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I always found it strange that a weapon actually needs to hit a bloke in the head for the barricade 2 ft in front on him to become effective. Or the PA or Force Field.



I think that the order should be
To hit
Saves
To wound
Casualties

It would not change a whole lot, In small samples it would, and im sure alot of people could come up whith math formulas, but after 50,000 trials it will not matter what order they go in. the result will end up roughly the same.

Its not the logical order but having the oponent roll last is more streamlined and also I would argue a more satisfying outcome for the oponent.

Yeah, I always found the system strange as well. I guess its a bit easier this way, but its difficult to imagine.

It's 40k, and 40k doesn't make sense.

It does change combat actually..
First of all you have to allocate hits and not wounds OR go by majority saves and both can change the outcome significantly.. If you do allocate hits, there is no toughness majority so another change..

Mathematically it's identical. It seems "smoother" though.

People are happier when they have the last roll to save their own guys.

Macok wrote:It does change combat actually..
First of all you have to allocate hits and not wounds OR go by majority saves and both can change the outcome significantly.. If you do allocate hits, there is no toughness majority so another change..

This is how it would change combat.

You would either have to allocate the hits, then save against those, or do the save then allocate the wounds and roll for wounds. This would get a little messy when you would have a 30 strong unit of boys on the charge rolling. Rolling after the wounds streamlines the game, even if it's not true to real life.

If they had changed the order then the allocation would have happened after saves.

I think it makes sense to be Hit, Save, Wound
Because if it has 'wounded' then it has already gone through the armour, right?

DarknessEternal wrote:People are happier when they have the last roll to save their own guys.

This.

Simple solution: Make 'to wound' into a save against being wounded, with S and T as modifiers. Just a perceptual change.

That way you could also swap the save values around so that higher = better.

Roll to hit
Roll above their save
They roll TvS.

chrisrawr wrote:Simple solution: Make 'to wound' into a save against being wounded, with S and T as modifiers. Just a perceptual change.

That way you could also swap the save values around so that higher = better.

Roll to hit
Roll above their save
They roll TvS.

That would require an entire reboot of the system :/

I think they way it happens is more streamlined and faster tbh, what I do think is that you should get an invulne and armour. Think about it, a shot has to go through a force field and THEN your armour. Makes assault termies with feel no pain invincible tho... (BA) :(

Von Chogg

Von Chogg wrote:

chrisrawr wrote:Simple solution: Make 'to wound' into a save against being wounded, with S and T as modifiers. Just a perceptual change.

That way you could also swap the save values around so that higher = better.

Roll to hit
Roll above their save
They roll TvS.

That would require an entire reboot of the system :/

I think they way it happens is more streamlined and faster tbh, what I do think is that you should get an invulne and armour. Think about it, a shot has to go through a force field and THEN your armour. Makes assault termies with feel no pain invincible tho... (BA) :(

Von Chogg

What? perhaps you misunderstood me.

Roll to hit (the same)
Roll their save (you roll save instead of them)
They roll wounds (Instead of you.)

It's literally the exact same as what OP proposed, except now you still keep the psychological aspect of 'saving' at the end.

Why would you need to make make a save against something that doesn't end up hurting you?

Personally, I like it that way it is.

Trying to move people out of their comfort zones, are we? *shivers*

Well, I actually agree. I've always wondered how that specific order came to be. But I guess it should be read as:

To Hit = does the projectile hit? (y/n?)
To Wound = WHERE did the projectile hit (eg. mortal spot, y/n?)
To Save = Does the armor of the wearer absorb the impact?

Billinator wrote:
To Hit = does the projectile hit? (y/n?)
To Wound = WHERE did the projectile hit (eg. mortal spot, y/n?)
To Save = Does the armor of the wearer absorb the impact?

Yes that makes sense. It explains Rending snipers. The '6' indicates it hit him in the face.