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PDF Chem-Dog Veterans

HQ- Company Command Squad with 4x Plasma Guns, in Chimera
HQ- Company Command Squad with 4x Plasma Guns, in Chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 1x heavy flamer, 2x flamers, Chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x melta guns (vendetta)
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x melta guns(vendetta)
Fast- Vendetta Gunship
Fast- Vendetta Gunship

Heavy- Manticore Rocket Launcher
Heavy- Manticore Rocket Launcher
Heavy- Leman Russ Executioner with side plasma cannons

This is my current list. Looking for some suggestions on the list itself and some ideas on 500 more points to add in so i can take this list to ard boyz. i was thinking one more vendetta and 2 banwolf or/hell hound or some battle psykers in chimera. but i cant make my mind up!!! oh and i need to hear your guys opinions on adding plasma pistols to the groups with plasma guns :-)

Almost legal. The heavy flamer occupies one of the weapons upgrade spots so you can only take two additional flamers in that squad.

Putting the melta squads into the vendettas strikes me as conflicting roles and putting your antitank eggs in one basket. Meltas want to move fast and close with the enemy, vendettas want to move slow and maintain distance, and shooting the vendettas down hurts your antitank abilities doubly. I'd be inclined to favor putting plasma squads there in order to defend the vendettas from infantry attack.

Thanks for the useless comment on the typo. I payed the correct points to make it 2000 sorry about the typos coventing my list from paper to computer. Thanks. Also i use the vendetta for 2 roles they can capture and contest objectives and if need be they go flat out on an objective and they can deep strike a unit in front of a lets say monolith and it gose pop. now you killed there main heavy and are contesting the objetive with a unit with a cover save and 12 AV. Now if need be you roll on the board 12 in and fire off 3 twin linked las cannons. Its more of a distraction for my manticores which is the real anti tank plus the valkire suck IMO so with so many things the vendetta can do i wouldnt call it just an anti tank weapon.

If you don't want advice, don't post the list.

He never mentioned a Valkyrie at all in his post, and he is right, putting Melta vets in a Vendetta throws away the Vendetta if you actually want to use the Vets as anti-tank.

Your wasting points and BS in the Flamer Vet unit when every Chimera should have a hull Heavy Flamer doing that job already.

Scatterable artillery are not 'main vehicle killers', as unless you play it wrong and ignore that little rule where blast templates are half strength unless the center hole is on the vehicle. There is also the Ordinance rule where you roll 2d6 for armor pen but you only keep one dice (the higher of the two). This means even on a direct hit, your only penetrating AV 14 on a 5-6.

LRBTs that don't move are dead LRBTs. Sponsons are a suckers bet as if you do move you can only fire one weapon and the turret.

2000pts and you have 2 things that can reliablly kill armor at range, and 2 more that have a chance. That means your list will not live long against any type of gun list. 6 Chimeras are also not going to make good lists worry either, specially when they don't have any heavy AT capability.

Ok so you say scatterable artillery are not the best at killing av 14. I'm sorry to say but ur a joker. I can fire the manticore directly so im d3 strength 10 ordnance taking my bs from the scatter. That's a lot of chances to hit on anything av 14 because the avage size of a av14 vehicle is 4x7in land raider and 6x6in monolith . I've play tested it for about 3 months and Strength 10 ordnance need 4 5 6 on 2d6 taking the highest one and the center of the templets hits it's ap1 which means I can kill on a glance. But besides that I play tested the plasmas in the vendetta it works well against horde players and low mech army's. And for your false opinion on the 6 chimeras well all I have to say is play against it and see if you feel the same way i have played speed freaks, new necrons, space wolve missle spam, GK, footslogg IG, air cav IG, DE, tau, nilla marines and eldar and I have not lost or tied yet but I have come close they are some competitive players at my LGS. But for ard boyz 2500 point list I will be running 9 to 10 chimeras 3 vendettas . And for the hull flamers I'm not a huge fan but im seriously concidering it because I play a lot of swarm lords and the famous DE av 10 spam so the multi lasers come in handy and if you know vehicle placing strategy getting Los with the heavy flamer on the front is not that hard. But I do love the idea and I'm going to try it on the spear head of the fleet. I have play tested a lot of games with this list and it definitely need another vendetta to top off the anti av14 and yes with plasma guns in them or even a couple heavy flamer vet squad. Thanks for the comments and I'm not trying to throw your guys advice to the trash but when you basically say every part of this list is trash all I have to say is let's play then. In 2000 points 11 vehicle mech army is average.

Pretty sure he was talking about hull mounted HFs.

Your list will have trouble with high armor armies. Even with ordinance hitting side armor with 2 dice, you're still looking at hurting Side 13 on 4+, with S10 weaponry. That's where your list will have trouble. And if a squad survives to assault a few of your squads you're screwed.

Masos wrote:PDF Chem-Dog Veterans

HQ- Company Command Squad with 4x Plasma Guns, in Chimera
HQ- Company Command Squad with 4x Plasma Guns, in Chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x plasma guns, chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 1x heavy flamer, 2x flamers, Chimera
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x melta guns (vendetta)
Troop- Veteran Squad with 3x melta guns(vendetta)
Fast- Vendetta Gunship
Fast- Vendetta Gunship

Heavy- Manticore Rocket Launcher
Heavy- Manticore Rocket Launcher
Heavy- Leman Russ Executioner with side plasma cannons

This is my current list. Looking for some suggestions on the list itself and some ideas on 500 more points to add in so i can take this list to ard boyz. i was thinking one more vendetta and 2 Banewolf or/hell hound or some battle psykers in chimera. but i cant make my mind up!!! oh and i need to hear your guys opinions on adding plasma pistols to the groups with plasma guns :-)

List is pretty weak I think. I would put your Melta Vets into chimeras . Drop all your flamer and plasma gun vets and go for normal platoon guys in Chimeras. Take a platoon command squad with 4 flamers if you want to get something worth wild. I would also drop one plasma company command squad and put a lord commisar in for the Stubborn bubble. You need bodies and scoring units.

Drop the Vendetta Gunships they are obsolete in competitive game play (I know some people are going to scream at this but top players will blow them out of the water first). I would focus on either Hellhounds or Devil dogs. Also your Lemen russ is filling the role to kill Terminators but you really jsut need more shots. I would go for Hydras and either get two medusa in the list if you want something that can cross between AV 14 and killing terminators.

You also need one armored sentthat can tar pit units or counter assault and buy you time if need be.

Thank you for your advice. I'm going to rebuild this list a bit break it down into more units for my buck. And with the infantry platoon how do you guys think 3 heavy hwt with either all auto cannons or 1 with 3 auto cannons and 2 with LC that can sit back with a command squad to be able to twin linked to help take down big armor along with a couple medusas. But I need to invest in a couple he'll hounds for sure. I'll prob still run 4 or 4 vet squads with meltas. I'm going to play test it through but I've thought meltas were a bit more competitive then plasmas. But I really appreciate the advice it will go far.

Ok so you say scatterable artillery are not the best at killing av 14. I'm sorry to say but ur a joker. I can fire the manticore directly so im d3 strength 10 ordnance taking my bs from the scatter. That's a lot of chances to hit on anything av 14 because the avage size of a av14 vehicle is 4x7in land raider and 6x6in monolith . I've play tested it for about 3 months and Strength 10 ordnance need 4 5 6 on 2d6 taking the highest one and the center of the templets hits it's ap1 which means I can kill on a glance.

Your obviously playing it wrong... you place the first template based on scatter (1/3 chance to hit, 2d6 scatter on a miss, -3") and then each template after that is a scatter roll but you place it on the adjacent and touching the edge of the template. They do not overlap or anything. Page 32 base rule book

IYou know what... I don't care, do what you want. All you have done is fight every bit of advice given because /obviously/ you know better because you played 3 months. Don't sit there and say 'thanks for the advice, but your an idiot'.

Problem is, your showing a total lack of knowledge of the rules, from this thread to the thread where you claimed troops in a Chimera can get Orders due to the 'Command Vehicle' rule. I am sure your stuff works amazing when you do it wrong to your advantage and ignore how it is actually suppose to be played.

On a side note. According to the IG FAQ the Manticores Ord. Large Blast Marker is Strength 10 for the whole thing not just under the center hole. Not that this makes a difference, cause he's obviously not playing the rest of his list right. Just saying.

BlkTom wrote:
Your obviously playing it wrong... you place the first template based on scatter (1/3 chance to hit, 2d6 scatter on a miss, -3") and then each template after that is a scatter roll but you place it on the adjacent and touching the edge of the template. They do not overlap or anything. Page 32 base rule book

IYou know what... I don't care, do what you want. All you have done is fight every bit of advice given because /obviously/ you know better because you played 3 months. Don't sit there and say 'thanks for the advice, but your an idiot'.

Problem is, your showing a total lack of knowledge of the rules, from this thread to the thread where you claimed troops in a Chimera can get Orders due to the 'Command Vehicle' rule. I am sure your stuff works amazing when you do it wrong to your advantage and ignore how it is actually suppose to be played.

That interpretation of how the Manticore works is quite debatable. When fired directly, it most certainly does not work that way as it fires exactly as a multiple blast ordnance weapon. When fired indirectly as a barrage, it technically does not fit the description of Multiple Barrage rules as the Multiple Barrage rules apply to "Units with multiple weapons". Some people do choose to play it as a Multiple Barrage weapon when firing indirectly.

The difference in accuracy is night and day between using it as a Multiple Blast weapon and as a Multiple Barrage weapon, and unless a TO has some arbitrary ruling that it works as the latter, I always argue in favor of playing it as Multiple Blast.



That said, OP still doesn't know what he's talking about. The Manticore is most certainly not AP1 anywhere on the template.

Ok blk Tom you are once again a joker and I laugh at you. I have been playing ig for 6 years and tyranids for 8 and chaos since 2000 so don't try to say I'm a newbie and obviously you are butt hurt because I and others have made points against you. And I think you need to relook at the direct fire compared to barrage because I get to pick which one I want to use. And yes I misspoke on the chimera rule yes but don't assume I know nothing because I simply misspoke on one rule. Plus I'm not throwing everyone's advice away. Just because i disagreed with you and now your butts aching. And I never said the manticores main purpose was to kill armor I simply said it was good at poping vehicles. Which if you fire them directly it works well but I know it dosent matter what I say at this point because you obviously think you are the god of 40k and your words are set in stone. In all seriousness I would have never posted my list if I didn't want advice just because I disagree with you Blktom dosent mean crap. Because I am listening very closely to the advice darkwynn he accually gave me constructive criticism not just bull gak criticism trying to deconstruct my list completely saying it sucks and it won't take me far with absolutely no advice at all. Once again it all chalks up to me saying something that upset you. So all I have to say is if you have something constructive to say then say it if not shut up re read your rule book on multiple templet reagular ordnance not barrage Blktom ! and yes it was rude and i consider it talking gak to say that I have been playing for only three months.

bigbaboonass wrote:On a side note. According to the IG FAQ the Manticores Ord. Large Blast Marker is Strength 10 for the whole thing not just under the center hole. Not that this makes a difference, cause he's obviously not playing the rest of his list right. Just saying.

Link? not trying to argue, just curious. I don't seem to be able to find it.


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Masos wrote:Ok blk Tom you are once again a joker and I laugh at you. I have been playing ig for 6 years and tyrannies for 8 and chaos since 2000 so don't try to say I'm a newbie and obviously you are butt hurt because I made points against you. Yes the whole Templet counts as str 10. And I think you need to relook at the direct fire compared to barrage because I get to pick which one I want to use. And yes I misspoke on the chimera rule yes but don't assume I know nothing because I simply misspoke on one rule. Plus I'm not throwing everyone's advice away just disagreed with you and now your but hurt like crazy wining but aching. And I never said the manticores main purpose was to kill armor I simply said it was good at poping vehicles. Which if you fire them directly it works well but I know it dosent matter what I say at this point because of the butt aching, you obviously think you are the god of 40k and your words are set in stone. In all seriousness I would have never posted my list if I didn't want advice just because I disagree with you Blktom dosent mean crap. Because I am listening very closely to the advice darkwynn he accually gave me constructive criticism not just bull gak criticism trying to deconstruct my list completely saying it sucks and it won't take me far with absolutely no advice at all. Once again it all chalks up to me saying something that ripped ur crap hole open. So all I have to say is if you have something constructive to say then say it if not shut up re read your rule book on multiple templet reagular ordnance not barrage Blktom !

Ever heard of Rule #1? At no point was BlkTom Rude to you. Good luck with you future lists and questions.

I've read the Imperial Guard FAQ and the only way I can see anyone thinking the Manticore gets S10 against vehicles under the entirety of its blast is by badly misreading the first errata entry. The IG FAQ doesn't even mention Manticores.

Link because alarmingrick asked for one

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1490293a_FAQ_ImperialGuard_2009.pdf IG FAQ
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?categoryId=1000018&pIndex=1&aId=3400019&multiPageMode=true&start=2 FAQ section of GW website

So whats "leafblower" about this list?

I never said the weapon was ap1 over aby part of the templet i said ordance is ap 1 if the target is under the hole in the center of the templet. You guys are totally right the manticore is not mentioned in the FAQ. Which makes my point even more dead on with being able to direct fire my manticore as ordnance. Can a LRBT can fire all it's weapons when moving combat speed ?

Masos wrote: LRBT can fire all it's weapons when moving combat speed again understanding of the rules.

Ummm... no.

Lumbering Behemoth allows for the turret to fire at combat speed along with any other weapons normally fired at speed... So turret +1.


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Masos wrote:I've play tested it for about 3 months and Strength 10 ordnance need 4 5 6 on 2d6 taking the highest one and the center of the templets hits it's ap1 which means I can kill on a glance.

You did say AP1 BTW.

AND NO I DID NOT SAY ANY PART OF THE TEMPLET IS AP 1!!!!!! You Misunderstood. The main word you have to focus on is CENTER!!! IF THE TEMPLET HITS THE CENTER!!! In order for a ordance to be full str hit it has to be AP1. you understand!!! do you will understand byte unless your dense..... Good. And for the LRBT i dont usally run them because i feel its a waste of points but i was told that rule by a freind at a local GW obviously he was wrong but thank you for the set straight on the LRBT ill will be dropping it from my list unless i run a demolisher or vanquisher with a LC because i like the sounds of that or i will just add in 2 medusas seems alittle more realistic. KNOWLEDGE IS POWER LMFAO!!!! Oh and what makes it a leafblower.... more of an unconventional leafblower. I had no idea what a leafblower was i just made this list went to my local GW and my buddy said " ahhh jumped on the leafblower band wagon" i had no idea what he was talking about i just made the list out of the codex. but i thought i would post it up see if anyone could help me make it into a real leafblower so your question is awnsered its really not a true leaf blower just trying to be.

Raxmei wrote:I've read the Imperial Guard FAQ and the only way I can see anyone thinking the Manticore gets S10 against vehicles under the entirety of its blast is by badly misreading the first errata entry. The IG FAQ doesn't even mention Manticores.

Link because alarmingrick asked for one

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1490293a_FAQ_ImperialGuard_2009.pdf IG FAQ
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?categoryId=1000018&pIndex=1&aId=3400019&multiPageMode=true&start=2 FAQ section of GW website

Just wanted to make sure i wasn't missing something. Thanks Raxmei!

Byte, don't you love the "Thanks" you get for helping Masos?!

HA.... well i did say thanks for setting me stright on the rule lumbering behamoth. At least i can admit when im wrong unlike BlkTom. You guys take everything to heart. can anyone awnser my question vaquesher or demolisher??? for some extra AV 14 poping power. Also Alarmingrick..... KNOWLEDGE IS POWER LMFAO!!!! was a zing on myself. People on this site take everything to close to heart like im slapping your mom in the face or something. All i was saying is that byte you mis read or i mis wrote it either way we both hopfully know the god damn rule for ordance. I know we all have the same rulebook damn. No one has even mentioned how i can improve the list beside darkwynn all you guys have been doing is bringing up minor rules, typos and stupid crap like that. so what do you think would be better for a leablower a demolisher vaquisher or medusa x2. Im leaning towards medusas because the only person that has not rule battered me suggested it.


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Heres the updated list hopfully more on the right track. and sorry if i seem abit mean thats just the way i say i love you.
I would like constructive criticisim thanks guys.
List #1

HQ- CCS melta gun x4 w/ chimera HF ML
Troop- Vets melta gun x3 w/ chimera HF ML
Troop- Vets melta gun x3 w/ chimera HF ML
Troop- Vets melta gun x3 w/ chimera HF ML
Troop- Vets melta gun x3 w/ chimera HF ML
Troop- infantry platoon
Command, flamer x4
IS, melta gun x,1 , AC w/ chimera
IS, melta gun x,1 , AC
HWT, LC x3
HWT, LC x3
HWT, LC x3
Vendetta
Vendetta
Manticore
Manticore
Vaquisher or demolisher w/ LC or Medusa x2

List #2 sticking to the vets and trying the heavy flamer in vendettas.

HQ-Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF
HQ- Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF,
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Heavy- Manticore -160
Heavy- Manticore- 160
Heavy- Medusa x2

which one is better were do i need improvment thank you guys.

Actually, I must be dense... could you clarify why you think ordnance weapons are AP1 when centered. I'm serious. Page number?

Barrage is pinning -1 LD, ordnance hits side armor value, so on... never heard of your new rule(AP1 with center on tank), but if its legit i would to know where its at.

@alarmingrick - Aye, indeed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I like your List #2 best, however...

List #2 sticking to the vets and trying the heavy flamer in vendettas.

HQ-Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF
HQ- Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF,
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Heavy- Manticore -160
Heavy- Manticore- 160
Heavy- Medusa x2

The Vendetta & HF Vet doesn't seem right. Vendetta is long range support and of course the HFs(lots of points to) and flamers are close in. I guess it could work as a back line defense unit. It just seems like a waste of BS4.

Hellhounds and Devil Dogs keep being brought up. May want to consider. Vendettas drop like flies due to missile spam.

BTW- Darkwynn created the original Leaf Blower and won National 'ard boys with it.

My humble apologies byte I'm sorry I was very mistaken. You have some really good ideas and comments. I like the vet idea too and I made the list and tried to follow some ideas I got here on dakka and I did everything but take the vendettas out because I already bought the damn things.

Byte wrote: HQ-Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF
HQ- Command Squad 4x plasma, Chimera, HF,
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns chimera HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 3x melta guns, Chimera, HF
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Troop- Veterans, 1x heavy flamer 2x flamers
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Fast- Vendetta – 130
Heavy- Manticore -160
Heavy- Manticore- 160
Heavy- Medusa x2

I like this list, save for the Vets having flamers. I'd stick with keeping the HF on the Chimera, making the most of the BS4 you're paying for.
I'd probably go 1 more Plasma Vet sqd. and 1 more Melta Vet sqd.

I'd consider dropping 1 of the Manticore for a pair of Hydras. or the Medusa pair for a pair of Hydras.
That's alot of medium to long range STR. 10 in that list. But Hydras will help with fast vehicles and MCs.

And Masos, the Vanquisher isn't worth it, IMHO. The Demo is feared for a good reason.

Accepted. Just remember rule #1 and you will be fine around here.

If ya already bought the models give them a go! I'm in the same boat. I have 3! I only have 1 hellhound right now, but will expand them once i get my list ironed out.

Thread locked until OP learns rule #1