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So my good friend, who goes on this forum by Orkboy 232, has both convinced me to start playing Flames of War and to get a forum account on dakka, so here I am. We're doing late war, and he, knwoing my love for the tiger tank, and my cheap and lazy nature of not liking to buy/paint a lot of models, suggested I run a tiger list. This idea appealed to me immediately, and I bought the tigers marsch box. Inside, I found the handbook had what appears to be a relatively balanced and attractive force. Seeing as we're starting at 1000 points and escalating, I made my small list off the Panzerkompanie from the "Earth and Steel" book, and plan on carrying units over between lists (panzer grenadiers, panzer ivs, nebelwerfers). In any case, I'm gonna use this thread as a sort of "blog" to post pictures of my progress, modify my lists, ect, so I hopefully have the motivation to finish and paint everything in the lists (unlike my poor 40k and whfb armies


Lists are as follows, middle lists will be a hybrid of the two, adding or subtracting things as we go. The gepanzerte will proxy as scouts in the 2nd list as to avoid buying too many models, and to add some fluff to the army and to be visually different.

1000 Point Panzerkompanie

Company HQ
-Panzerkompanie HQ - 2 Panzer IV H, Sd Kfz 9 Recovery Vehicle 195 points

Combat Platoons
-Panzer Platoon - 3 Panzer IV H 285 points
-Panzer Platoon - 3 Panzer IV H 285 points

Corps and Divisional Support
-Rocket Launcher Battery - 2 15cm NW41 Launchers 75 points
-Gepanzerte Panzergrenadier Platoon - 2 Panzergrenadier Squads 155 points

Total: 995 points


2000 Point 101 SS Schwere Panzerabteiulung

Company HQ
-Schwere SS-Panzerkompanie HQ - 1 Tiger 1 E, 250 points

Combat Platoons
-Schwere SS-Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 480 points
-Schwere SS-Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 480 points

Weapons Platoons
-SS-Anti-Aircraft Gun Platoon - 2 Sd Kfz 7/1 (Quad 2cm) 100 points
-Armored SS-Scout Platoon - 4 Scout Squads 275 points

Support Platoons
-Panzer Platoon - 3 Panzer IV H 285 points
-Rocket Launcher Battery - 1 Launcher Section 130 points

Total: 2000 points

Ideas on the lists? Again I don't want to bo out of my way to buy redundant models I won't use between both, so the nebels, panzers, and grenadiers carry over. I'm totally alright buying the extra panzer ivs, as PSC makes great models for cheap

And here are the images so far of me unboxing and cleaning the models. Apologies for the quality, as they were taken with my cell phone. Expect to build one or more before I go to work this evening, will upload pictures then or when I get back.

Both solid lists. I don't think the schwere list needs the Panzer IVs but I understand why you put them in.

Welcome to FOW and to Dakka.

George Spiggott wrote:Both solid lists. I don't think the schwere list needs the Panzer IVs but I understand why you put them in.

What would you think is ideal? I'm new to this so any help is much appreciated.

mwnciboo wrote:Welcome to FOW and to Dakka.

Thankyou, long time lurker here

Quick edit: Picture of the parts drying after being scrubbed/soaked. A lot more parts than I thought there were in the box, assembling these beasts may prove a daunting learning experience.

Schwere wrote:What would you think is ideal? I'm new to this so any help is much appreciated.

You have an even number of platoons, recon, FlaK and cheap artillery which is all good. I just don't think the Panzer IVs add anything to the list. You could probably do with an infantry Platoon (as big as possible) that can dig in on an objective and your FlaK could do with some armour to stop it being pinned.

Agree. A large Inf. Pl would be helpful.

Something to think about for the future. For now, the panzers will stay as they're in both armies, but if I get some extra cash I may just add some infantry.

Now, for infantry this list can take pioneers, armored or motorized scouts, and gepanzerte grenadiers. Which would be the most effective replacement for the panzer 4s?

Pioneers. They are, IMO, the most effective infantry formation available to the germans. However, they can be very points costly. I don't have my copy of ES handy, so cannot compare points on just gepanzerte panzergrenadier pl.

If you're keeping the Armoured Scouts (no reason not to) then Gepanzert Pioneers or Grenadiers would be the best choices.

Remember in V3 that armoured troops can call up their Hanomags mid game if they're missing out on the action.

If I drop the panzers (285), then the gepanzerte, for 2 squads + hq, is already 240 points.

The pioneers on the other hand, are 85 for hq+1, 130 for hq+2, and hq+3 for 175.

So, I could either take the 2 squads of gepanzerte for 240 with the larger squads and halftracks, or take two pioneer platoons of 2 squads and upgrade other units with the remaining points (say, SMG and panzerfaust for scout command team).

Not sure which would be better.

Which list are you using? Three squads of Lehr Armoured Panzergrenadiers (Support for the SS schwere SS panzerkompanie in Earth & Steel) are 280 points.

The 101 Schwere SS-Panzerabteilung list from the Tigers Marsch handbook.

Ah, I thought you were using E&S.

List is fairly similar, biggest difference being the E&S has a few different support options, and that all the stuff in this list is either mechanized or armor, the nebels can even take halftracks for free which may be useful.

I see. I recommend getting the updated list in Earth and Steel. I've updated your list for Earth and Steel below:

2000 Point Schwere SS Panzerkompanie

Company HQ
-Schwere SS-Panzerkompanie HQ - 1 Tiger 1 E, 250 points

Combat Platoons
-Schwere SS-Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 480 points
-Schwere SS-Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 480 points

Weapons Platoons
-SS-Anti-Aircraft Gun Platoon - 2 Sd Kfz 7/1 (Quad 2cm) 100 points (No armoured option available!)
-Armored SS-Scout Platoon - 4 Scout Squads 250 points

Support Platoons
-Panzergrenadier Lehr Platoon - 3 Panzergrenadier Squads 280 points (Confident Veteran - Heer Allies - 6x 4 man teams + 3x 2 man panzerfaust teams)
-Rocket Launcher Battery - 1 Launcher Section 125 points (Confident Veteran - Heer Allies - no transports)

If my maths is on this comes out 35 points cheaper. You can probably buy a Panzerfaust for you SS Scouts and Panzergrenadiers and a Bergepanther recovery vehicle with the spare points.

Ah, seems the only advantage I get from using this book then is that all my troops are fearless veterans. I wouldn't mind dropping the morale on the support platoon for the extra manpower and points.

I'll go with that list then for my finalized one.

I see you went with the WWII wargaming equivalent of Space Marines It's entirely understandable - a well painted unit of Tigers looks great on the table - but there are a lot of parallels between Tigers and power armour.

You do have quite a big assembly job ahead of you. Those hybrid metal/resin kits were a major reason why I was able to resist FoW. However, the PSC plastic kits have made that much harder. They don't do a Tiger yet, and it doesn't look as though they're attempting to replicate Zimmerit, so their late war Panzers won't be as accurate as Battlefront's, but having built a PSC Panzer IV and a Sherman, they're a joy to assemble. Post more photos as you get the Tigers together.

Ah I shall, tigers at home having a 2nd bath since they had a lot of release agent still on that refused a scrubbing. Will build one after work I hope.

There is the non SS list in E&S as well. I am not sure, besides points, what the differences are. I will check.

combat engineer wrote:There is the non SS list in E&S as well. I am not sure, besides points, what the differences are. I will check.

SS I believe are fearless veterans, while heer are confident veterans.

Here is the 503. Schwere army list from E&S. They are confident veterans

Company HQ
-Schwere Panzerkompanie HQ - 1 Tiger 1 E, 225 points

Combat Platoons
-Schwere Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 430 points
-Schwere Panzer Platoon - 2 Tiger 1 E 430 points

Weapons Platoons
-Schwere Panzer Anti-Aircraft Gun Platoon - 2 Sd Kfz 7/1 (Quad 2cm) 155 points (With armour upgrade.)
-Schwere Panzer Armored Scout Platoon - 4 Scout Squads 210 points

Support Platoons
-Gepanzerte Panzergrenadier Platoon - 3 Panzergrenadier Squads 225 points (Confident Veteran - 21. Panzer Div. - Command Panzerfaust/ SMG team and upgrade Command half-track with 3.7cm PaK36. (1 x Pl HQ and 3 x MG squads mounted in U304(f) half-tracks.)
-Rocket Launcher Battery (3 x 21cm NW42 Launchers.)- 1 Launcher Section 125 points (Confident Veteran - Heer Allies - No transports.)

If I did my math right, that gives you about 200pts to play with. Do the calculations out yourself, but that could give you Schwere Panzer Pioneer Pl (HQ section and 2 x Pioneer squads.). Great for supporting your Tigers flanks on the advance, or digging in on an objective and staying frosty.

Just some more food for thought. Both list are excellent choices. My close friend just built a 503. list using E&S. Mind, we capped at 1750pts, so you have everything he cannot afford in points, lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yeah, I know there rating are different. However, not by much. I would go the CV route just to save points for other pls.

So, dried my tigers again, and they came out white. Anyone know why? They have like a white coat over them, and even if I rinse them they dry white again. I'm hoping the resin hasnt't been damaged in some way.

With the last posted list, wouldn't you be able to swap the gepanzerte out for schwere panzerpioneers? I posted a list awhile back that was almost identical, save for it having the pioneer's instead of the grenadiers, and had 3 armored aa units instead of 2

@Orkboy - Actually, that should be 3 x SP AAA. I hit the wrong number key. Running a 2000pt lists gives him the option of going with both.

@ Schwere - they same thing happened to my King Tigers. I had no issue with any resin degradation.

@combat, do you know why? Can I paint them? Also it looks very clearly like some of the zimmerit is worn off almost.

I primed mine after letting them fully dry. I had no issues wih loss of detail. Same with my Panthers. They are coming along very nicely.

What did you use to clean it? I am assuming water and dish detergent?

combat engineer wrote:I primed mine after letting them fully dry. I had no issues wih loss of detail. Same with my Panthers. They are coming along very nicely.

What did you use to clean it? I am assuming water and dish detergent?

Indeed, scrubbed with a toothbrush as well to get rid of the mold agent in the small cracks.

No idea as to why the zimmerit would be coming off. Is it still falling off?

Mat

I think he means that the Zimmerit is modelled with battle damage.

The way he described it to me (through steam chat anyways) was that some of the tigers zimmerit had 'deep' markings on it, while others had very shallow markings, as though the washing/brushing combination had worn them down almost to the point of non-existence.