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My origional question was going to be, what is the ''best'' army in Fantasy at the moment.

But unlike in 40k, saying something like that is considered slander to a fantasy player, is it not?

So, i've changed my question.

What is each armies best points? Solid infantry? Easy magic? etc etc

RatWolf wrote:My origional question was going to be, what is the ''best'' army in Fantasy at the moment.

But unlike in 40k, saying something like that is considered slander to a fantasy player, is it not?

It's not that its 'slander' to Fantasy players, it's just that Fantasy really is better balanced than 40k in 8th edition. There is no 'go-to' awesome army. There's stronger armies and weaker armies (which tend to be the really old books waiting for an update), but on the whole it's a pretty level playing field.

Well, thats good to know.

In 40k theres alot of ''oh, thats armies so OP, why dont I get such good stuff''. -_-

Orcs & Goblins do rather well in smaller-point games. Most of the better unit combinations are rather cheap, you have access to cheap characters & specialists early on, etcetera. Not much can stand up to 4 War Machines, a brick of Big 'Uns, a two bricks of Night Goblins (with some upgrades), a General (Ld. 9 after magic items), and a BSB all at 1000 points.

Alternatively, drop the Big 'Uns for some specialists at less (Ex: Two units of 15 Squigs and 10 Herders), as all-Goblin lists at this level aren't bad either. With just Goblins, a Lord (Common Goblin), BSB (Night Goblin), and Level 2 Shaman (Night Goblin) cost you just barely over 200pts. Hell, as a sample list at 1000 points:

Goblin Warboss
Sword of Striking
Potion of Strength
Light Armor
Shield

Night Goblin BSB
Light Armor
Shield
Banner of Discipline

Night Goblin Shaman
Level 2
Dispel Scroll

30 Night Goblins
Netters
x2 Fanatics
Standard
Musician

30 Night Goblins
Netters
x2 Fanatics
Standard
Musician

Squig Herd
15 Squigs
10 Herders

2 Bolt Throwers

Doom Diver Catapult


EDIT: As you can see above, that's a LOT of power behind it. Only three Animosity tests / turn (meaning on average you'll fail only three times / game, so a 1,1 Animosity requires bad rolling), two Multi-Wound shots a turn, a Heavy Infantry / Cavalry killer both at a range (Doom Diver Catapult) and up close (Fanatics), three bricks (one of which should put out around 18 WS4 S5 attacks)...

Orcs in Fantasy / 40K really excel in lower point games. As you go up other options present themselves, but typically High Elves / Dark Elves / whatever can make better use of the extra force options.

Right now I am very much enjoying the wide range of lists the VC can employ. Granted the mindless undead deal can be a bummer espeacially in a hard fought close game but thems the breaks for the other cool stuff like terrorgheists, mortis engine, etc.

I'll take a stab at it. Cuz I'm sick and high on drugs.

Ogres:
-Cheap to purchase in real life
-Multi-wounds
-Stomp for everyone
-Best MC in the game
-Nearly best elite shooter
-One of the best cannons
-Super fighty spellcasters
-"easy" play style

TK
-Easy to paint
-mass buffed hordes can become very powerful
-hard to keep down unless you have good anti spell
-a really nice spell list
-some monsters that aren't bad
-some solid named heroes/lords

HE
-Teclis
-Crazy magic items
-Some really good elite infantry
-ASF
-Best or close to best magic casters

O&G
-Funny as hell
-Different play styles supported, shooty, war machines, infantry, monstrous infantry (trolls)
-Bang for your buck units
-Some solid named heroes/lords

WoC
-40000 different unit types so every play style imaginable except all-shooty
-Really good magic
-Really elite troops
-Some of the best looking models around, nearly the poster child for WHFB

Lizardmen
-Some of the best casters in the game that are extremely customizeable and they're big buddha frogs
-Great lore
-One of the best synergies between units/casters
-Great infantry
-Pretty good monsters
-Salamanders!

Daemons
-Probably the most/best named characters in any book. Actually worth their points and then some.
-Huge giant scary daemons lords
-one of the best infantries
-one of the best shooters
-one of the best monstrous cavalries
-insanely cheap and powerful heroes
-ward saves everywhere, magic attacks everywhere
-"not spells or items" so you can't remove them

Skaven
-Incredible war machines
-Funny, unpredictable results
-A handful of the most piss-off-your-opponents units (slaves and abominations)
-lots and lots of variety with weapons teams
-Some really good spell lists
-Played right (cheesy) one of the hardest armies to beat IMHO

Dwarfs
-Everyone tough
-Everyone has good armor
-Lots of war machines
-gunline gunline gunline
-unique rune system where you can modify items not normally modifiable, like war machines. Not sure if this will last in new book
-best anti-magic

*******the rest I don't like as much so I don't know as well****

Empire really falls under jack of all trades as you can build a empire list to fit almost any style you see fit.

Beastmen have a very strong magic phase and very strong yet overpriced core.

Beastmen
-Primal Fury hatred even after the first round of combat by passing a leadership test with LD10 and BSB rerolls the chance to fail this is exceptionally low, plus the advantage of the rare double 1's granting hatred and frenzy.
-Disagreeing with Johnny here on overpriced core, 8 points for a WS4 T4 2A model is cheap, sure S3 is lackluster but between Beast Banner and Wildform that can be boosted, plus M5. Some people will see the lack of armor as a downside but lets be honest, I can't remember the last time I faced a S3 block generally I'm looking at S4 and S5 in which case armor hardly matters, and they do not fear lore of metal. Let us not forget even without a general and BSB nearby they still have a 50/50 chance of getting hatred, look at daemons or empire which have to add a character into their unit to get that for the first round of combat. Also cheap are 30 point 5 man ungor raiders which make great chaff.
-Bestigor are beasts WS4 T4 S6! Sprinkle on again primal fury.
-Doombulls are boss. Talk about a mini bloodthirster, throw them in front of some minotaurs for supporting attacks next to gorebulls and you got one serious unit that will crush anything in the game and only gets stronger in the way of more attacks with each combat won.
-Our shaman aren't made of glass, with the right equip and protection the Greater Bray Shaman can take on challenges and come up on top as well as generating bonus power dice for him the more models he kills.
-Herdstone, 50 points for an item that gives you multiple power dice before channeling, park 2-3 shamans a turn around this thing and you are getting 2-3 extra power dice before channeling a turn, add on channeling and winds of magic rolls and you are looking at 10-12 power dice, then use those level 1 shaman around the stone to get off miasmas making the enemy easier to carve into.
-Also we have a lot of mediocre to sucky monster choices.
-Downside to beastmen is little to no shooting.

Well I love our gors with all my heart but I really think we should be 6 points base..... <.<

....a skaven is 4pts base ...
whats the 2pts difference?

And a chaos marauder is 4 points base.....

And a Gnoblar is 2.5 points base......

What's your point?

Compare a gors stats to a marauders and I dont think that the loss of I and the gaining of movement toughness and hatred is worth 4 points. I still love my gors but really the chaos book stole everything from us

Beastmen

- Very cheap and effective core. so few points for a unit that has to this day killed of just about anything they have run into when I field them.
- Primal fury is a divine gift. Always handy to have
- Decent lords and heros
-Rewarding army to play and master.
- The chance of 80 Gors poping up behind your enemy is just good times
- Warhounds are great as a screening force and as anti warmachines with excelet movement

It's 3 points. 4T is pretty huge. That alone is worth 1.19 points in a pure slugfest trade. They also have ambush. And it's not hatred, it's primal fury, which is much much better.

Though they do have a whole let upgrade options.

I agree with the HE points listed above. High and Dark Elves will take a major hit when they get redone as they will go from having 4 or 5 pages of magic items to like 9(VC literally have 9 magic items, it's terrible).

Dark Elves:
Awesome character builds
huge variety of magic items
Excellent magic offense
Relatively cheap core(compared to HE) for what they do
Way cheap Hydra
Dragons are viable
Elite infantry can fill different roles

In general WHFB does seem to be more a game of Rock Paper Scissors (Although it's more like Rock paper Scissors Lizard Spock). That is, if I bring my artillery list, you brign your cavalry list, I lose. Only you have Magic, Cavalry, Artillery, Infantry and MSU (which never works)


That said - and from what I understand of the armies I play which are Tomb Kings and Empire, here are the bullets of those armies:

Tomb Kings:
- Medium cost block infantry
- Very high toughness on units making them hard to kill
- Medium to light armor
- Great magic but only in a supportive role, not very offensive.
- Heroic Killing Blow and Killing Blow works great against heavy armored armies (like WoC)
- SLOW!!!! This is very detrimetnal and in fact one of the reasons I started empire as well. The army can't march... Period.... A spell will allow them to take a free move but that can easily be dispelled (and usually is if I'm facing against shooty armies)


Empire:
- Medium cost block infantry
- very versatile, many different builds
- War machine heavy
- strong magic item support
- Great anti-magic (capability of dominating the opponents magic phase with priests and anti-magic items.)
- Weak vs. armies which require magic to hit (etherial)
- Mediocre stat line for most units including comparable lords and heroes (but commensurate with cost)
-

Woc good times ws 5 core take that all other core choices
Marauders dirt cheap and hit harder than a semi truck.

Your guys are strong enough as is so who then needs buff magic?
Pfft buff magic is for wimps, the untalented and slow pokes. 3 awesome lores aside from the general magic.