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New and back into the game and deciding whish army feels right for me..
My friends mainly play WE and HE (loads of Gladeguard/dryads and hated swordmasters) and we are not experts, just eager novices

What i am looking for is a hard hitting tough army (maybe with a powerful champion) who are able to crush the pointy-ears armies with maybe some powerful magic to help
Our games are 1500 points (all we can afford for now) and my friends have their armies, i still need to purchase mine (maybe this weekend)

Choice 1
Beastmen - I like the models and the stats look good (especially the big doombull/Gorebull monsters) but point costs and armour could be a problem (gladeguard arrows) but love the razorgor woolfish model and would want a lot of them but worry dryads and swordmasters would chop me to pieces

Choice 2
Lizardmen - Read some good things about these, including amazing salamanders which could roast the pointy-ears and they have amazing magic with the slann. Tough powerful saurus and great oldblood/vet champions as well as good skirmishers to pepper them from a distance

Choice 3
Ogre Kingdoms - Stornhorn looks like it could steamroll the whole WE army on it's own, never mind mournfang cavalry, but i do worry about low model count, and again gg turning my few units into pincusheons. i also worry about ironbellies against swordmasters and dryads

Choice 4
Daemons of chaos - From watching other armies against them, seems to have great infantry and magic, but maybe lacking great hitters? Skulltaker looks awesome and the army-wide magic weapons would be usefull against dryads but i fear HE's infantry would be able to handle them easily

Remember, this is for 1500 point games, so out of the choices above, what would people recommend for WE and HEs ? All advice appreciated

Maybe Lizardmen?

I run WoC and I seem to do fine against HE.

Sword masters? I Treason of Tzeentch them to death. Nothing like seeing swordmasters stabbing themselves in the foot.

Beastmen are moderate hitters. They are very good for their cost, however.

Lizardmen are fairly elite hitters with their multiple attacks and natural armor.

Ogre Kingdoms, now you are getting very hard hitting. 3 attacks a piece + stomp. The best MC in the game. Cannon-wielders. Giant cannons. etc.

Daemons. A fantastic matchup vs. Elves. Bloodletters are probably the hardest hitters vs. Elves you can actually buy (per model cost). With their high WS and KB. They also got magic attacks, which can deny WE wards and their own ward save. They can be very potent at magic, have the best elite shooters, and maybe the 2nd best MC in the game. Their heroes are stupid cost-efficient at the 1500 pt lvl with Heralds and all their named Heroes like Skulltaker and Blue Scribes and Masque are extremely powerful and very fun. If you wanted to be a real jerk you could make a Slaaneshi army with a Herald, this would give you ASF as well and nearly identical stats in every way to his Swordmasters, except you're Core and he's Special, you have AP and a 5+ ward instead of a 5+ armor (reduced to 6+) and he costs 25% more per model, so unless you screw up, you'll win all those fights on a cost ratio. But really, Bloodletters are scarier, because they negate armor, if they don't auto-kill with KB, they only need a 2+ to kill those T3 wusses.

I think Daemons have a hard counter for nearly everything those Elves put on the table. Ogres require more finesse. And when I say finesse, I mean smashing them in the face until they're dead.

Lizardmen have a lot of growth potential too, but I think they don't shine nearly as much without a Slann and you might be a little low on points to get a good one.

I have yet to loose to any elf palyer with Beastmen and I have played them well over 25 times.

Well, i like all three (Lizardmen, Ogres and Beastmen), but i fear Ogres will have too fewer models and ws3 os not great, Beastmen may get slughtered too easily by archers and swirdmasters, where as Lizardmen seem strongest ...

Lizardmen have Fantastic magic, but they are more defensive when it comes to combat. they do have a fair number of attacks, but usually they win combat by using their magic to either buff their units or regrow them forever.

Ogres have mutiple wounds. 3 wounds of lizards and a 3 wounds orge are both about the same number of points. Both are WS 3 as well.

The lizards have a better save, but they are only Int 1. If your opponent runs either Purple sun or Pit of Shades you will not be happy.

The ogres will hit like a ton of bricks on the charge too. You get impact hits (which hit before any other blows. even his speedy elves) then your normal attacks, then your stomps. Also, the ogres are M6 which is very nice as well.


In the end, what you should do is simply field the models that you think look cool and that is that. Pretty much any army is good enough when you are not playing in high level tournaments.

Yeah like johnny my beasts have never lost to elves

So what would be a good start for an elf killing beast atmy at 1500 points?
Something to rush and kill (maybe a ghorgon or a few minitaurs)
but not to keen on chariots

The thing with Sword Masters (and Dryads to a lesser extent) is that they cannot TAKE a hit. I think Beastmen would do well in this with Gor Hordes. Outnumber the Swordmasters 3 to 1 and they can't kill enough Gors to not die from the attack back! Dryads are a bit more durable due to their 5+ ward, but lose it to magical attacks, so a single hero with a magic weapon can help pile on the wounds. That and since Dryads are skirmishers, they can't get rank bonus, so you can beat them easily in static combat rez (ranks, Standard, etc).

I think Beastmen will fit you well. Agressive, plentiful and can be quite nasty. And if you focus on Minotaurs, there is potential to makes a counts as Ogre Kingdoms army. XD Just saying...

pretty sure with a cheap banner as well the elves can grant the unit all flaming/magical attacks which would totally wreck them afaik.

I've been looking at beastmen myself I love there models

Yeah, I'm reading both the Beastmen and Lizardmen army books... Beastmen look great but sadly i have an donkey-cave friend who fields upto 80 gladeguard so the little or no armoured gors would not last long :-( but i do think running a ghorgon or gorebull into them would be fun :-).
While Lizzies have tough troops and sallies able to roast the pointy ears... but are the lizardmen champs able to dish out the hurt?

Toughness 4 stops arrows fairly well. Slap a wildform on the gors and flip anything S3 the finger

I have found some great Gamezone models for my beastlord or doombull ...(which ever one is better to lead my army)

While he is a terrible general a Doombull on Flying Carpet is fantastic amounts of fun!

^^

A flying cow-man with a firey axe beckoning your Doom.

My only advice is if you go Beastmen, take a Beastlord as your Lord, Equip him with a crown of command, and steel-claws. Give him a bunch of mutations and heavy armor.

Not only is he going to be a nice buffer and making your men stubborn, he hurts when he gets into the thick of things.

My beastlord runs around with AOD, Crown and a GW. It is all he needs

See, I suffer from seeing. "Oh? I have a 100 point equipment limit"

EQUIP ALL THE THINGS!

My Great Bray Shaman has a 4+ ward, a healing potion and a very odd attraction to hag trees

Very nice, what lore do you run him?

Woc will murder WE hands down. High armor high toughness guys with pretty good initiative awesome ws and str4 base.
The men go up in flames really quickly.
I have had my bsb and 18 warrior buddies murder up an almost entire WE army so those guys definitely hard hitting and resilient.

Beast mean would be a classic match up since the two dont like each other WE vs Beastmen.
They should be alright lots of options to close the gap fast or to harass them long enough to close the gap.

Shadowbrand wrote:Very nice, what lore do you run him?

Death because Hagtree Fetish + Death = Dead anything

What do you think of the Beastmen special characters?
The brass bull looks good but seems to have a stupid weakness.. 6 to hit +6 to wound and beat armour = death
The others?

How do you run your beastmen in 2000pt games, I've been going through the list and the 25% maximum on special units seems to be a major pain in the rear to me, its hard to stock out on bestigore which I thought used to be troops? and also makes it a struggle to actually fit minotaur as a unit alongside them.

Good question... bestigor seem beastmens hardest hitters (baring overcosted mi) but i thought ot was 50% on specials? not 25%

None of our specials besides Slug Tongue are worth it IMO

In 2k my Beastmen looks roughly like this

Lvl 4 Death
Beastlord
Beastbanner BSB
Herdstone caddy
shadow mage 2
50 Gor
10 gor
29 bestigor
Pumba
Pumba
Pumba

Thugee wrote:but i thought ot was 50% on specials? not 25%

that is correct. Special is capped at 50%, Rare at 25%. (And Jabberslythe is Rare unit)