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It does not directly say that you need line of sight for this power and it does not say in the FAQ either, but can this power be used on a squad in a vehicle... Some say yes, some say no. If someone can tell me one way or another and give me a page in the Eldar Codex, FAQ, or WH40k Rule Book that would be helpful as well. I know powers like mindwar you need line of sight, but this power does not say specifically.

Eiluj The Farseer wrote:It does not directly say that you need line of sight for this power and it does not say in the FAQ either, but can this power be used on a squad in a vehicle... Some say yes, some say no. If someone can tell me one way or another and give me a page in the Eldar Codex, FAQ, or WH40k Rule Book that would be helpful as well. I know powers like mindwar you need line of sight, but this power does not say specifically.

From the main 40k FAQ

Psykers
Q: Can a model use a psychic power that is not a
Psychic Shooting Attack if it is embarked in a transport
vehicle? (p50)
A: Yes. If the power requires line of sight, this is still
worked out from the vehicle’s fire points (this will
count as one model shooting through that fire point if
the power is used in the Shooting phase).
If the psychic power does not require line of sight and
has a range or an area of effect that is normally
measured from the model using it, these are measured
from the vehicle’s hull, as explained in the Embarking
section on page 66.

Eiluj The Farseer wrote:It does not directly say that you need line of sight for this power and it does not say in the FAQ either, but can this power be used on a squad in a vehicle... Some say yes, some say no. If someone can tell me one way or another and give me a page in the Eldar Codex, FAQ, or WH40k Rule Book that would be helpful as well. I know powers like mindwar you need line of sight, but this power does not say specifically.

It doesn't say specifically, and the Eldar Codex says that if it doesn't say, it doesn't require LoS.
First paragraph, page 28.

I don't think targeting a unit inside a vehicle is possible, not because of lack of LoS, but because they're inside the vehicle.
I'm not sure what the RAW on that is.

The only two Eldar powers that need LOS are Eldritch Storm and Mind War.

tdwg83 wrote:

Eiluj The Farseer wrote:It does not directly say that you need line of sight for this power and it does not say in the FAQ either, but can this power be used on a squad in a vehicle... Some say yes, some say no. If someone can tell me one way or another and give me a page in the Eldar Codex, FAQ, or WH40k Rule Book that would be helpful as well. I know powers like mindwar you need line of sight, but this power does not say specifically.

From the main 40k FAQ

He's asking if you can target a squad in a vehicle, not use the power while in a vehicle.

rigeld2 wrote:
I don't think targeting a unit inside a vehicle is possible, not because of lack of LoS, but because they're inside the vehicle.

Agreed:

Games Workshop Rulebook FAQ wrote:Q: Can psychic powers be used on a unit embarked on
a transport? (p50)

A: For simplicity’s sake, the answer has to be a firm ‘No,
unless the psyker himself is in the unit being
transported’

puma713 wrote:The only two Eldar powers that need LOS are Eldritch Storm and Mind War.

I'm inclined to disagree. Farseer powers do not require LoS unless specified. Mind War is the only Farseer power that specifies requiring LoS.

Eldritch Storm is a PSA, which requires LoS.

Happyjew wrote:

puma713 wrote:The only two Eldar powers that need LOS are Eldritch Storm and Mind War.

I'm inclined to disagree. Farseer powers do not require LoS unless specified. Mind War is the only Farseer power that specifies requiring LoS.

It is a psychic shooting attack and psychic shooting attacks need LOS unless otherwise specified, no?

Games Workshop Eldar FAQ wrote:Q. Which Eldar psychic powers are psychic shooting
attacks? (p28)

A. Destructor, Eldritch Storm and Mind War (though
they include a few exceptions to the normal shooting
rules, as specified in their description).

And Farseer powers don't require LoS, except for Mind War which specifies it needs LoS. However, if you do use Eldritch Storm on a unit that is out of sight, it will scatter the full distance.

Happyjew wrote:And Farseer powers don't require LoS, except for Mind War which specifies it needs LoS. However, if you do use Eldritch Storm on a unit that is out of sight, it will scatter the full distance.

Farseer powers don't require LoS unless they specify they do.
Eldritch Storm is specified to be a PSA.
PSAs require LoS.

Sure I checked this the other day. Doom can be used on any non-vehicle unit. Sure that's the wording in to codex.

Eldar codex ,page 28 wrote: Unless otherwise noted, these powers work as described in the Psychic Powers section of the Warhammer 40, 000 rulebook, are used at the start of the Eldar turn and do not require the Eldar psyker to have line of sight to the target

This tells us 3 things
1. Use the rules for psychic powers (unless otherwise noted).
2. Used at the start of the turn (unless otherwise noted).
3. Does not require Los (unless otherwise noted).

Look at the powers, how many powers (PSA or not) are noted to require LoS? (Here's a hint there is only 1).

Happyjew wrote:Look at the powers, how many powers (PSA or not) are noted to require LoS? (Here's a hint there is only 1).

By definition, PSAs require LoS. Since Eldritch Storm specifies that it's a PSA, it requires LoS.

Yes, unless specified they don't.
Eldrtich Storm specifies that it's a PSA. Do you agree?
PSAs require LoS. Do you agree?

In general, Farseer powers don't require LoS. Specifically, Mind War does. Also specifically, Eldritch Storm is a PSA.

Happyjew wrote:

Eldar codex ,page 28 wrote: Unless otherwise noted, these powers work as described in the Psychic Powers section of the Warhammer 40, 000 rulebook, are used at the start of the Eldar turn and do not require the Eldar psyker to have line of sight to the target

This tells us 3 things
1. Use the rules for psychic powers (unless otherwise noted).
2. Used at the start of the turn (unless otherwise noted).
3. Does not require Los (unless otherwise noted).

Look at the powers, how many powers (PSA or not) are noted to require LoS? (Here's a hint there is only 1).

I disagree. Eldritch Storm is being "otherwise noted" as a PSA. And PSAs require LOS.

This is one of those RAW can go either way. Generally PSA's require LoS. Specifically, Farseer powers do not. As it is if an opponent complained, I'd give it to him (mostly because I almost never use Eldritch Storm).

Edited to add: I also note, you ignore the second part of the quote from the FAQ you provided "(though they include a few exceptions to the normal shooting rules, as specified in their description.)" Not requiring LoS would definitely count as an exception specified in the description.

Happyjew wrote:This is one of those RAW can go either way. Generally PSA's require LoS. Specifically, Farseer powers do not. As it is if an opponent complained, I'd give it to him (mostly because I almost never use Eldritch Storm).

Edited to add: I also note, you ignore the second part of the quote from the FAQ you provided "(though they include a few exceptions to the normal shooting rules, as specified in their description.)" Not requiring LoS would definitely count as an exception specified in the description.

I didn't ignore anything. There's nothing in the description of Eldritch Storm that says it ignores LoS - that's in the preface. Since the only exceptions are in the descriptions, according to that FAQ, there's no LoS avoidance.

Can we please keep it on the Doom power, I think we are getting a little off topic. I was specifically asking if the doom power could be used on a squad that is embarked in a vehicle, not the farseer in a vehicle. But looking at the answers on post replies, I am guessing the answer is no. I did not have the 40k FAQ, but I played in a tourney this weekend and thought it could be used on squads in vehicles, but the judge ruled it out, which I was cool with because I could not find anything that said otherwise, but at another tourney I had gotten to cast it on a squad embarked on a vehicle, but sounds like that was not following the rules. When I did this I usually cast it on a squad and then used something to wreck the transport, then shot the crap and assaulted the stuff inside, made easier by doom.
Thank you all for taking time to post on this thread and answer my question. I really appreciate it.

Nothing in the doom power allows you to target a unit you couldn't normally shoot at.

You CANNOT target at an embarked unit without a specific rule or exception allowing it.

So no dooming embarked units, I'm afraid.

Doom - You can not doom a unit that is embark as per the FAQs on psyker powers.

Eldritch storm - Eldritch storm does not require LoS as the Eldar powers state they have an exception. That being said the power can not be used in an Eldar vehicles because while it's doesn't require LoS it DOES require a Fire Point since it is a PSA. On a side note, the power sucks so this shouldn't be of much consequence.

BlueDagger wrote:Eldritch storm - Eldritch storm does not require LoS as the Eldar powers state they have an exception.

Farseer powers do not require Line of Sight unless specified.
Eldritch Storm is a PSA, as specified.
What do PSAs require?

Also note that the FAQ clarifies that it's a PSA with certain exceptions in the description.
I do not see anything about ignoring LoS in the description.

Q: Can psychic powers be used on a unit embarked on
a transport? (p50)
A: For simplicity’s sake, the answer has to be a firm ‘No,
unless the psyker himself is in the unit being
transported’

rigeld2 wrote:

BlueDagger wrote:Eldritch storm - Eldritch storm does not require LoS as the Eldar powers state they have an exception.

Farseer powers do not require Line of Sight unless specified.
Eldritch Storm is a PSA, as specified.
What do PSAs require?

Also note that the FAQ clarifies that it's a PSA with certain exceptions in the description.
I do not see anything about ignoring LoS in the description.

Specific > General

Eldar codex state the powers do not require LoS. General rules for PSA is to treat it like a shooting attack.

HOWEVER, PSA state specifically that you need a fire point to fire from a vehicle and nothing in the Eldar Psy powers give it any exception to this requirement. Therefor you don't need LoS for the power, but you can't fire it from any Eldar vehicle.

BlueDagger wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

BlueDagger wrote:Eldritch storm - Eldritch storm does not require LoS as the Eldar powers state they have an exception.

Farseer powers do not require Line of Sight unless specified.
Eldritch Storm is a PSA, as specified.
What do PSAs require?

Also note that the FAQ clarifies that it's a PSA with certain exceptions in the description.
I do not see anything about ignoring LoS in the description.

Specific > General

Eldar codex state the powers do not require LoS. General rules for PSA is to treat it like a shooting attack.

HOWEVER, PSA state specifically that you need a fire point to fire from a vehicle and nothing in the Eldar Psy powers give it any exception to this requirement. Therefor you don't need LoS for the power, but you can't fire it from any Eldar vehicle.

The Eldar Farseer rules say that in general, they don't require LoS - but that individual powers might. No LoS required.
Eldritch Storm doesn't say anything either way (in the codex text). No LoS required.
The Eldar FAQ clarifies that Eldritch Storm is a PSA, with potential differences in the description. PSAs require LoS. LoS required. This is more specific than the general Farseer rule.
Eldritch Storm has no verbiage that removes the LoS requirement set by being a PSA.

I went from as general as possible, to as specific as possible. This is one case where the BRB is more specific than the codex.

No, Farseer powers state they do not require LoS unless the power specifies requiring LoS. Mind War specifies requiring LoS, Eldritch Strom, does not. As it is, however, I don't know anybody who uses either of these powers, and (IMO) Doom, Fortune, and Guide are much more useful.

Eldritch Storm specifies its a PSA - an PSAs require LoS.

I'm not arguing effectiveness, and probably won't ever because I don't (and likely won't ever) play Eldar.

I'm discussing the rules.

Thank you for the clarification.

As an Eldar player I have, and always will, draw LoS for Eldritch Storm. It was FAQ'ed to be a PSA for a reason.

As I said, I disagree. I've voiced my reasons. If it comes up in game, I'll give it to my opponent, it's not really a big deal. As it stands, I feel this is one for INAT to rule on, as it really can go either way. That said, I think we are done here.

rigeld2 wrote:I don't think targeting a unit inside a vehicle is possible, not because of lack of LoS, but because they're inside the vehicle.
I'm not sure what the RAW on that is.

Well, it most certainly raises a lot of hackles, as its so "obvious" to most that you can't.

I think the truth of the matter is elsewhere, though.
Stuff like this has happened ...

Q: Can an embarked unit ever be the target of enemy
shooting? (p67)
A: No. Only the transport vehicle can be hit.

... in 4th and 5th, to stop it, the rulebook strictly doesn't.

Consider a weapon (or whatever) that does not require los, inflicts say 1d6 wounds on a unit within 12" of the user.
The mechanisms are there to effect passengers, ie the RAW, though they have (afaik) always ruled that you cannot target and the answer, by extension suggests that even non-targetted "bubble" type effects do not work against passengers.

More hilarity can be yours, by examining the unit/model breakdown when talking of transports.
The bloody rules are threadbare and not fit for purpose (apologies, this is a bugbear of mine).