming majorities opinion on it, "Poorly thought out" as well, or is it the possibility is that my opinion is correct, and the Mawloc is Terrible. Which it is.

EDIT: Grammar

I often read your battle reports Mercer and you play very well and your DE list is terrible (horrible ?). And your battle reports are very good :-)
I have a question, Is it not a little boring to play when you know you have 90% of chance to win ?
For example this battle, i don't see, except very bad dice rolling how the tyranid could win.

I have to agree about the Mawloc, it is gak. It's better for infantry, but needs to hit, which only had 32% chance on the scatter dice.

tetsuo666 wrote:I often read your battle reports Mercer and you play very well and your DE list is terrible (horrible ?). And your battle reports are very good :-)
I have a question, Is it not a little boring to play when you know you have 90% of chance to win ?
For example this battle, i don't see, except very bad dice rolling how the tyranid could win.

hmm... he has a terrible list but he has a 90% chance of winning, please explain. IMO the dark eldar list is very strong, particularlyy in dawn of war.



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On the first turn the DE have 9 dark lances and 18 splinter cannons to bear thats 108 splinter shots!

Mercer you had to know how this game was going to go before it even started. I give you props for at least moving forward when you could've stayed out of range when you were up on KP and made him come to you.

Tyranids really are just in a bad place when it comes to fighting DE. There wasn't a whole lot he could do.

As for his list, the Mawloc is trash. I've tried it numerous times with poor results.

10 Gargoyles are only useful as a 60 point cover save for your MCs. I don't see any other use for them in this list.

Personally I love Broodlords, I've used 1-2 units of 5 Stealers + 1 Broolord with ST, TS and Implant Attack for my last 20-30 games or so. I find that their small footprint is useful for infiltrating. I've had good success using them for fighting elite CC units (Sang Guard), multi-wound units (Oblits, Nobz), and SM characters (Belial, Dante).

They fill a very different role from my standard 20 man stealer squads. The Broodlord seems expensive until you compare him to an HQ, which is what you're really getting. For 80 points you get S5 wounds on a 4+ with rerolls vs T5 and below, I7, 4 WS7 attacks that reroll 1s, and rending ID on 6s to wound. Not to mention the ability to shut down a powerfist when you charge and eat wounds to save bodies. Compare him to a Tyranid Prime and you really start to get how impressive they are.

Overall they're a finesse tool that works best with the 2x20 Genestealer blocks. They won't always get a <18" infiltration, but when they don't they often still go mostly unharassed because the 40 other FNP stealers can't be ignored.

I only outflank them in missions where there are objectives on flanks and no desireable targets for turn 1-2 assaults.

I love Broodlords. The Leadership debuff is huge against Grey Knights (and various other psykers), S5 helps the unit a lot against walkers, and hypnotic gaze is great for engaging HQs / Monstrous Creatures / Hidden Powerfists. It makes the unit more versatile.

I don't think venom-spam is an autowin versus tyranids. It's a tough battle for sure, but it can be winnable...with a little bit of luck and some terrain.

It would've been more fair had you played against tyranids on the same table that you played against your tau opponent.

This game was at my home using my board and terrain. the tau game was at a gaming club. to be honest the more terrain really benefits dark eldar.

mercer wrote:This game was at my home using my board and terrain. the tau game was at a gaming club. to be honest the more terrain really benefits dark eldar.

While that is normally the case, with hive guard nids, LOS-blocking terrain benefits them. Just hide his entire army behind terrain such as the DA Fortress and shoot down your vehicles without needing to see you. And if that terrain happened to be near the center of the board, that means nids would be almost able to hit your vehicles no matter where they were.

But I guess that didn't matter as you guys played at different locations.

Well only his hive guard can fire without los and most the can engage is there targets. i would have positioned to get los as those hive guard are high priority targets.

tetsuo666 wrote:I often read your battle reports Mercer and you play very well and your DE list is terrible (horrible ?). And your battle reports are very good :-)
I have a question, Is it not a little boring to play when you know you have 90% of chance to win ?
For example this battle, i don't see, except very bad dice rolling how the tyranid could win.

Horrible is the better word, horrible to play against . Thanks about the report.

A game of 40k is never boring, win lose or draw. I can guess I have a 90% chance to win because I am a decent player, but I don't always win and I don't always have a easy game

Tyranids would have extremely struggled to win, but they could have caused more damage.

Grimnarsmate wrote:

tetsuo666 wrote:I often read your battle reports Mercer and you play very well and your DE list is terrible (horrible ?). And your battle reports are very good :-)
I have a question, Is it not a little boring to play when you know you have 90% of chance to win ?
For example this battle, i don't see, except very bad dice rolling how the tyranid could win.

hmm... he has a terrible list but he has a 90% chance of winning, please explain. IMO the dark eldar list is very strong, particularlyy in dawn of war.

On the first turn the DE have 9 dark lances and 18 splinter cannons to bear thats 108 splinter shots!

I think he means horrible to play against.

Yup 108 splinter cannon shots and 9 dark lances from the Ravagers alone, the Tyrant and his buddy had zero chance of surviving

Traceoftoxin wrote:Mercer you had to know how this game was going to go before it even started. I give you props for at least moving forward when you could've stayed out of range when you were up on KP and made him come to you.

Tyranids really are just in a bad place when it comes to fighting DE. There wasn't a whole lot he could do.

As for his list, the Mawloc is trash. I've tried it numerous times with poor results.

10 Gargoyles are only useful as a 60 point cover save for your MCs. I don't see any other use for them in this list.

I speculated how it would go, but I can never be certain. Moving forward, well the coast was clear and I needed to draw LOS on at least one unit, so why not

I agree on the Mawloc and Gargoyles, both those units were handed to me on a silver platter.

NeutronPoison wrote:I love Broodlords. The Leadership debuff is huge against Grey Knights (and various other psykers), S5 helps the unit a lot against walkers, and hypnotic gaze is great for engaging HQs / Monstrous Creatures / Hidden Powerfists. It makes the unit more versatile.

Used them (Broodlords) a few times, wasn't impressed. Only good for stopping that power fist like you said, against a simple assault unit i.e Beastmasters then it doesn't make a huge amount of difference.