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Ok so i have a vanilla chaos marine army and right now what i have noticed after playing a couple game is that i need more fight power to take out tanks and other heavy armor targets,
this is my army so far.

Chaos sorcerer
PW
mark of nurgle
warptime

9x chaos marines
mark of nurgle
2 meltas

aspiring champ
PW

rhino
DP
havoc launcher


9x chaos marines
mark of nurgle
2 meltas

aspiring champ
PW

rhino
DP
havoc launcher


9x chaos marines
mark of nugle
2 flamers

aspiring champ
PW

rhino
DP
havoc launcher

4x Bike squad
mark of nurgle

Bike champ
PW

predator tank
3x lascanons
DP

any help that you can provide is appreciated

A few things, unless i'm missing something there is no where for your Sorcerer to go (all your squads are 10 man, and rhinos only hold 10). Also Warptime, even before the FAQ ruining of it, isn't the best spell for a Sorcerer. PW? They already come with a force weapon... And MoN, isn't really going to help your Sorcerer too much.

Your CSM squads, MoN, is ok, but I personally don't think its that worth it, ok it makes them harder to kill for your standard S4 (or lower) weaponary and units in assault, but if you want tough, just go Plague Marines.

Your rhinos are incredibly expensive, at most i'd give them a combi-weapon, but probably not even that.

The bike squad is giving you nothing, MoN is expensive. The only reasons to take Bikes, is double melta suicide (in a squad of three) and/or delivering Daemons (with an Icon of Chaos Glory).

And Daemonic Possession on a Predator, especially a treble LC, its making it worse. Autocannon with Lascannon sponsons is the best configuration you'll probably find.

You've actually got a decent base, 3 squads of CSM. If you drop the unnecessary upgrades, you could probably already fit another Predator in. The Bikes, you might as well drop them, they don't do enough for their expensive cost, if you really want Terminators, start with 3 all with combi-meltas, if you have the points add a chainfist.

Your Sorcerer needs to take the force weapon back, MoT and bolt of change is a great S8 AP1 shot.

Plus with MoT you get to keep your Warp-time and help make sure that those Force weapon attacks do some damage!

Feel free to switch up warp-time for Gift of Chaos and unleash some spawns to help you in close combat!

bearjrca wrote:Your Sorcerer needs to take the force weapon back, MoT and bolt of change is a great S8 AP1 shot.

Plus with MoT you get to keep your Warp-time and help make sure that those Force weapon attacks do some damage!

Feel free to switch up warp-time for Gift of Chaos and unleash some spawns to help you in close combat!

Umm...
MoT and Bolt is very expensive, for a fairly average anti-tank shot (unless you can get behind, so would need a jump pack to DS). Warptime doesn't help much anymore, you have to re-roll all dice or no dice, thats only going to help if you miss everything, if you hit half, its not worth the risk.
And Gift of Chaos, if it works then great a Spawn. But its 30 points isn't it? For a power thats not guaranteed to pay off, and when it does, you get a Spawn... Its only worth it if you manage to turn an expensive character into a Spawn, which is very unlikely.

Bolt is ok, but expensive for a single S8 shot. Warptime isn't worth it, before it got ruined I wouldn't have taken it on a Sorcerer. Lash or doombolt are probably the best options for a Sorcerer, unless you want to go with the expensive Bolt option.

rodgers37 wrote:A few things, unless i'm missing something there is no where for your Sorcerer to go (all your squads are 10 man, and rhinos only hold 10). Also Warptime, even before the FAQ ruining of it, isn't the best spell for a Sorcerer. PW? They already come with a force weapon... And MoN, isn't really going to help your Sorcerer too much.

Your CSM squads, MoN, is ok, but I personally don't think its that worth it, ok it makes them harder to kill for your standard S4 (or lower) weaponary and units in assault, but if you want tough, just go Plague Marines.

Your rhinos are incredibly expensive, at most i'd give them a combi-weapon, but probably not even that.

The bike squad is giving you nothing, MoN is expensive. The only reasons to take Bikes, is double melta suicide (in a squad of three) and/or delivering Daemons (with an Icon of Chaos Glory).

And Daemonic Possession on a Predator, especially a treble LC, its making it worse. Autocannon with Lascannon sponsons is the best configuration you'll probably find.

You've actually got a decent base, 3 squads of CSM. If you drop the unnecessary upgrades, you could probably already fit another Predator in. The Bikes, you might as well drop them, they don't do enough for their expensive cost, if you really want Terminators, start with 3 all with combi-meltas, if you have the points add a chainfist.

I should of mentioned this is just a friendly list do don't plan on doing torment or anything. Also its a theme army and MoN is part of said theme


Automatically Appended Next Post:

bearjrca wrote:Your Sorcerer needs to take the force weapon back, MoT and bolt of change is a great S8 AP1 shot.

Plus with MoT you get to keep your Warp-time and help make sure that those Force weapon attacks do some damage!

Feel free to switch up warp-time for Gift of Chaos and unleash some spawns to help you in close combat!

He does have the force weapon i just had a dumb moment

Well Chaos need all the help they can get in friendly play as well, with a newer army like GK, SW or IG, you can take pretty much anything in the dex and have a decent friendly list, with Chaos your always going to struggle.

Even keeping the MoN, still do things like drop the DP and maybe Havoc Launchers from the Rhino, and DP from the Pred. Probably the bikes as well.

Buy a demon prince with wings, MoN, and Nurgles rot. Way better than the sorcerer in close combat, and he is pretty good at ripping up tanks too.

The only reason to run sorcerers is with lash of submission, hidden in rhinos.

Also, your chaos marines aren't as good as actual plague marines. Take 5x plague marines, 2x melta, rhino. Don't even bother with champions. These guys drive around and shoot stuff. You can also switch to plasmaguns for a little extra killing power against terminators.

For assault troops I'd say use berzerkers, but if you want to stick with nurgle then use the 10x CSM with 2x melta, champion, power fist.

For heavy support if you want a possessed vehicle go with a vindicator or defiler. The templates will hit something even with low ballistic skill.

I don't think bikers or raptors are horrible choices, but field them with 2x melta guns at the least, and an icon + champ if you want to play with some greater or lesser demon bombs.

Obliterators are the safest tank killing option though, able to deepstrike, use lascannons for long range or multi-melta for medium range, and twin linked meltaguns for short range. They also do great against troops and monstrous creatures with plasma cannon or rapid fire plasma gun shots. Oh and they have terminator armor and powerfist in case anyone tries to assault them...

Why i thank everyone for there input i know what the playable build for CM is the whole PM in rhinos with DP's LOS and a bunch of obliterators and really i think thats kind of boring.

I do not want an army that EVERYONE uses i want an army i that I want to use. I know that bikes are dumb and that i should give the sorcerer LOS but i like me bikes so they are staying .

I also hate LOS so im not using it.

The whole point of this thread was i wanted to know how i should run terminators in this army and nothing else. I put my list up so you could see how they would best fit in. So i'm not angry or anything i just don't care what the "right way" is to build CM.

That is not the only playable build, I did not tell you to do that, I have never used that build and do win games.
And not everyone uses that army, most (in fact all but one) of the Chaos armies I have seen in the past three years, have been themed (Nurgle, Iron warriors etc). But to win with Chaos, even at friendly level, you need to be careful with what your choosing, just adding Termies to this list won't make it any better, because your wasting points in rhino upgrades, in a sorcerer power thats useless, in Bikes with no purpose and DP on predator. You can keep the MoN on the CSMs, in fact I think I said you had a solid foundation with the three CSM squads. Keep everything, bar the bikes, take out the rhino and Pred upgrades, and then you can add your terminators.

Whats wrong with the upgrades also i know you didn't but most people i talked to say that

Your rhinos, 35 points base, are costing 35 points more. The most you should have on a rhino is extra armour, and I wouldn't even bother with that.
By dropping the upgrades your saving 105 points, thats enough for 3 Termies with 3 combi-meltas.

I won't go into MoN too much, as you want to keep it, but its not the cheapest upgrade, and I don't think just T5 is necessarily worth the cost, but if its part of your theme then stick with it (but you don't actually have to have MoN to run a Nurgle army, its the look of the models that make it Nurgle for me...)

Predator, first off 3 LCs is very expensive, if you go Autocannon with Side lascannons, you get an extra shot. Daemonic possession then makes it BS3, your shooty tank is worse, ok it can still shoot when its shaken or stunned, but its less likely to hit... You'll probably find its best just to keep it cheaper.

Your Bikes, MoN and a PW. assuming its 4 Bikes and a champion, I think its 225 points (MoN 30 points?) for that squad, it won't fall over too quickly, but its not going to kill much either. Its not got any anti-tank ability, its not going to be able to take on half decent assault units, its not delivering lesser daamons (or Greater Daemon).

With your CSM squads, I quite like you have two of them with melta and two with flamer. I would try and get meltabombs on at least the flamer squad champ, if not give all three champs Power fists. I think you'll find the ability to take down tanks, or insta kill the odd thing is more useful then a couple of PW attacks...

If you drop your rhino upgardes, DP on the Pred, and drop it down to AC/LC and the Bike squad your saving over 350 points, with that i'd use 30 to upgrade the champs to PFs. Get a second Predator, and then you've still got 200+ points left to add something like Chosen (shooty or assaulty) maybe Termies (i'm not sure if they would be the best choice though)

Alright thank you i will keep your suggestions in mind for the future of my army