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hey guys, quiz is in the post, just seeing if anyone else has had some bad experiances with vassal.

I for one have played a fair few games with a fella called Rojan, now the first game i played with him, he was rude obnoxious and whined the entire time, not very enjoyable, so i thought "maybe it was something i did"
so i played a few more games with the guy under dif names to see if it was his general attitude, but lo and behold twas the case, chuck in his blatent cheating (and even more whinging about OP tyranids) I decided to ask the dakkanoughts.

so, do you think people like TFG act like this due to the faceless nature of the interweb, or do you think that there really are people who are like this (bad) in the community?

peace my fellow dakkanoughts

lol I had a guy say Tyranids were OP as well. I can't really say whether or not he was rude/obnoxious for sure, so I'll have to take your word for it, but there are obviously some people in the community who fit that description.

see i dont understand, what makes something overpowered?

So you found one annoying guy on vassal? I've heard plenty of people being TFG in real life too, it doesn't stop because they are somewhere else.

Formosa wrote:see i dont understand, what makes something overpowered?

I'd say if they're powerful without compensation to a point that it breaks the game balance. Tyranids are definitely not overpowered...

well I LOVE vassal ! Me and my game mates are continents appart and this allows us to play, so rarely no problem there.

I have met one or two pricks tho... worst being when i went to the bathroom and came back, he had snuck in 4 extras orks per mob and removed the crew shaken results from his war buggies....

But most people i've met on Vassal are nice ( and patient ).

If you ever see me on the main salon pm me and we can have a match

Well an op codex would be something that offers tons of really powerful cc/shooty units at very low point cost, has no weakness ( like guard weak in cc unless blobled to feth of course ), and out matches every single equivalent in other codexes. That's Op.

Something may also be Op when they are handing you your ass on a platter and you don't know what to do about it -but that's only when you are a bad sport and a bad player.

PS : nids ain't op ! There a good codex but not op.

My only problems with vassal is the annoying dice generator. It has a tendency to get lazy and just repeat results. The fact that a 1.5k vassal game takes 3-4 hours is irritating as well.

thanks for the answers guys, I do understand that in real life we do have "those guys" I was just asking if they are as bad

as to Vassal, it is such a good tool, it has allowed me to try out diferent books without having to spend ££££££, this alone makes it worthwhile to me, had it not been for vassal I would not now be starting a tyranid army, GW should 100% endorse this thing lol

Yeah, the game just isn't as good as the table top version, so it's not like it's going to replace them. I can totally understand why they'd not like it though.

Formosa wrote:hey guys, quiz is in the post, just seeing if anyone else has had some bad experiances with vassal.

I for one have played a fair few games with a fella called Rojan, now the first game i played with him, he was rude obnoxious and whined the entire time, not very enjoyable, so i thought "maybe it was something i did"
so i played a few more games with the guy under dif names to see if it was his general attitude, but lo and behold twas the case, chuck in his blatent cheating (and even more whinging about OP tyranids) I decided to ask the dakkanoughts.

so, do you think people like TFG act like this due to the faceless nature of the interweb, or do you think that there really are people who are like this (bad) in the community?

peace my fellow dakkanoughts

As with anything else, playing complete strangers in any setting can end up with you facing an idiot like this. Vassal isn't the problem. This player is the problem. I've met plenty of them in pick up games at local shops. Now I get to know people before I will agree to play them in a game, because I get no enjoyment from playing whiny idiots. It just sucks all the fun out of the game when my opponent is like that. The facelessness of the web has nothing to do with it. Some people are just jerks, plain and simple.

Skriker


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Formosa wrote:as to Vassal, it is such a good tool, it has allowed me to try out diferent books without having to spend ££££££, this alone makes it worthwhile to me, had it not been for vassal I would not now be starting a tyranid army, GW should 100% endorse this thing lol

Why would GW want to endorse something that keeps you from spending lots of money on their products to try out different books? The designers and sculpters are in it for the hobby, but the owners are in it for the money. In fact I saw in a recent search that GW was trying to close down vassal at this point in time.

Skriker

That's so weird, goes to show you how subjective some things can be!
I've played against 3 people on vassal so far, and all of them have been very polite. That's unfortunate that you've run into some less savory folk, however wargaming seems to attract this sort of people for some reason.

Anyway, if you ever see me in the lobby (my username in it is also Vladsimpaler), please don't hesitate to shoot me a message asking to play; I'd be more than happy to oblige.

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

I'll be on once in a while to play as well,

I've only played random people on Vassal a few times, but each time it was a very pleasant experience and I felt as though I had made a new friend. Sorry to hear you had a bad experience.

I like Vassal a lot, however, as someone else has mentioned, it does take an extraordinarily long time to play even a small game.

Hey srry to go slightly off topic, but could someone post a link to a site I can download 40k vassal from? I can't seem to find one that doesn't have a virus

You are more likely to meet idiots online than you are to meet them in real life. Well, maybe you still meet them, but they don't act up as much.

While I don't play using vassal, I have used the equivalent for MTG a lot, and I can pretty much tell that you meet a lot more cheaters, unfriendly people and don't-know-the-rules there than you would at a store. Mostly because the store requires a willingness to have social contact at all to enter, and if you are acting like an idiot, chances are you are either asked to leave or no one will play you anymore. There is no "find random opponent"-button at your FLGS.

Where can I find 40k vassal? And yes their are just some idiots generally.

Vassal: http://sourceforge.net/projects/vassalengine/files/VASSAL-current/VASSAL-3.1.18/VASSAL-3.1.18-windows.exe/download

Latest 40k Mod: http://www.mediafire.com/?5tetpg11qn655bn

Something to keep in mind with quite a few people who play on vassal. They can't afford to play the actual game and have to settle for a fill in. Because of this they don't know the rules nearly as well as they should and they have a poor idea of what is balanced or not.

Now some people you can get along with just fine so don't let one bad apple ruin the bunch.

I don't play online, myself - had one bad experience with someone who picked apart every move I made, telling me how I was moving a fraction of an inch too far, or my models were jumping up onto walls so I had to roll difficult terrain...

Honestly, I'm just miffed at the dice roller of Vassal. Amazing how I can go through an entire game and never once roll two hits with my meltagunners, always one hit and one miss...

IcedAnimals wrote:Something to keep in mind with quite a few people who play on vassal. They can't afford to play the actual game and have to settle for a fill in. Because of this they don't know the rules nearly as well as they should and they have a poor idea of what is balanced or not.

Now some people you can get along with just fine so don't let one bad apple ruin the bunch.

Okay, what, I can tell you right now that I know the rules as well as anyone else here.

Reading the books easily shows one both the rules as well as studying it should issues arise, and figuring out balance is easy when one takes into account internal/external codex balancing and thinks.

Course I did have an actual 40k player to help teach me a bit, since he plays vassal when he's unable to in real life.

It's also worth pointing out that vassal takes a 3 dimensional game with real los and tries to make it work in 2 dimensions which is just plain bad. Vassal seems more useful to compliment battle reps than to actually play battles. Everytime I see pics from vassal, vehicles are always in positions they couldn't hold on a real tabletop, like rhinos half way through a ruin and crap like that.

I had a guy argue with me for 20 minutes that I couldn't:

1) Fire with my Baals on my first turn because I popped smoke in my scout move
2) Fire any weapons with any of my tanks because I moved 12" and it didn't matter if they were fast or not.

He eventually got so pissed at me he left the game.

ZebioLizard2 wrote:

IcedAnimals wrote:Something to keep in mind with quite a few people who play on vassal. They can't afford to play the actual game and have to settle for a fill in. Because of this they don't know the rules nearly as well as they should and they have a poor idea of what is balanced or not.

Now some people you can get along with just fine so don't let one bad apple ruin the bunch.

Okay, what, I can tell you right now that I know the rules as well as anyone else here.

Reading the books easily shows one both the rules as well as studying it should issues arise, and figuring out balance is easy when one takes into account internal/external codex balancing and thinks.

Course I did have an actual 40k player to help teach me a bit, since he plays vassal when he's unable to in real life.

Good for you? But I find that when I play Vassal (And i play it quite often) that I spend more time in a rules debate than playing the game. Honestly it happens so often I just let most things slide so I can get my games done in a timely manner. Like I said, there are people on Vassal you can get along with just fine and that know the rules. And I completely understand some people just "make mistakes". But Vassal is pretty much a 40k training room. So anyone wanting to play it should expect their opponents to make mistakes with the rules. That or blatantly cheat. It is amazing how many people since they can't show you their codex will try to claim models do something they don't or have different stats than they do.

So far I have had deathcult with grenades, tervigons who ignore turn one doubles, Daemon princes with bloodthirster statlines, twin linked bonus on none twin linked weapons, and my favorite of daemonettes that get to charge on the turn they appear because of a special rule slaanesh grants called "aura of acquiescence." That one wins my favorite cheater award because I play a themed slaanesh daemons list and I loved how he took our grenade rule to make it sound legit.

IcedAnimals wrote:

ZebioLizard2 wrote:

IcedAnimals wrote:Something to keep in mind with quite a few people who play on vassal. They can't afford to play the actual game and have to settle for a fill in. Because of this they don't know the rules nearly as well as they should and they have a poor idea of what is balanced or not.

Now some people you can get along with just fine so don't let one bad apple ruin the bunch.

Okay, what, I can tell you right now that I know the rules as well as anyone else here.

Reading the books easily shows one both the rules as well as studying it should issues arise, and figuring out balance is easy when one takes into account internal/external codex balancing and thinks.

Course I did have an actual 40k player to help teach me a bit, since he plays vassal when he's unable to in real life.

Good for you? But I find that when I play Vassal (And i play it quite often) that I spend more time in a rules debate than playing the game. Honestly it happens so often I just let most things slide so I can get my games done in a timely manner. Like I said, there are people on Vassal you can get along with just fine and that know the rules. And I completely understand some people just "make mistakes". But Vassal is pretty much a 40k training room. So anyone wanting to play it should expect their opponents to make mistakes with the rules. That or blatantly cheat. It is amazing how many people since they can't show you their codex will try to claim models do something they don't or have different stats than they do.

So far I have had deathcult with grenades, tervigons who ignore turn one doubles, Daemon princes with bloodthirster statlines, twin linked bonus on none twin linked weapons, and my favorite of daemonettes that get to charge on the turn they appear because of a special rule slaanesh grants called "aura of acquiescence." That one wins my favorite cheater award because I play a themed slaanesh daemons list and I loved how he took our grenade rule to make it sound legit.

Yes, I'm sure you've had plenty of cheaters, but of course as seen from many topics there would be plenty of people that would do that to your face and try it as well, especially for those on the tournament scene as they can even get away with it on a 4+ in some cases, not to mention all the various posts about cheaters and people trying to take advantage of others and just generally being TFG, and in the case of vassal all you have to do for a cheater is very simply close out the program. Though I kind of wish there was a way to blacklist cheaters on here somewhere so people can know who's done what for what reason.

As for not knowing the rules, have you even see half of Dakka? People misquote rules so often that some people take them as the true gospel. Have you not seen the necron topics that often get misquoted, changed, and all about just ruined from the original codex incarnation? I'm sure resident Sasori can give you the lowdown on how many people he's had to properly educate about Necrons. Not including near the entirety of the YMDC forum area where so many issues pop up from people not knowing the rules properly? That entire area cannot be filled with just vassal players, because I'd certainly have far more people to play against if that were the case.

omg... a whiner and an idiot on the INTERNET? somebody alert the internet police....

oh wait...sopa already shut the internet police down. seems they were copying "real" police tatics and appearnce without paying the nypd for the rights... too bad. looks like youll just have to deal with it.

:(

Just a note:

Most of the "regular" Vassal community is relatively certain Rojan is just a very dedicated troll. The alternative is that he's just the angriest human being in the world, while simultaneously being completely ignorant of game balance in 40k. Nobody's ever seen him play a game where he didn't claim the enemy army was overpowered cheese and complain/insult them the entire time.

Absolutely don't judge Vassal as a whole by that dude, you just had some relatively awful luck with meeting him first. As nobody ever makes the mistake of playing him twice, we're pretty sure he'll get bored and leave eventually.