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I get that shooting isn't the best point of a skaven army but with them cutting armor saves it seems like they could be good as armor crackers just trying to figure out a good unit size and to even see if I'm right.

Its their point cost and models that are the main problem. Also their BS is not that great

As said, Jezzail BS is a bit low for their point cost so they rarely see much use in skaven lists. You're starting out on 4s to hit, and if your enemy is over 18" away, you're already up to 5s. Targeting skirmishers? -1 Stand and shoot? Another -1. (Although this can be remedied with 23 points of Warplock pistol packing Warlock Engineer!) With their high point cost per shot, you can't exactly spam them easily like other armies might be able to spam archers/xbows.

That said, a S6 AP weapon is nothing to scoff at. You're reducing even 1+ knights to a paltry 5+, and wounding T4 models like Chaos Warriors on 2s.

Overall they're not one of the more efficient choices in the skaven army book, but even with all that I usually take at least one small unit. 5 or 6 models won't break your army, but they can still be handy. They're pretty useful for plinking that last wound you need to force a panic check, for softening up hard armor targets like knights, greatswords and chaos warriors, and because they're magic they can even target ethereal units or that damnable HE archmage with his "you can't hit me with normal weapons hahaha" dress.

One time I took 15, with a warlord carrying the folding fortress. It worked out EXCEPTIONALLY well... but it was probably helped by the fact I rolled like a god on the first volley and absolutely erased a unit of chaos knights, allowing me to cannonize the lord...

If you are going to field large numbers of jazzails its not a bad idea to spend the extra 10 points for the sharpshooter. And instead of fielding a single unit several smaller units each with a sharpshooter would be more effective.
Although the points may be better spent on other units, I feel if you are committed to using them then you should maximize their effectiveness.
Is it just me or should jezzails have the sniper special rule? i figured it would be added in an FAQ by now.

Jezzails are a decent option when you know the enemy has an expensive, heavily armoured unit that yo'd just love to take out. Unfortunately, with knights being put into more of a supporting role this edition, that situation doesn't come up as often.

They're also priced just a few points too much for general play.

They're not terrible, but they're by no means essential to a Skaven list.

Plague wind mortars kind of steal the show for anti-armor.
IMO the biggest problem with jezzails isn't that they are over-priced and don't hit often enough to be useful; it's that their leadership is ass and they will panic, and not come back.
I'd only seriously consider them in a Queek army where he's got the banner of discipline for a LD9 on the jez.

As for points ineffective,
Let's say you get 1 shot at long, one at short, and 1 stand and fire, against an ideal target; high cost heavy armor knight, in the open, with nothing screening.
Every ~30 points of jezzails does 1 wound to the 1+ armor knights. (that's with the 3 shots per model).
That's not that great for an ideal shooting situation.

-Matt

Bs3 and pt cost kills them

Yeah, another casualty of the loss of +1 to hit large targets perhaps. The high strength used to be useful against monsters.

Jezzails have done rather well in the few times i've seen them. All the skaven players i've talked to about them say they don't have them because they don't want to shell out the $15 for a single one.

Can anybody actually afford large units of Jezzails these days? The models are like £10 each!!!

Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:Can anybody actually afford large units of Jezzails these days? The models are like £10 each!!!

i agree, its 30 pounds for 3 models!!

and i know players that have fielded 15

IMO just convert them using clanrats, 10 for the price of 3

these outrageous prices are why i mostly play warmachine

Box of Clanrats + Kroot Rifles = Cheap Jezzails.

As to their effective-ness? I doubt it. So few shots with that many gimps, meh. Though when they DO hit, they kill. Maybe worth a side unit, protect a flank from small Cavalry units. Those kind of units often only need 1 or 2 casualties to panic.

I actually have just tried fielding 2 units of 3 with a sharpshooter.

They did well enough in the first battle and acted as a deployment drop to boot.

I added them to my list to try out for a number of reasons.
1) Handle Armor/Monsters- Sure there are better things (WLC) but sometimes I don't want to fire the cannon at a lone knight.

2) Deployment Drops- While not the cheapest, they can add drops to your list and save you having to place your blocks. The 70pts is still cheaper than many other armies drops.

3) Random stuff- I also added them to shoot at Mangler Squig type units and/or warmachines if there is no other target.

Not saying that other units can't do what Jezzails do better. I just like having a little redundancy added to my Skaven when the dice decide to act up.

The again my current 2,500 list has
3 X 5 Gutter runners w/Poison & Slings
2 X WLC
and I am testing out the
2 X 3 Jezzails w/ Sharpshooter

Money isn't a huge issue, as they are a very simple conversion from clanrats (add ANY sort of rifle and stick two on a cav base with a shield in front). However, most skaven generals realize that the 100 points spent on 5 guns which may or may not do anything can easily be spent better elsewhere. There are just way to many better options to justify bring jezzails in a competitive list.

I have seen them do well on occasion, and I think they are a great addition to a skryre-themed army.

The problem isn't the money, point cost, or shooting effect.
The problem is you have a unit with a good sized foot print, who is LD5 and panics everything near it.

Small units are jezzails are too easy to wipe out.
Large units are still LD5 and too easy to panic off the table.

Jezzails aren't worth taking because of the panic risk the pose to the rest of your army.

-Matt