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I figured this would have been discussed, but couldn't find a thread...
In the old Necron codex, a Monolith deepstrike wasn't taking a big chance. If there were units in the way, they moved out of the way. I was just looking at the rules and I didn't see anything RAW that says the new Monolith won't mishap if it's within 1" of any enemy unit or on top of one of your own units. That means for a guaranteed deepstrike success, I need a 30" diameter circle that is clear of all impassible terrain, enemy and friendly units. That comes from, pick a point then 12" scatter + roughly 3" radius of a monolith. That's 20% of the table surface. In high point games I could see it being very dangerous to put a monolith in reserve, since they are required to deepstrike from reserves. You might just have to stick them out in the open to be shot up by your opponents first round long range fire, which at high points they'll have plenty of. Not a lot of terrain to hide monoliths behind. And in dawn of war...you are required to deepstrike the monolith.

Could the monolith declare "tank shock" from deepstrike? The enemy non-vehicle unit would have to at least move out of the way and may break and run. To me that seems reasonable but I'm not sure it is RAW. Hopefully the enemy unit doesn't have a good death or glory candidate. Hmmm, if a death or glory results in an immobilized monolith, will it just be left hovering 1" above the enemy squad?

Probably unreasonable would be declaring ramming from deepstrike. Unless the enemy vehicle is destroyed, the monolith is going to be sitting on top of an intact enemy vehicle. And then there would be an argument over how many inches of movement are involved in the strength calculation.

AFAIK, you cannot ram or tank shock from Deepstrike.

The monolith doesn't have any of it's old protections. It now has to deep strike with the same risks asy everything else. I guess I could answer with does it say somewhere that you can tank shock or ram out of a deep strike? But I think we all know the answer.

It's not much different that deepstriking a 10 man termi unit... or a large unit of gargoyles, or any other unit with a large footprint.

People deep strike those all the time.
Yes, you can mishap.

Even if you could ram out of a deepstrike(which you cannot); the only thing that you could ever hope to hurt is AV 11 or 10; and good luck determining the Arc half the time.

Also Ramming is based on moving into another model; deploying onto them is not moving into them.

Also, scattering your monolith to within 1", but not actually contacting the enemy model is still always going to be a mishap and canot be a ram(no contact is made)

Finally you would have to declare a deep-striking ram and then hope you scatter into the model(as opposed to away from it; which has a slightly higher chance of happening).

TL;DR summary: No you can never declare a Ram while deep-striking

its a 2d6 distribution. 10, 11 and 12 are very unlikely.
most of the scatter will be 8 or less which means you need a 20" circle to be sure.

yes there is now some risk, this is good, the stupid surviveability they use to have was no good.

Ok, so everyone seems to agree that my RAW interpretations were indeed correct. I really wouldn't mind if I wasn't required to deepstrike the monolith from reserves. It would be my tactical gamble. Now it's a strategic meta game problem. Might the game be played on a table with a fair scattering of impassible terrain and we might roll dawn of war? Those other large units are not required to deepstrike from reserves (well I'm assuming gargoyles aren't). And SM players can always get some locator beacons to provide some guarantees.

you are only required to deep-strike if you are holding the monolith in reserves; if you deploy it normally you do not have to worry.

I believe the only time you would be forced to hold the monolith in reserves is in a DoW scenario; even then the scenario rules do not force the monolith into reserves; the "heavy" rule does; as I recall the monolith is more than 6" on a side, therefore would be lost first turn if you do not hold it in reserves to deep-strike in(as it cannot fully enter the table).

Kommissar Kel wrote:you are only required to deep-strike if you are holding the monolith in reserves; if you deploy it normally you do not have to worry.

I believe the only time you would be forced to hold the monolith in reserves is in a DoW scenario; even then the scenario rules do not force the monolith into reserves; the "heavy" rule does; as I recall the monolith is more than 6" on a side, therefore would be lost first turn if you do not hold it in reserves to deep-strike in(as it cannot fully enter the table).

you deploy terrain before you know what scenario you are playing so make sure there is a hole somewhere on the board.

Ruins are not impassable terrain. Just remove as much impassable terrain from the board as possible and your deep striking should be ok. Be 13" from the enemy is all you need to worry about.

I think you still mishap if you land in difficult terrain, don't you?

Madmax1 wrote:I think you still mishap if you land in difficult terrain, don't you?

No, impassible terrain causes a mishap. difficult terrain only forces the DSing unit to take Dangerous Terrain tests.

I think I've been playing that wrong this whole time. I mean, I don't DS often, but still. Thanks for the clarification.

The good thing is not its more of a surprise when you deepstrike your monolith into that difficult terrain where your opponent was thinking he was safe. Just don't roll a 1.

Kommissar Kel wrote:I believe the only time you would be forced to hold the monolith in reserves is in a DoW scenario; even then the scenario rules do not force the monolith into reserves; the "heavy" rule does; as I recall the monolith is more than 6" on a side, therefore would be lost first turn if you do not hold it in reserves to deep-strike in(as it cannot fully enter the table).

Reread the rules on DOW. First turn units may enter from the table edge unless they are in resereve. E.g. the first turn units aren't in reserve. So a monolith may float on safely. I thought a GW FAQ stipulated that large vehicles aren't required to be fully on the table else landraiders would be destroyed by DOW deployment or reserve arrival.

PrivatePanic wrote:

Kommissar Kel wrote:I believe the only time you would be forced to hold the monolith in reserves is in a DoW scenario; even then the scenario rules do not force the monolith into reserves; the "heavy" rule does; as I recall the monolith is more than 6" on a side, therefore would be lost first turn if you do not hold it in reserves to deep-strike in(as it cannot fully enter the table).

Reread the rules on DOW. First turn units may enter from the table edge unless they are in resereve. E.g. the first turn units aren't in reserve. So a monolith may float on safely. I thought a GW FAQ stipulated that large vehicles aren't required to be fully on the table else landraiders would be destroyed by DOW deployment or reserve arrival.

Is 6" enough to clear the monolith of the table edge?

PrivatePanic wrote:I thought a GW FAQ stipulated that large vehicles aren't required to be fully on the table else landraiders would be destroyed by DOW deployment or reserve arrival.

There is no FAQ that states that - Land Raiders have to move cruising speed to make it on the table. Monoliths can't move faster than combat speed so they must deep strike if they don't start on the table.

I think the math here is a little off. The Monolith is 6" x 6", so add 12" on either side and another 1" on top of that, and you get a circle with a diameter of 32" that must be clear of impassible terrain and enemy units if you want to be 100% safe from deep strike mishaps.

@azazel: Yes, but deep striking is about taking chances, and we all know that almost 75% of the time you will scatter <= 8".

The monolith is under 6" across, just. So it *could* float on safely

DeathReaper wrote:

Madmax1 wrote:I think you still mishap if you land in difficult terrain, don't you?

No, impassible terrain causes a mishap. difficult terrain only forces the DSing unit to take Dangerous Terrain tests.

We play it that you can land on impassable terrain with a deepstriking skimmer as long as you can actually place the model where it landed since you can do this during any other movement/deployment, and feel that it overides the list of mishap locations. You just have to take the DT test.

PrivatePanic wrote: I thought a GW FAQ stipulated that large vehicles aren't required to be fully on the table else landraiders would be destroyed by DOW deployment or reserve arrival.

Quite the opposite:

Q: What happens when a unit arrives from reserves but
is unable to completely move onto the board? (p94)
A: The unit is destroyed and removed from play.

If the model cannot completely make it on to the table it is destroyed; this is why I never put my Stormsword in reserves(superheavies only move 6").

Landraiders can move 12", land raiders can make it onto the board no problem.

Nos says the monolith is under 6" on a side, so even there you are not required to put them in reserves, just move it onto the table first turn.

rigeld2 wrote:There is no FAQ that states that - Land Raiders have to move cruising speed to make it on the table. Monoliths can't move faster than combat speed so they must deep strike if they don't start on the table.

Is the Land Raider more than 6" wide? If not, couldn't it just move on sideways if it really wanted to move combat speed?

depends on whether or not you believe vehicle can move sideways.

There are 2 camps in this:

The first states that the rules indicate that forward and backward movement are the only ones available(they do indicate this but are not very explicit)

The second states that since the movement rules are not explicit on this, and movement is allowed; you can freely move sideways.

at any rate you can start with the land raider off table and sideways, pivot onto the table; then pivot again after a 6" move, ending on table after combat speed and capable of firing the 1 sponson plus pintle MM and/or Storm bolter.