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I think the title says it all. What is the best army for a WHFB beginner and why?

Didn't we do this already, like a few weeks ago.

I didnt think so. We have had quite a few "best army for me" but I thought a flat blanket poll would stop those from popping up

Ogres. ETL, HTM.

HoverBoy wrote:Didn't we do this already, like a few weeks ago.

aye, but it makes a change from pick my army

I had to vote high elves for this one as I find them very forgiving.

I remember back in the day people used to tell me to start with empire or orks, good times sadly I wouldn't have to agree.


When you look at the trends of the 8th edition rule book some of the major things that stand out are

steadfast tarpit // steadfast horde // steadfast... // dwelling

And when I look at a high elf list I see, for 15pts per one, swordmasters are able to shred and break steadfast / tarpits very quickly.

Shadow lore simply aids this, the hexes and destruction from that, as well as high magic allowing Fotp allows them to both negate hordes/tarpits quickly and play as a dweller as well.

Then you go to them actually horde/tarpit'ing as well with there spear-men which are better at it then everyone else albeit slightly more expensive (afaik?) It simply leaves a lot of room open for mistake because of the sheer quality of high elf units in the modern ruleset.

Then from a unit stand point, they both look nice and have access to every unit type in the game except artillery which they can make up for easily through magic and bolts.

I think:

Lizardmen, Warriors of Chaos, Ogres


My criteria being that they have very strong base troops and even if you took just "vanilla" builds, or pure melee builds, you could still do okay. But the armies also have enough room that you can slowly expand into more complex ideas as you master the beginning stuff. WoC is probably one of the best at this (IMHO) just because the army choices are so many.

I'd have to say high elves.

High Elves not just for the points mentioned already, but because Island of Blood allows you to begin your collection with easy to assemble models.

I'd say WoC or Lizardmen. Both have solid troops, great heroes and lords, relatively low model counts.

Just noticed no lizards on the list, guess they're the 1337 skillz army

Well ummm....Thats because I have not met a new lizardmen player who can play them well (this is the truth but really I just forgot one of my least favorite races in the game )

Johnny-Crass wrote:Well ummm....Thats because I have not met a new lizardmen player who can play them well

True that, my first games where a disaster

Every game I have played against them the guy would always run a super beefy BSB Slann but with no templeguard..... I play beastmen so guess what happened next

Ahh megaslaan the most overestimated pointsink.
Now make no mistake they are extreemly powerfull, but they're far from unbeatable.
Besides people who only run weblists deserve to loose every game, by alot, and then get laughed at by small children

I still don't see why WoC have so many votes, for a beginner it won't do anything for them. They will have dweller style magic, heavily armored infantry and absolutely no shooting.

A starter army of about 1000-1500 pts will concist of a handful of troops and the varying tactics surrounding them at a beginner level will be next to nothing.

The only thing I do agree with the WoC is you can pick them up and just play them and they will batter things relatively entertainingly. But as far as options go / selection of models / variation of playstyle and tactics go I find WoC a very limited army to a beginner?

for better or worse I guess it depends on your take more or less about what army would a beginner be able to win with over what a beginner would benefit most from.

I picked HE, they have some of everything other than tough things. I think they are really forgiving with ASF standard and a strong magic phase as well (exception vs 100 man bus).

I'd have to go for WoC, easy learning curve not hard to pick up even in non-GW stores, a lot of fun to play and some interesting fluff too

I chose HE's because
A) They are in IoB
B) Fairly easy to learn
C) Have solid tactics
D) Require easy to learn Strategy
E) Have units that can be used in each phase (so they can get a little experience with each phase of the game)
F) Have something for everyone (Wizards, Warriors, Chariots, Monsters, Shooting, Calvary, Elite Infantry, and great fluff.)

I would say its a tie between Ogres and Warriors of Chaos.

1: low model count means you have less money out of pocket and less models to paint. Boiling down to a larger army for less cash.

2: Very resilient models. Ogres have 5+ armor and 3 wounds, Chaos has 3+ armor(with shields) both are T4.

3: Balanced army books. Both have good movement, magic, and combat phases. Warriors don't have any real shooting besides Hellcannons, but thats ok.



Conversely, I say High Elves are NOT a good beginner army because the army book actually kinda sucks. Without Teclis, High Elves are mid tier at best. They really need magic to buff their troops up to even have a shot at killing stuff. Spearmen fall over to most other troops in combat because they are much more expensive for only gaining one extra rank of Str3 attacks and having ASF. BS based shooting isn't that great with current modifiers. And that just killed their core section(Seaguard do both shooting and CC for more points and same effectivness)

Only their special choices are any good in combat, but are expensive.

Their only warmachine is also grossely overcosted.

Elves have good characters and good special, but it doesn't do much for them.

Warriors of Chaos: low model count so affordable, beautiful models so they stay interested in the hobby aspects, great stats so can get a few wins at the beginning, cuts out one element (shooting) which helps them to learm the other phases more fully.

Honestly Khorne WoC would be even better since it is more simple.

I started GW games with 40K Chaos Marines because of the slight fantasy element of it it (my friends all wanted to play 40K not fantasy), and the fact that is was so basic helped me get up and running faster than my brother who chose Imperial Guard. After I had the basics down it was easier and I was more eager to try armies that exceled at other apsects of the game.

Just my opinion

You know what, I retract my last statements and arguments. The best army for beginners is the army that rings true to them. Do not play something because it is "beginner" friendly, or avoid something because of its learning curve, play what you truly think you would enjoy playing.

I love my Dwarfs, and am glad I started with them, but if I was to advise someone else I think I'd say Empire. Decent in all aspects of the game-shooting, combat, magic-and have a wide variety of good units...A nice, balanced army.










If only they weren't so bland....:(

I would say Lizardmen. Basic power-house wizard and core. But it's not even on the poll. Rivet is probably the most right on this though.

Grey Templar wrote:I would say its a tie between Ogres and Warriors of Chaos.

1: low model count means you have less money out of pocket and less models to paint. Boiling down to a larger army for less cash.

2: Very resilient models. Ogres have 5+ armor and 3 wounds, Chaos has 3+ armor(with shields) both are T4.

3: Balanced army books. Both have good movement, magic, and combat phases. Warriors don't have any real shooting besides Hellcannons, but thats ok.



Conversely, I say High Elves are NOT a good beginner army because the army book actually kinda sucks. Without Teclis, High Elves are mid tier at best. They really need magic to buff their troops up to even have a shot at killing stuff. Spearmen fall over to most other troops in combat because they are much more expensive for only gaining one extra rank of Str3 attacks and having ASF. BS based shooting isn't that great with current modifiers. And that just killed their core section(Seaguard do both shooting and CC for more points and same effectivness)

Only their special choices are any good in combat, but are expensive.

Their only warmachine is also grossely overcosted.

Elves have good characters and good special, but it doesn't do much for them.

Teclis is OP, able to force irresistible force on ANY double and then ignore the side effects of misscast once per turn, you can't seriously believe without him the army is mid tier @.@ Sword masters are obscene, the magic high elves can pull is obscene, white lions are also incrediably powerful. Hatred with always strike first and an avg initiave of 5, being able to fight spears full attacks in 3 ranks afaik. The points are well justified being 15pts per sword master for always strikes first initaive 5 str 5 2attacks rerolling everything, compare that with an executioner and see which is grossly over pointed.
As far as war machines go theres nothing wrong with the bolt thrower its pointage is absolutely fine. It's long range either a str 6 solid shot that scures ranks or a strength 4 with a minus 2 (+1 due to str) to your armor save. 90-100pts for the bolt thrower is a little expensive given skaven get a cannon for 90pts. Keep in mind they can mass use them if wanted forming 2 throwers per 1 rare choice letting you have 4 in 2000pts.

With all that in mind the fact that you get lotheren sea guard in the isle of blood box set only adds to there potential given the ability to have spearmen that shoot as well. I don't think chaos has much to match that you can really fit in 2000-1500 beginner point army and the limited selection choice means they won't gain a good experience with all types of units except by fighting them due to the lack of versatility within WoC army list.

The only beginner unfriendly element to the high elves is the book is out dated with 8th, but that is cleared up in isle of blood set.

You know what, I retract my last statements and arguments. The best army for beginners is the army that rings true to them. Do not play something because it is "beginner" friendly, or avoid something because of its learning curve, play what you truly think you would enjoy playing.

All in all thats the best answer to this really.

I don't mean to come across to argue an opinion ofc your entitled, but in 8th I can't stand people calling high elves a 2nd tier team at best and the idea of playing someone using teclis alone is sickening xD

Sasa0mg wrote:
Teclis is OP, able to force irresistible force on ANY double and then ignore the side effects of misscast once per turn, you can't seriously believe without him the army is mid tier

Grey Templar wrote:
Without Teclis, High Elves are mid tier at best.

you will notice the disclaimer I had in my rant.

Teclis is OP. However, the rest of the army is rather meh. And considering all competitive enviroments that have comp ban Teclis you really can't use him very often.

Take away Teclis. Now your Spearmen don't have garunteed access to the things that make them awsome, like Mindrazor or Lore of Life(the lore works best when you are garunteed certain spells, which requires a magic item that can't combine with the book of hoeth, IIRC, due to cost)

the HE core are sucky to meh. Specials are good, but squishy so if they don't kill whats attacking them they are going to die. Dragons are cannon fodder, bolt throwers are overcosted, cavelry is bad in 8th, core doesn't perform at all...


I stand by my saying that HEs as an army book in the existing competitive enviroment don't do so well.

Rivet wrote:You know what, I retract my last statements and arguments. The best army for beginners is the army that rings true to them. Do not play something because it is "beginner" friendly, or avoid something because of its learning curve, play what you truly think you would enjoy playing.

See I agree with this up to a point. In my local group we had a guy who started Brets (not a beginner friendly army at all) and every game he played he would just get smashed aside. And I mean every game. He was starting to get disheartened so we all came together helped him with his list and some of us even started throwing games for him. He got better by a great deal but what I am trying to say is he almost quit because he started a hard to learn army.

So play what you like but make sure someone can teach you how to use your army

Grey, until I see it for myself I just can't agree, the spearmen are able to do what no other spearmen can and fight in 3 ranks, sword masters are 'cheap' by comparison to the damage they can do. Although they don't have garunteed access to buffs that would tip the scales way over who does?

So far I haven't heard much of high elves losing if anything they've become, for ignorance of the term the new "flavor of the month" for people in my area and high elf players are practically crawling out of the wood work.

Spearelves fight in 4 ranks in nonhorde. But really they are way to fragile to hold up in the ensuing grindfest. I have sent 50 Beastbanner Wildformed gors into 50 Highelf spearmen and won the combat that very turn.

Highelf units may look good on paper but they never hold up

Johnny-Crass wrote:Spearelves fight in 4 ranks in nonhorde. But really they are way to fragile to hold up in the ensuing grindfest. I have sent 50 Beastbanner Wildformed gors into 50 Highelf spearmen and won the combat that very turn.

Highelf units may look good on paper but they never hold up

If that's how it is then I certainly hope your right I'll be playing them league and comp's upcoming throughout the start of the year from members at my own GW lol Yet to play them 'myself' in 8th over 500pts but I've seen and heard other people pull off quite spectacular wins with them.