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Hello Forum

I generally play 40k and only recently started warhammer fantasy, so the wysiwyg rule in warhammer fantasy is unfamiliar to me.
My dilemma is, I have the dreadlord with great weapon model, but i want that great weapon to be a crimson death. In the armybook, the crimson death is described as a HUGE halberd.
If i was to paint the great weapon in a way, that it would scream crimson death, would i still be allowed to use it?

Thanks

Fantasy is muuuuch more lenient then 40k. You don't have to have the exact weapon on the model as long as you can keep it straight as to what the model is using.
"This doesn't mean that the model has to have a sword to use the 'Ogre Blade'. We can simply assume that his axe, hammer, or other suitable hand weapon has the same properties and is, for example, and Ogre Axe'."

Yes, you are fine in using the model.

WYSIWYG in Fantasy is much less stringent than in 40k. In your case, you can assume the Crimson Death is a huge sword that happens to use the rules of a halberd.

Thanks guys!

In fluff terms, the halberd got re-forged into a great weapon...

More to the point, in Fantasy you are allowed to keep your magic items secret until a game-fuction of the item comes into play. The enemy doesn't know that halberd is the Crimson Death until it gets used in combat. The enemy doesn't know you carry the Other Trickster's Shard until they have to reroll a ward save. They don't know you have the Ring of Hotek until they roll doubles and miscast...

WYSIWYG is pretty much non existant in fantasy if I remember correctly. I always assume my magical weapons are tucked away under a cloak, or sheated until ready to use, so the enemy doesn't see them coming. How you'd do that with a halberd... I'm not quite sure but I'm pretty sure there's no rule in fantasy stating you have to have every weapon modeled like there is in 40k.

It exists, but its much looser then in 40k.

A magic weapon like the "Sword of Bloodshed" doesn't actually have to be a sword. It could be any weapon you want it to be as long as it is clear what he's got.

Naturally, if something is specifically stated to be a particular type of weapon(like the Brettonian magic lances) then it should look like that weapon or at least have a similer effect.

Things like amulets don't need to be modeled, most models have enough little hangy bits to where it could pass as something they have.

If a dude has magic armor he should probably have some sort of armor on his person. If hes got a shield he should have a shield or something like it on him.

one thing you'll find in fantasy that you won't in 40k is people actually have pockets pouches and all kinds of neat little compartments to hold things. Alternatively trying to find a pocket on a space marine is kinda difficult, so naturally if he has something spectacular it kinda needs to be stuck to his person.

And course like said its the magical element of the weapon that your paying for mostly when it comes to magical weapons or armor not the actual form in which they take 99% of the time.

The only thing i do really is if I have or can obtain the right parts to represent something I will always strive to use it, just because thats how I am, i'd never really imagine enforcing WYSIWYG.

my only gripe is playing those, stand in games where someone uses idk a 40k walker as a fantasy steam tank or, some random goblins that represent chaos warriors or something, thats where I tend to draw lines to my opponents >.<

Whilst the topic is up, may I post a couple o' questions of my own?
(I assume that yes, that I may).

I model my Vamp Lord with a lance. Would you consider that to be ok as an Ogre Blade, since +2 S on the charge is at least slightly related to +2 S always. Would you accept that? Do you think a tournament would accept that?

If I were to play it as a Sword of Strife then? +2 A is not remotely like +2 S on the charge, but well. Would you accept that? Do you think a tourny would allow it?

If you answer "No" on my second question, then what if I bought him a Lance as well as a magical weapon? Sure, now he actually has a Lance, but he will never use it anyways, so I could just as well have skipped that step and save some points to get the same result as question 2. If you wouldn't allow a Sword of Strife as a Lance, would you allow me to buy both a Lance and a Sword of Strife? He'll be completely WYSIWYG that way.
Do you think a tourny would accept it?

I wouldn't mind but to be safe with a TO ypu'll likely need to buy a lance, altho just asking ahead is advised. As far as magical weapons go unless otherwise stated they are assumed to be some form of hand weapon, and that's what people expect to see.

How about a shield... hidden under a sorcerer's robe?! Hijacking a lil the thread still on the same order. I gave my chaos sorc a charmed shield however the model doesn't have one, and I really liked the model to ruin it by pasting a warriors shield on the back of my squishy sorc... couldn't it be made or magic?! or hidden by a spell?

Ahh the old "a wizard did it" IMO that allways works
Like i said i don't mind but for a tourney only the TO can decide, thus asking him is you'r best bet. That or have an alternate model (or at least an arm).

Lord Yayula wrote:How about a shield... hidden under a sorcerer's robe?! Hijacking a lil the thread still on the same order. I gave my chaos sorc a charmed shield however the model doesn't have one, and I really liked the model to ruin it by pasting a warriors shield on the back of my squishy sorc... couldn't it be made or magic?! or hidden by a spell?

It's an innate magic spell that creates a shimmering magic shield before the sorcerer. Done. I've actually never heard of anyone getting trouble for the way a character was modeled. Just have a full army lists ready and printed and always remember to announce what weapon you're using at the start of a combat.

WYSIWYG only exists as a unit requirement of over half, so if over half the gear on the char is correct he's RAW legal.

HoverBoy wrote:WYSIWYG only exists as a unit requirement of over half, so if over half the gear on the char is correct he's RAW legal.

I believe that's slightly incorrect. The requirement refers to units, and more than half the models has to have the exact gear.
So in a unit of 10 HWS Warriors, minimum six of them need to have HWS. As long as minimum more than half of the MODELS in the unit are 100% correct, it's okay.

So with a character, the character would need to have 100% correct equipment.

Nope he's a unit and has no special rule to follow so the same applies.

Yes, but... How to say... It's not 50+% of the gear that needs to be right, it's 50+% of the models that need to be right.

For example, a ten man unit.
4 of them have Spears and shields.
4 of them have two hand weapons.
2 of them have Hand weapon and shield.

Under your definition, that would run as a HWS unit, since there's more than 50% shields and more than 50% hand weapons... Though HWS is the least ocurring combination there.

My reasoning is that the minimum is that 50+% of the models in a unit most be absolutely, completely, 100% correct in equipment.

For a character, that means that 50+% of the models in his unit need to be absolutely correctly equipped... And since he's all alone, then 50+% of the models means that 1 model most be 100% correctly equipped. And so he has to have all the correct equipment.

Sorry if it's kind of hard to follow my reasoning, but it's a little hard to explain.

So the character just has to have the obvious equipment modeled(50% of 1 rounding up is 1)

If hes got a magic weapon, he should have a weapon of some kind(preferably ornate looking)

If hes got a magic shield, he should have a shield or something like a shield somewhere.



The "Crown of Command" doesn't have to be a Crown. it could be a circlet, a magic ring, or maybe its a powerful enchantment that he got cast upon himself.


I think the general rule is that as long as you can justify it logically you can have something be something different with the same effects. Like I could have my "magic ring of regeneration" count as a healing potion or my "Pointy hat of power" as my Channeling staff.

Grey Templar wrote:So the character just has to have the obvious equipment modeled(50% of 1 rounding up is 1)

If hes got a magic weapon, he should have a weapon of some kind(preferably ornate looking)

If hes got a magic shield, he should have a shield or something like a shield somewhere.



The "Crown of Command" doesn't have to be a Crown. it could be a circlet, a magic ring, or maybe its a powerful enchantment that he got cast upon himself.


I think the general rule is that as long as you can justify it logically you can have something be something different with the same effects. Like I could have my "magic ring of regeneration" count as a healing potion or my "Pointy hat of power" as my Channeling staff.

I think your latter statement contradicts the first. If he's got a magic weapon, why couldn't it be his charged fists/claws of doom? avoiding the requirement of a weapon. In the case of a magic shield the model's skin could be hardened giving the +1 save so there isn't reaaaally that much of the need to model shield/weapons, after all these 2 options can be justified.

Actually i think I'll go with the skin on my sorc to give him the +1 and just say magic avoids the first hit, after all one of the eye of the gods effects is to harden your skin.

The way that I have always played at my local GW is this

Magic items are secret until they effect the game as normal, but if any of your magic items are weapons or armor if an opponent asks you tell them what kind of MUNDANE equipment it is.

For example Heavy Armor + Enchanted Shield +Ogre Blade would look to your opponent before they encounter the hero in CC as a 4+ armor save with a parry from a hand weapon. Some items count as a "lance" or "Great Weapon" in which case you tell them what they can see at a glance. Special characters obviously have set equipment so we tell the opponents what they have and let them read the rules for themselves to avoid conflict and we feel that its a balance with the power of a SC and the mystery of a created one.

As for the miniature, just use what you think is coolest. If you want to model it feel free, if not use a neat model as long as you tell your opponent ahead of time what the "mundane" equipment equivalent is on him it should not be a problem.

I don't think it was said, but read the the magic weapons section of the BRB. It actually SAYS that weapons do not have to be as their name provides. "Sword of Bloodshed" could in fact be a "Mace of Bloodshed". I don't have the book on me, but if someone does, it's actually in there.

I also assume this goes for the rest of the magic items. Besides the fact that GW loves to leave kits unavailable for units, they definitely don't have every character to provide for every item possible, so at least they are lenient in that sense.

True but you still have very few options to cover – HW, GW, Spear, Lance and AHW.