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have looked in the rulebook and cant seem to find an explanation...

if a model hit with a weapon with a strength double or higher than its toughness.... does that model get an armour save? or is the high strength hit too much?

i know the rulebook explains it causes instant death, was just wondering as was looking into the BA character gabriel seth, he has a strength 8 close combat weapon, so hitting a toughness 4 model would negate an armour save?

hope someone can clear this up for me

Close Combat weapons would still provide an armour save, double strength or not.

However, if your double strength weapon is a power weapon, there is no armor save. (I've never heard of anything being Strength 8 and not be a power weapon, though.)

Strength has got nothing to do with whether or not the model will get an armor save. Strength helps inflict the wound against which an armor save may or may not be taken depending.

In general:
For ranged weapons look at the AP to determine if a save will be allowed. In close combat power weapons do not allow an armor save.

ok thanks i did think they would get an armour save, yeah gabriel seth has a huge chainsword that hits at strength 8 and has the rending rule, kinda sucks that enemy models get an armour save though :(

To add, the strength only determines wounding and to see if it would be instant death.

Crazyterran wrote:(I've never heard of anything being Strength 8 and not be a power weapon, though.)

Ork tankhunters with tankhammers. S10 and not a power weapon. Those crazy orks.

i think your mistaking whfb rules where high str lowers or negates armor saves.

in 40k the only thing that ignores armor saves are power weapons and there varints (force weapons, power fists, lightning claws etc). or ranged weapons with an AP that is equal or lower then your save. other abilities or weapons might have rules to the effect of "no armor saves can be taken" etc.

the only time str of the attack comes into play, is the wound roll, penetrating vehicle armor, or determining if the attack causes ID.

But since it would be double the toughness, if a model fails its save against it, no matter how many wounds it still has, it dies. Because its still Instant Death, so a str 8 non-power weapon is still pretty good

Also in regards to your gabriel seth. He only has a chainsword so with rending. So if he rolls a 6 on any of those to wounds then it ignores armor. If not all it is is a str 8 wound with armor allowed.

cmjs123 wrote:ok thanks i did think they would get an armour save, yeah gabriel seth has a huge chainsword that hits at strength 8 and has the rending rule, kinda sucks that enemy models get an armour save though :(

Except that he gets to strike with that rending S8 at intiative, instead of I 1, like pretty much every other high strength CC attack space marines can muster.