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Stay classy douches...

I despise all religions (though not the religious), but if you're going to allow praying in the Senate then allow it from all faiths.
Those people are *incredibly* rude and presumably were thrown out.

I totally agree. The Senate shouldn't kick someone out of the chamber simply for expressing their religious beliefs.

Joey wrote:I despise all religions (though not the religious)

And here I thought you were a Rastafarian.

That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

If the government isn't allowed to make law respecting religion why on earth is the senate having prayers at all? I know why we do it cause we've been doing it for 200+ years, but I mean come on. Lets stop saying and start doing government. I'm not allowed to have a Christmas tree at school but you guys are praying?

Johnny-Crass wrote:That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

As opposed to atheists who make blanket statements like that?
OP who were the people who were heckling? I assume not actual senators.

This thread is so full of win.

Joey wrote:

Johnny-Crass wrote:That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

As opposed to atheists who make blanket statements like that?
OP who were the people who were heckling? I assume not actual senators.

Why does your signature for "codex bears" have a link to a picture of a badger?

The natural prey of the mighty BADGER DOG!

What's the context on this?

Nevermind, found it.

I want to rent a class, get some like minded friends to make a video where pray is allowed in class.
But there are so many faiths in the class that it takes up the whole class which eventually ends between a bloodbath between a khorne follower and a emporor follower.

Joey wrote:

Johnny-Crass wrote:That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

As opposed to atheists who make blanket statements like that?
OP who were the people who were heckling? I assume not actual senators.

As opposed to folks assuming those who make blanket statement about antireligion are atheists? I am in no way a atheist as in my mind they are just playing the same game every other religion plays except they play it with "We are too cool to be in any of your clubs as clubs suck, hey this is something we all agree on maybe we should make a club about it".

My point is this, I have never had a sensible person walk up to me and tell me the way I dress and act will cause me to be tortured for all eternity. But guess how many bible thumpers have told me that.. Enough that it really gets old and my nations sickly hatred of those of non-christian faith is truly appalling. I do not have any doubts that those are indeed senators heckling that man.


Also do you know what a bear looks like?

LordofHats wrote:If the government isn't allowed to make law respecting religion why on earth is the senate having prayers at all? I know why we do it cause we've been doing it for 200+ years, but I mean come on. Lets stop saying and start doing government. I'm not allowed to have a Christmas tree at school but you guys are praying?

Thel "Logic" was that adults arent as influenced as kids.

donkey-caves. They're so fethed up that they won't even let other people practice their own religions in the same building. I'm an atheist and I've participated in prayers in such out of respect, but these guys are such douches that they can't even listen to him. Its a goddamn shame.

Johnny-Crass wrote:

Joey wrote:

Johnny-Crass wrote:That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

As opposed to atheists who make blanket statements like that?
OP who were the people who were heckling? I assume not actual senators.

As opposed to folks assuming those who make blanket statement about antireligion are atheists? I am in no way a atheist as in my mind they are just playing the same game every other religion plays except they play it with "We are too cool to be in any of your clubs as clubs suck, hey this is something we all agree on maybe we should make a club about it".

Actually it's more of "I don't see how religion could work for me, but I can see how it works for others so let them be". At least that's how I go about my atheism. For some it gives them hope and that's a good thing.

Ah see out where I am the atheists are atheist to the point of seeming militant and it gets old fast.

Anyone fanatical to a point like that would unless you were equally as enthusiastic about whatever it is they were fanatical about.

hotsauceman1 wrote:
Thel "Logic" was that adults arent as influenced as kids.

College kids aren't easy to influence. Hell. Half of Penn state is still convinced that no one was molested! EDIT: Or they just don't care as long as they can win at football.

biccat wrote:I totally agree. The Senate shouldn't kick someone out of the chamber simply for expressing their religious beliefs.

I believe he was removed for disrupting proceedings.

One can be religious, and disruptive. Generally this is referred to as "being a douche".

biccat wrote:I totally agree. The Senate shouldn't kick someone out of the chamber simply for expressing their religious beliefs.

The clergyman didn't get thrown out. The imbeciles interrupting Congress were. The problem isn't that someone expressed their religious beliefs, it's the fact that they interrupted the person with the floor to shout insults.

I'd prefer Congress didn't have a prayer at all, but prayer in Congress doesn't really have much to do with the first amendment.

RustyKnight wrote:The clergyman didn't get thrown out. The imbeciles interrupting Congress were. The problem isn't that someone expressed their religious beliefs, it's the fact that they interrupted the person with the floor to shout insults.

I didn't hear anyone shouting insults, are you sure you're referring to the right video?

The title of this thread clearly states that "Congress shall make no law..." That isn't a limitation on the activities of private citizens, it's a limitation on the government. The private citizens (the "imbeciles") were exercising their right to freely exercise their religion, and were thrown out of the Senate chamber for it.

Sounds like the Senate violated their Free Exercise right.

edit: What the hell?
updated 7/12/2007
(embiggened for seriousness)

Johnny-Crass wrote:That is why religion is disgusting as it creates biggots of its followers

Please stop making my side look bad.

Too late.

Johnny-Crass wrote:As opposed to folks assuming those who make blanket statement about antireligion are atheists? I am in no way a atheist as in my mind they are just playing the same game every other religion plays except they play it with "We are too cool to be in any of your clubs as clubs suck, hey this is something we all agree on maybe we should make a club about it".

An atheist is a person who looked at what is around him, and decided it was more likely than not that it was not a deliberate act of creation. There's no clubs, no too for school anything, that's all things you made up in your head.

My point is this, I have never had a sensible person walk up to me and tell me the way I dress and act will cause me to be tortured for all eternity. But guess how many bible thumpers have told me that.. Enough that it really gets old and my nations sickly hatred of those of non-christian faith is truly appalling. I do not have any doubts that those are indeed senators heckling that man.

So your point is that one time this religious person acted towards you in a way you found objectionable, so you decided to assume that behaviour was common among all religious people. You know taking an individual experience and expanding it across the whole of the group is pretty much what bigotry is, right?

biccat wrote: I didn't hear anyone shouting insults, are you sure you're referring to the right video?

As soon as the video starts, you can clearly hear a man call the clergyman a "wicked" and an "abomination". They may be quotes, but they're also insults. Similar to how quoting something published by the Klan at a black person would be an insult. This initial outburst is followed at least one other male and a female.

biccat wrote:The title of this thread clearly states that "Congress shall make no law..." That isn't a limitation on the activities of private citizens, it's a limitation on the government. The private citizens (the "imbeciles") were exercising their right to freely exercise their religion, and were thrown out of the Senate chamber for it.

I agree that the thread's title is off, but individual's don't have the right to interrupt Congress. Kinda like how they wouldn't be allowed to protest inside the chamber.

RustyKnight wrote:I'd prefer Congress didn't have a prayer at all, but prayer in Congress doesn't really have much to do with the first amendment.

I don't know, I think it's reasonable for people to begin their working day with a prayer, particularly when the job they're undertaking has some level of public trust involved. As long as that prayer is voluntary, I don't see a problem.

I'd prefer it was done in private, but that's just for personal reasons - if people really feel the need to do these things in public then let them.

Oh, I don't have a problem with individual congressmen praying prior to the opening of Congress, I just don't like the idea of the Congress selecting a single prayer for the whole chamber. It's (probably) a Christian prayer the overwhelming majority of the time, and I think it presents a bad image about how our government operates (just look at what happened when they tried to have a Hindu prayer).

sebster wrote:

RustyKnight wrote:I'd prefer Congress didn't have a prayer at all, but prayer in Congress doesn't really have much to do with the first amendment.

I don't know, I think it's reasonable for people to begin their working day with a prayer, particularly when the job they're undertaking has some level of public trust involved. As long as that prayer is voluntary, I don't see a problem.

I'd prefer it was done in private, but that's just for personal reasons - if people really feel the need to do these things in public then let them.

I can understand tolerating those who do public prayer. What i cant is that the ones who do are typically those who wouldnt let someone of another religion do it themselves.

RustyKnight wrote:Oh, I don't have a problem with individual congressmen praying prior to the opening of Congress, I just don't like the idea of the Congress selecting a single prayer for the whole chamber. It's (probably) a Christian prayer the overwhelming majority of the time, and I think it presents a bad image about how our government operates (just look at what happened when they tried to have a Hindu prayer).

Fair point, I agree.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jollydevil wrote:I can understand tolerating those who do public prayer. What i cant is that the ones who do are typically those who wouldnt let someone of another religion do it themselves.

Yeah. Even worse are the people who attempt to make that prayer a requirement, and who then pretend their inability to force that prayer on others is oppression.