Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So, I just wanted to see what peole would answer. WARNING! This is not a whinning thread, it's just a thread where you say what you would change and why, so in a way it ain't really whinning. Here's my answers:

1-More communication between GW and its customers
why : I kinda feel frustrated about the lack of significative communication GW gives us. I mean, the news section only show us new models and paint done by some artists, and 2 weeks before a release then whe have concrete info (and even then, so few). Also, I feel that as the times we live in, the companies like GW should pay more attention to its customers desires and make use of online survey like WotC does. To be honest, when WotC began to do that, I was deeply touched, even more when it announced that during the following year, it would conduct regular surveys to help design 5th edition DnD so it could satisfy all the players

2-The prices
it ain't that I find it's to much money for what they give, it's just two things :
1-As things are right now, they aren't worth those prices. Last day, I went to buy some clothes and hell was I suprised to see what I could get for so few, compared to what I could get with GW and eBay
2-As economy is right now, people won't (at least where I live) have as much money as they want, and because of that, they will have to spend it on things really important

3-Less Marines
Why : I know GW made it's buisiness with them, but thing is it kinda seems akward when all of the players in the room play Marines army cause they kinda receive all the attention and love of GW (most recent and OP codexes).

4-More affiliated games and media
I'd like to see GW more present in video games (Yeah, I know, Space Marine just came out ) and other media like movies or even animated. It's kinda incredible that a universe as rich in fluff and as badass as W40k isn't more present in these, and I kinda feel W40k should be more known outside the wargaming community.

5-Less Ward
Joking, nothing personnal mister Ward. I just want less OP in some codex. Thought now I realise it's kinda to late for that. The only solution : OP the other codexes and then never again let Mr. Ward work unsupervised.

All the Wargamer-rage of this forum shall be unleashed here, tonight.

1. Prices.
2. More focus on specialist games.
3. Less Codex Creep.
4. More balance.
5. More updates.

lol. Unleashe the Rightful and Vindicating Rage!!!

I don't think that they make it a point to make Space Marine 'dexes OP, its just since half of them ARE Space Marine 'dexes so chances are one of them will ALWAYS be more powerful than most.

1. IF 6th rumors are true, don't do it.
2. See above
3. All of the above
4. See #5
5. DON'T DO IT!

Prices
Moving the Story Along
Actually making some badass characters. That are not mary sues.(Gary Sues)
Also lowering prices like this. A terminator squad = a Tactical Squad in terms of price. Tactical = combat squad price. Combat squad =15$. All fine cast prices are lower under 20$ (Like they use to be)
No Battleforce will exceed 100$ But are cheaper in terms of buying them individually.
Vechiles will all be under 70$
Land Raider will cost 50$
Dreadnought is 35$
everything is significantly cheaper....

Asherian Command wrote:Prices
Moving the Story Along
Actually making some badass characters. That are not mary sues.(Gary Sues)
Also lowering prices like this. A terminator squad = a Tactical Squad in terms of price. Tactical = combat squad price. Combat squad =15$. All fine cast prices are lower under 20$ (Like they use to be)
No Battleforce will exceed 100$ But are cheaper in terms of buying them individually.
Vechiles will all be under 70$
Land Raider will cost 50$
Dreadnought is 35$
everything is significantly cheaper....

I must say this seems kinda reasonnable value-wise. What I mean is that even thought a hobby like w40k is really cool and great, it shouldn't eat up all of your money cause it then become more than a hobby...
Also, I feel the prices are keeping young players away. At my local Game Store, the only players are like me in the 20's (and even then, I'm the only one doing studies and so the only one that don't have enough money to be enough invested in the hobby). Plus, all the other customers of the Store are Magic players (darn). Plus, I have other friend who really like the w40k rules and fluff, but honestly don't want to spend for it's current cost. Seriously, I just made a 850 pts list, and the cost to assemble it with eBay is almost 200$ (also on the GW web). So seriously, shouldn't GW do something about that? I know they must have serious reasons to put their prices like this (Khorne crush them if they don't), but shouldn't they consider finding a way to lower their price their top priority. I mean, if Wal-Mart can do it, couldn't they do the half of it (cause I don't want cheap models if it makes them sh*tty). Seriously, they should stop their ''What's New Today'' crap and pull all their staff in one big room, and say : ''Okay, anyone having ideas to lower our prices? I warn you, nobody leave this room alive before we get a good buisness strategy. AND EVERY 5 MINUTES, I'LL SHOOT SOMEONE IN THE ANKLE!!! ¸
So enough with the joking, it's just that I can't believe that the company that makes W40k, a game I dreamt to play since I was a teenager, is such.... well... not as cool as I thought.
I even have two other hobby stores near mine, who litterally refuse to sell GW products, saying that it don't sell enough.

1. Let abaddon take over cadia... It'll add depth to both the CSM and cadians, as they can be the 'die hard loyalist grim dark hurrrrrr scarrry!" guys.
2. Redo the dark eldar line again. I don't like any of them, and prefer the old models.
3. Make a box of ten models 25$, a rhino 25$ and special characters 12$, flat.
4. Get rid of failcast and give me back my metal space mens
5. Put some more power fists in the chaos terminator box.

1. Prices prices prices. Given the bulk industry price of the plastic, and the labor per box and all that crap, cut the prices by at least a third if not a half.
2. Stop punishing and sueing and screwing over outsourced distributors, these guys are your friends, seriously they push your games, don't screw with them.
3. More communication between the company and the customer base. The rumour mill is the only thing keeping some people interested enough in your game to keep playing it. Don't squash it.
4. Quicker updates with Codexes/More quality control on Codexes. I know that you guys need time yadda yadda for this stuff, but when you publish something as broken as Codex: Space Wolves or Codex: Grey Knights or something as terribad as Codex: Tyranids or Codex: Orks it's fairly obvious that you need more play testing. So put that development time to good use and get some play-testing. Or if you're not going to do that, at least push them out a bit faster.
5. Stop attempting to screw over the custom bits market. Seriously, these guys only help you. They make people want to buy your game, and a lot of the bits actually require GW/Forgeworld models to work. So they're giving you more sales.
Runner Up: More rules integration with Forge World.

And now after all these posts : RAAAAAAWRRRR (Epic Thundercat growl).
No but seriously, what the hell is going on with GW. What really p*** me off the most is not their prices, but their total refusal to communicate. If they could just talk to us, inform us why their prices are so high (instead of us having to guess) and telling us if at least something is done to change them or not, then at least I would kinda feel like GW as a human side. Right now it's kinda facing a Giant, Cold and Capitalistic Machine.

Unfortunately they have no obligation, social, legal, moral or otherwise to be anything else.

TheMind wrote:Unfortunately they have no obligation, social, legal, moral or otherwise to be anything else.

if only there was a way to put stress on them like a massive boycott, but let's be realistic, never will all the players stop buying, not even for two days....

1. Tyranid models
2. Tyranid models
3. Tyranid models
4. Tyranid models
5. Tyranid models

1. Update all of the Xeno Armies, I'd like to not only play against SM
2. Plastic Sisters!
3.An actual Sisters Codex
4.Prices!
5.Plastic Warhound Titan!

Price
Phil Kelly writes all the codexes
Price
Phil Kelly writes all the codexes
Price

1: Pricing their products so that they equally take into consideration the customer as well as the shareholder.
2: Better communication between company and customer, such as asking for feedback on rules, inviting customers to write in to WD, like they used to do.
3: Bring back the ordering of individual bits: This is the one thing I hate about GW, how you used to be able to order for example, an individual Storm Shield for a conversion, now you have to either get them online elsewhere or buy a whole new box to get them. I honestly don't know why GW stopped doing this.
4: I seriously wouldn't care if they delayed the release of a new series of models by a few months if it meant we had all the models available on release day *cough*Tyranids*cough*
5: Better content in White Dwarf that isn't just "Look at our new products and why you should buy them!" More battle reports (not just for new models) reviews of tournaments, other things like that. It would be much better if it was about the game in general than just about GW's new products. You could do a review of Space Marine: The Game for example, or an article about the upcoming Adepticon event.

1. Price per point re-evaluation.
Although materials used and shipping is certainly an issue for an objects price, a large variety of GW's models give you a miserable amount of points per dollar spent on them. I understand that they can't really give the troops choices differences in that people would certainly think the expensive marines aren't worth it in such a system. If $40 buys you 10 marines or 20 guardsmen or 20+ orks, you'll see a lot more non-marine armies simply because it seems like it's less STUFF for your money, even if it's even points. that's not to say anything for the heavies, elites, and fast attack troops that can be nearly than 1 point per dollar (looking at you rhino). It explains a bit why so many competitive grey knights armies showed up. Because their terminators (with average upgrades) have a crazy high point per dollar margin, they are incredibly cheap in comparison to say, nids or orks or guard, to get into the hobby. On top of their overpowered-ness. Which the BA and SW fall into to a degree as well, compared to dark eldar. I don't think people would argue as much about price if they were always getting something that was worth it compared to any other choice.

2. An official GW forum.
If they have one, I can't find it, and they REALLY should. I know GW is overprotective of their IP and all but seriously, some people have simple questions, interesting ideas, and generally want to talk/learn about warhammer and it's just plain better to have it on their official site than on fan sites. No offense to Dakka, I love you guys, but honestly every game out there has a forum so people can get answers to questions they need answers to.

3. Units with Terrain
If GW wants to charge more for their relatively cheaper units (see point 1) than at least give us something we can make use of with them. Including terrain, even small pieces of it like hills, trees, or small defensive walls, will get more players into the terrain side of the game (and the purchases) and although not always needed for each game makes a customer feel at least a little more justified when they buy say, a squad of hormagaunts. They were already nice enough to include a ripper swarm with the termigaunts. Adding in terrain would at least soften the blow of choosing a unit that's the same price but you get less "stuff". (especially if the leak dex is real and has those rules for placing terrain for SP)

4. The Mini Rulebook
GW knows that the only reason their $50 dollar rulebook sells is because it's the only rulebook you can buy without spending twice as much on AoBR. True, they have all the delicious fluff in there that makes the setting so grim and dark but to my knowledge most gaming groups, be they entire gaming stores or just a pair of friends, usually only have 1 rulebook per 3 or 4 people. The last tournament group match I was in at my FLGS only had two books, one store book and the book of another player. We used them heavily for rules research but I'll admit only two were particularly needed. However, if you had, say, a $25 rulebook or even a $35 to match DnD's current price, you'd have a LOT more of those players willing to buy the book in order to look up the rules with ease. True, my DnD group don't all own all the books, but within a year of getting them into the game 4 out of 5 of us own the PHB. which is a lot more than my warhammer friends which remains at 1 out of 4.

4.5 If possible, to design the game for "new" players. Make a mini-dex box. The mini-dex, a small bottle of glue, 3 paints (red, blue, and skin I would guess), a brush, a piece of terrain such as a fortified wall, 2d6 and a scatter dice. Now this is worth $50 dollars and gives you enough to try out EVERYTHING the game has to offer other than the models itself. Plus, on the back you can list the "recommended starting purchases" Like a squad of Tac marines. This is ideal for new players who don't want to start the game with whatever the new AoBR set has inside AND I would dare say most of the older players would delight in picking this box up, as compared to having to shell out that same $50 for the rulebook alone.

5. Do not release a codex or WD entry for an army/unit that is unavailable.
Yeah, this is a SoB complaint but seriously, you handed my the keys to a car i'm just dying to drive, I've read the owners manual over and over, I got all the tools to keep it running. But I can't drive a car you won't let me buy.

1. Make a mobile-friendly version of their website. It's unbelievable that an international company like GW still hasn't done this.

2. Make more effective attempts at reaching the mass market. The Ultramarines movie was poorly written, unexcitingly paced and terribly marketed. I wouldn't be surprised if there are 40k players out there who don't know it exists.

3. Make White Dwarf more than a glorified, expensive piece of junk mail. There's SO MUCH they could do with that publication! Monthly army spotlights, conversion how-tos, fan art/fiction sections, experimental rules the customer base can give feedback on - the sky's the limit really.

4. Stop doing "leaks" and "rumours" - it's a poor marketing strategy often used by companies lacking funds/resources. You know what drives sales numbers? Billboards, pamphlets, press conferences, community involvement. Not viral leaks without official confirmation.

5. Be more fair with pricing? Please? And take this stupid trade embargo off us Aussies.

otakutaylor wrote:5. Do not release a codex or WD entry for an army/unit that is unavailable.
Yeah, this is a SoB complaint but seriously, you handed my the keys to a car i'm just dying to drive, I've read the owners manual over and over, I got all the tools to keep it running. But I can't drive a car you won't let me buy.

Pardon? What SoB entry has an unavailable model? Outside of certain possible equipment, I mean, such as a Seraphim with Inferno Pistols.

Pouncey wrote:

otakutaylor wrote:5. Do not release a codex or WD entry for an army/unit that is unavailable.
Yeah, this is a SoB complaint but seriously, you handed my the keys to a car i'm just dying to drive, I've read the owners manual over and over, I got all the tools to keep it running. But I can't drive a car you won't let me buy.

Pardon? What SoB entry has an unavailable model? Outside of certain possible equipment, I mean, such as a Seraphim with Inferno Pistols.

Well, I can't buy a single piece of sisters stuff in any of the gaming stores in my area.
But really, I mean there is no plastic sisters. It would cost about $75 for a troop choice of sisters, compared to every other armies $30-40.
I don't really want to buy one army for the price of two.

otakutaylor wrote:

Pouncey wrote:

otakutaylor wrote:5. Do not release a codex or WD entry for an army/unit that is unavailable.
Yeah, this is a SoB complaint but seriously, you handed my the keys to a car i'm just dying to drive, I've read the owners manual over and over, I got all the tools to keep it running. But I can't drive a car you won't let me buy.

Pardon? What SoB entry has an unavailable model? Outside of certain possible equipment, I mean, such as a Seraphim with Inferno Pistols.

Well, I can't buy a single piece of sisters stuff in any of the gaming stores in my area.
But really, I mean there is no plastic sisters. It would cost about $75 for a troop choice of sisters, compared to every other armies $30-40.
I don't really want to buy one army for the price of two.

The stores in your area don't let you place orders through them?

1. Rationalised and unified global pricing structure.
If Lego and many other companies can do it, so can GW.

2. Acceptance that they are not a hobby unto themselves, but part of a larger world-spanning miniature gaming hobby.
Start going to conventions and promoting your product outside of your crappy magazine and crappier website. Forge World and Black Library seem to understand this concept, so why not GW proper?

3. No more Ward.
The GK Codex was soul crushingly bad. Don't let that man feth up any more armies.

4. Stop treating your customers like a necessary evil.
Interact with them. Work with them. Embrace modern forms of communication. Accept that the Internet exists and that it is a powerful tool for promotion and advertising. Realise that 'word of mouth' and 'generating good will within your customer base' are easily obtainable things.

5. License all the specialist games to Fantasy Flight Games.
And allow them to be miniature based. Assign a month window for each specialist game that cycles every 6 months, so each specialist game gets a release (big or small) twice a year. And at the same time let someone make a turn-based top-down strategy game (ala X-Com) based on Necromunda.

For me pretty much everything H.B.M.C said, except maybe 3. He needs to be brought in line in some areas, in others he's not as bad as the internet would have you think.
My replacement 3 would be a consolidation of some of the codices into ones for their specific factions. Marines into an Adaptus Astartes one that covers all the loyalist legions with their quirks and allows for the standard, perhaps an improved version of the trait system from 4th's codex.

Pouncey wrote:

otakutaylor wrote:

Pouncey wrote:

otakutaylor wrote:5. Do not release a codex or WD entry for an army/unit that is unavailable.
Yeah, this is a SoB complaint but seriously, you handed my the keys to a car i'm just dying to drive, I've read the owners manual over and over, I got all the tools to keep it running. But I can't drive a car you won't let me buy.

Pardon? What SoB entry has an unavailable model? Outside of certain possible equipment, I mean, such as a Seraphim with Inferno Pistols.

Well, I can't buy a single piece of sisters stuff in any of the gaming stores in my area.
But really, I mean there is no plastic sisters. It would cost about $75 for a troop choice of sisters, compared to every other armies $30-40.
I don't really want to buy one army for the price of two.

The stores in your area don't let you place orders through them?

They've been like that for a while an a WD update wouldn't be worth a full relaunch of the line.

I also wish they were only $75 still.

There is one plastic SoB in the form of the Immolator. There also was a guide to convert the old DE warriors into them that worked somewhat well, doesn't work with the current. If we're to see plastic SoB it'd definitely be with a proper codex and not a gap filler advertisement like the current WD one.

1. Better Battleforce's. With like a HQ and 2 Troops choices. So, if you were a new player you could buy your codex and battleforce box and start playing small games straight away.

2. Bits. Before I started playing, I think you could order any individual bits, I would like this back.

3. Specialty Games. I want a Gorkamorka relaunch but just better support alround for Speciality Games.

4. Staff. I wish that when I went into the shop the staff had a more relaxed attitude. Im sure the staff get pushed for sales, and I might just be antisocial, but I feel like im getting stalked when I go into my local GW.

5. Codex Updates. I wish we had em more regular. Or like 2 at once or something. Codex creep sucks and I feel bad for Templar, DA, WH, Tau players.

1. Move the story along

2. Have Kelly right all the fluff, but have Ward write the rules. Kelly is capable of some pretty dark stuff (unlike Ward), and that should bring 40k back to grimdarkness. Ward despite his flaws as a writer, does seem to come up with some pretty strong rules and armies. Just look at the revitalized necron codex.

3. Better release schedule. Seriously, 8 years for a necron codex, and no nid 2nd wave, wtf GW? Granted, the wait did pay off (sort of...) but still.

4. Stop using kids as the primary demographic, and focus instead on adults (and veteran gamers likewise). I want 40k to be brutal, like it should be.

5. For the rulebooks to have more background and make-your-own table/terrain guides. Remember 4th ed BRB? Remember how it had instructions on making your own bunker or table? That was nice. Not so nice is the advertisement for a gaming table in the 5th ed BRB. That cross section of a bolter in 3rd ed was pretty nice too.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

H.B.M.C. wrote:

5. License all the specialist games to Fantasy Flight Games.
And allow them to be miniature based. Assign a month window for each specialist game that cycles every 6 months, so each specialist game gets a release (big or small) twice a year. And at the same time let someone make a turn-based top-down strategy game (ala X-Com) based on Necromunda.

x1000 this.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ulthanashville wrote:
3. Make White Dwarf more than a glorified, expensive piece of junk mail. There's SO MUCH they could do with that publication! Monthly army spotlights, conversion how-tos, fan art/fiction sections, experimental rules the customer base can give feedback on - the sky's the limit really.

Also this. Hell, if they did that I might actually be bothered in buying a copy.

1. Fire Phil Kelly

2. Fire Phil Kelly

3. Have someone with an actual brain rewrite Codex Space Wolves

4. Have someone with an actual appreciation of the hobby rewrite Codex Dark Eldar

5. Fire Phil Kelly

1. Quicker Codex updates - During 3rd edition all main armies were updated (essential due to the big change in the rules), 3 new ones introduced and some given a second codex.

2. Smaller Codicies - Remove half the fluff from the codex and make them rulebooks again. I'd rather pay half the price for the rules as thats all I'm interested in. Chuck the fluff in different books that GW can overcharge for.

3. Bitz - a sorely missed service.

4. Battleforce options - Online multi choice force because I really don't need any more Kroot or Snipers.

5. More plastic - I haven't an issue with finecast but most of it could be replaced with plastics removing the need for the price premium.

1.Price
2.More balance on codexes (My little brother has Grey knights, and from what I can tell.... hmmm)
3.A new army or two wouldn't go a miss...why not?
4.CSM need some updates model wise - Some are looking a little dated if you ask me *cough cough dreadnought (worst 40k kit, I only get the forge world ones) obliterators look a bit dated and are only on sale online-like most of the chaos gear)
5. More mega force boxes

@ otakutaylor, very good post and points.

Only thing I would add is to update older codexes on a regular basis via the website/pdfs so Codex creep is reduced and units are updated/amended for the better.

1.) Prices, obviously the primary issue
2.) Eliminate all these Space Marine codex's besides GK. Of the 16 army books 6 (over 1/3) are Space Marines. Would help reduce the number of Codex's.
3.) Enough of the secrecy bs. Communicate with your customer base and give notice for releases months in advance.
4.) Battleforces actually let you play an army from it.
5.) Regular updates for neglected armies (rules only) via white dwarf and online. This will not however substitute as a codex.
6.) Reform White Dwarf so that it's readable again.

We are all blindfolded victims, captives of a house made from our undying love and obsession for W40k, and while we are chasing rumours in the darkness, hitting ourselves on each other heads, GW watch from the upstair, smiling and laughing sadistically each time we think we just found the object of our desire, and then that we realise it's just... a pile of gak someone they there a while ago.



The only solution :



Burn down the House