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Here's my plan: I swapped out almost all my Leman Russ tanks for some GK stuff I needed and now I need new IG Heavy Support. I'm thinking of getting artillery now.

Here's the setting: Normally playing 2 vs. 2 games at my FLGS, armies are almost always at 1,500pts. on a 6'x4' table.

Questions: What artillery would be good for these kind of games? And what about for 1 vs. 1 games?

I'm considering getting a Manticore and some Medusas or Colossus', but I'd like my fellow dakkaites opinions first.

Manticore is the all rounder of the artillery. Can stop both hordes and (if you get the center) tanks pretty well

If you're playing 3000pts on a 6'x4' table, most artillery simple is too long ranged to be all that effective. That's a crowded table.

I'd stick with the manticore at that point.

It depends entirely on what the rest of your list looks like. Each artillery piece has its role, so you should take whatever pieces that fill the role you need.

I think the Manticore is the all around most useful, either str 10 ap2 large blast, OR str 10 ap 1 blast, either way... devastating. However it is not capable of indirect fire

I think that the Griffon is the second most useful, essentially a pie plate krak grenade launcher at only 75 pts. Not great but in a 2k battle imagine 3 in a battery firing indirectly for only 225 points it just sounds like pure mayhem. only a 12" limitation which is not bad since you will have terrain or units shielding it.

If I were a rich lad I would own 3 of each.

~Lion~

The manticore is a great all around artillery piece, but IMO the unit suffers from diminishing returns. The price tag is heavy, but it's rather easy to protect 1 manticore. Protecting 3 manticores is far more difficult, especially after the 480 point price tag eats away at the budget left over to protect the manticore. The 2nd and 3rd manticore are far more difficult to protect than the 1st, and they are a very vulnerable unit for their price tag.

Personally I only run 2 heavy support at 2k and under: 1 manticore and 1 Hydra.

TheLionOfTheForest wrote:I think the Manticore is the all around most useful, either str 10 ap2 large blast, OR str 10 ap 1 blast, either way... devastating. However it is not capable of indirect fire

I think that the Griffon is the second most useful, essentially a pie plate krak grenade launcher at only 75 pts. Not great but in a 2k battle imagine 3 in a battery firing indirectly for only 225 points it just sounds like pure mayhem. only a 12" limitation which is not bad since you will have terrain or units shielding it.

If I were a rich lad I would own 3 of each.

~Lion~

You're thinking about the medusa, not the manticore

kenshin620 wrote:

TheLionOfTheForest wrote:I think the Manticore is the all around most useful, either str 10 ap2 large blast, OR str 10 ap 1 blast, either way... devastating. However it is not capable of indirect fire

I think that the Griffon is the second most useful, essentially a pie plate krak grenade launcher at only 75 pts. Not great but in a 2k battle imagine 3 in a battery firing indirectly for only 225 points it just sounds like pure mayhem. only a 12" limitation which is not bad since you will have terrain or units shielding it.

If I were a rich lad I would own 3 of each.

~Lion~

You're thinking about the medusa, not the manticore

You are correct sir!

Remember, if you take Bastion Breacher for Medusa's they use them and only them, they can't use the normal shell at all.

Bastion Breacher Shell wrote:A Medusa armed with bastion-breacher shells always fires using the following profile.

So be aware that you'll either get the large blast str 10 ap 2 OR the small blast str 10 ap 1 but not both. I wish it was both, it would make it the bestest artillery piece ever.

Don't forget the usefulness of the Basilisk! The indirect S9 AP 3 fire is brutal to meq.

What models do you have in terms of IG artillary ? What are you willing to spend ?

These are limiting factors

Otherwise going with 9 medusas would be fun to see

I also have to throw in my vote for the Manticore. That way if you do it right you can also use the Death Strike / Vortex missile launcher in "For Fun" games.


very fun...

I personally use the griffon for my anti-horde, the rerolling to hit and wounding on 2's puts squads down. plus you get the pinning check at -1. I use the hydras for light mech, the ignoring fast cover saves is great. storm ravens cry a little. I take those 2 first, then kick in the manticore. The manticore is just all round solid, but i take the anti-mech elsewhere in the list (vens, meltas ect...) and the griffon does anti horde better. If you take griffon/hydra i would reccomend squadrons.

Don't forget the usefulness of the Basilisk! The indirect S9 AP 3 fire is brutal to meq.

I am going to have to vote for the Basilisk as well, as for all roundedness they can handle anything except Terminators.

Thanks for all the suggestions and help.

What I'm thinking about doing is I'll pick up 3 Medusas and a Manticore for now. Just so I have a start with a 1,500pts. list. Besides, Medusas + bastion-breachers vs. the mechanized armies I usually play = fun times

If my FLGS starts picking up more on Apoc games, I'll grab X number of Basilisks and a couple more Manticores. Only reasons I'm not now is I'm tight on cash for a few weeks and Basilisks can't shoot within 36" so that wouldn't be great for battles on the usual 6'x4' table IMO.

Basilisks can't shoot within 36" so that wouldn't be great for battles on the usual 6'x4' table IMO.

Not true, they just can't shoot INDIRECT within 36". Direct is fair game and with TLOS its generally not an issue that they cant see at least part of something juicy. Basilisks are staples of my guard army, and they never let me down. It never get old raining pie plates on the unsuspecting troop choice left in their deployment zone that they thought was so safely hidden behind that building.

Volkov wrote:

Basilisks can't shoot within 36" so that wouldn't be great for battles on the usual 6'x4' table IMO.

Not true, they just can't shoot INDIRECT within 36". Direct is fair game and with TLOS its generally not an issue that they cant see at least part of something juicy. Basilisks are staples of my guard army, and they never let me down. It never get old raining pie plates on the unsuspecting troop choice left in their deployment zone that they thought was so safely hidden behind that building.

This is me at the moment:

skronk wrote:I personally use the griffon for my anti-horde, the rerolling to hit and wounding on 2's puts squads down.

Where does it say rerolling the To Hit and To Wound. Im rpetty sure its just a re roll on the scatter dice.

ZachFTWx wrote:

skronk wrote:I personally use the griffon for my anti-horde, the rerolling to hit and wounding on 2's puts squads down.

Where does it say rerolling the To Hit and To Wound. Im rpetty sure its just a re roll on the scatter dice.

He only mentioned rerolling to hit (technically I guess rerolling to scatter is pretty much the same as rerlloing to hit)

Wounding wise he mentions wounding on 2's

kenshin620 wrote:

ZachFTWx wrote:

skronk wrote:I personally use the griffon for my anti-horde, the rerolling to hit and wounding on 2's puts squads down.

Where does it say rerolling the To Hit and To Wound. Im rpetty sure its just a re roll on the scatter dice.

He only mentioned rerolling to hit (technically I guess rerolling to scatter is pretty much the same as rerlloing to hit)

Wounding wise he mentions wounding on 2's

Wait, I read that wrong. My bad

InquisitorRoeth wrote: Basilisks can't shoot within 36" so that wouldn't be great for battles on the usual 6'x4' table IMO.

Yeah, I thought the same thing as well when I was new to IG. I think they should clarify that section about indirect and direct fire a bit better IMO.

Lord Solar Awesome wrote:

InquisitorRoeth wrote: Basilisks can't shoot within 36" so that wouldn't be great for battles on the usual 6'x4' table IMO.

Yeah, I thought the same thing as well when I was new to IG. I think they should clarify that section about indirect and direct fire a bit better IMO.

I can't make heads or tails of this

They could last edition, and that's why I bought 4, but that's hardly a good arguement.

If you read in the codex under the profile of the gun on page 53, it states the Basilisk's range is 36"-240". There is no idication of firing directly or indirectly. But in the fluff description of the gun, it says that a basilisk can be used "as a direct fire gun, engaging targets at short range with devestating results". Which leads me to believe they can. I'll be emailing GW about this one.

Ignatius wrote:If you read in the codex under the profile of the gun on page 53, it states the Basilisk's range is 36"-240". There is no idication of firing directly or indirectly. But in the fluff description of the gun, it says that a basilisk can be used "as a direct fire gun, engaging targets at short range with devestating results". Which leads me to believe they can. I'll be emailing GW about this one.

No need. Rule book page 58, 2nd paragraph after "Ordnance Barrage Weapons":

If fired directly at the target, they are treated exactly like normal ordnance weapons (ignore the minimum range in the weapon's profile).

Probably the rule that I have most often shown to an opponent. I even memorised the page number. The first paragraph after that heading is also useful.

If you go basilisk heavy you may want to consider getting an officer of the fleet. I have found that once a person sees those long guns they will go full reserves or outflank/deepstrike crazy.

Trickstick wrote:

Ignatius wrote:If you read in the codex under the profile of the gun on page 53, it states the Basilisk's range is 36"-240". There is no idication of firing directly or indirectly. But in the fluff description of the gun, it says that a basilisk can be used "as a direct fire gun, engaging targets at short range with devestating results". Which leads me to believe they can. I'll be emailing GW about this one.

No need. Rule book page 58, 2nd paragraph after "Ordnance Barrage Weapons":

If fired directly at the target, they are treated exactly like normal ordnance weapons (ignore the minimum range in the weapon's profile).

Probably the rule that I have most often shown to an opponent. I even memorised the page number. The first paragraph after that heading is also useful.

Thank you sir. Clears that up nicely. Glad I can still field my basilisks and have them actually able to be effective.

I swear every time someone talks about IG artillery, someone always has to remind people about the direct/indirect fire rules.

It is not even like a trick such as Musical Chair wound Nobz/Paladins, its a rule!

I'm getting too old for this hobby methinks

I swear every time someone talks about IG artillery, someone always has to remind people about the direct/indirect fire rules.

It is not even like a trick such as Musical Chair wound Nobz/Paladins, its a rule!

I'm getting too old for this hobby methinks

No, you are only getting too old if you remember when Basilisks could only fire direct

I remember when they could double fire...

Manticore is the best artillery hands down D3 Strength 10 large blasts. Enough said. Effective vs both vehicles and hordes. Only AP4 and limited ammo 4 but you can't have everything. Limited ammo 4 isn't actually that bad as game can end on turn 5 and on average you get more shots via d3 mirv shots then you would have with a Medusa or Russ.

The Medusa brings the Strength 10 AP2 large template but only gets one shot and with all the cover around the D3 shots of the Manticore win out. If the Medusa could fire either or the bastion breaker at vehicles or the strength 10 ap 2 at elite infantry then it would be worth considering.

Collosus is bad because it can not direct fire and has a min range of 24 so most armies will just advance inside its min range.