Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So im having a real dilemma with my Space Wolves. It seems every time I made a decision its wrong. Let me elaborate.

I love the Space Wolves fluff, so when it came time to buckle down and actually collect an army instead of painting random cool looking minis, they were an obvious choice.

So I go out and buy a box of space wolves, and make them up into a squad of blood claws. I build them up make them dynamicly running, bloodthristy and wanting to prove themselves, sticking very close to the fluff, as this is what a classic space wolf is in my eyes. I then start reading that BLOOD CLAWS R THE SUCK LOL and that I should always field Grey hunters over them. Hmm mistake number 1 i guess. Not a big deal though so i keep slugging on.

Next i buy a pack of wolf guard terminators, turn one of them into a Wolf lord and give him duo wolf claws, he looks badass. The rest of the 4 remaining make up his body guard and have various weapons that come in the box, thunder hammer storm shield, and a mixture of different fists with storm bolters. I then start reading that you should always take a rune priest as your HQ and optimize your termi guard PERFECTLY...

At this point i loose my cool and just decide that, you know what? I dont care that i cant smash face with my army, but atleast i know its fluffy, beautifully painted, and will give me a ton on fun when playing with my friends.

So yeah, thats my story, but i want to know how you guys balance fluff/modelling, with actual gaming?

I have 2 armies that were started on the basis of stuff I wanted to model rather than its effectiveness in game. They are still fun to roll out and muck about with and if you also have some more efficient units in thre as well, you can usually stand to have a couple of hanger-on units in the army. Unless you're planning on going ultra-competitive then you can always do something with less "efficient" army builds. Having fun for instance

It's all about your opinion man. Do you want an armyt that's waac or do you want a fluffy fun army. I've seen MAYBE 1-2 armies that were fluffy and could compete with top lists. Like grey knights, if you read that purifiers are rare and having any of them a super serious business sitcheeation is goin down. But I can take 29 of them and crowe in my list and destroy face....so IMHO it's fluff or tough

Also, if you like the fluff why not keep collecting and use the minis you just painted as a showcase for the legion as a whole? I wanted to do a fluff friendly 300 grey knights with grand masters yada yada...could never field that in a game but it would be cool as to look at =D

For me gaming always wins out. I do what is best in game.

Because when in comes to fluff and the "looks" of a model...

You can have both. One is not mutually exclusive from the other.

This is why you can create your own fluff and chapter.

I try to use good units and make good lists. The "fluff" I can enjoy by reading books.

I am not a good painter, but I do like kitbashing and converting stuff, and I get my fill doing that, while still having good lists.

I tend to go from the opposite perspective. I find a good unit and do my best to make it look awesome. For example, a Malleus Inquisitor with TDA is a nice point-efficient relentless psycannon and you can get a good melta unit out of the Henchmen. So I went and painstakingly assembled all the parts for exactly what I want, wrote up who she is and her backstory in the Ordo, and why her personal retinue has Jokaero. I'm in the middle of finding all the perfect pieces for a Vindicare for a similar kitbash.

I disagree that you can't create a fluffy army with a good list. The trick is figuring out WHY the good list's units are organized that way. For example, the aforementioned Purifier spam, there have been instances where the Prognosticators warned a Brother Captain to take as many Purifiers as he could with him. Such a force could be on its way back from that engagement when it finds another incident worthy of Grey Knight attention and diverts, or it gets lost in the Warp. Purifier/Dreadnought spam is an army of spiritually resiilient veterans. 40k is a diverse enough universe that if you're creative enough, you can explain why your top end list exists. It's just that most people with good lists don't bother to do this, and most people with bad lists use the 'it's fluffy' excuse to shield themselves from criticism. A top-end Guard list could be an elite Veteran spearhead intended to execute high-value raids with relative independence, and thus has all of the support elements like Vendettas and Hydras to ensure the job gets done. The fluff tools are there to justify almost any army.

That said, it's unfortunate and unavoidable that some units are just going to fall by the wayside and not be very efficient. Blood Claws aren't strong because they're not particularly great at their job of 'charge stuff and beat it down,' especially compared to Thunderwolf Cav. So my advice would be to start going from the other direction. You already know what sort of units you adore from the fluff and that you want to make. Read up on what's good and more importantly, WHY it's good, then you can make your own informed decisions when it comes down to what you want, and can even start prodding your fluff in the more efficient direction if you so choose.

I'm all about converting, i always work from a story and end up with a sucky army. I'm trying to teach myself to balance the two right now. I'm building a 'competitive' 500 points of Space Marines later this year which i added a story to afterwards.

What i'm learning is that i should make my story/fluff open enough that i can choose anything from a codex. For instance:
The army fights in an urban environment: I can choose any models and convert them to suit the Terrain they normal work in.
The army uses Jump Packs and Close Combat troops to fight in their urban environment: This is very restrictive to what models i can play and will effect gaming.
It sums up to writing fluff that effects the models not the list. Tricky but it's starting to look like it might be worthwhile, i have a couple of ideas to try out still.

Blood claws vs. grey hunters.
Are the bases the same size?
Do they have the correct gear (can you see a melta gun on one perhaps if you want to field one?).

Field the models known as blood claws - use them as grey hunters.

Tell your opponent - "hey, these guys are grey hunters, I just like this model better - the wargear is correct and the bases are the same size".

As long as wargear can be identified, most players won't care.
If they do, just don't play them.

If you were in my town, I would happily play you.

davethepak wrote:If you were in my town, I would happily play you.

I don't think I would play you, you probably think you are special for owning a whole town. La de dah, mister money banks, with your town and your helicopter and your locomotive, you don't have to rub our faces in it!

Joe Mama wrote:

davethepak wrote:If you were in my town, I would happily play you.

I don't think I would play you, you probably think you are special for owning a whole town. La de dah, mister money banks, with your town and your helicopter and your locomotive, you don't have to rub our faces in it!

Yeah, but I have ordered all the game stores to stay open 24 hours, and we are constructing our first beer volcano in the town square!!!!!