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I'm fairly new to fantasy and through a quick search on the forums regarding my question, (which characteristic do you take for making tests when hit by a template and how many times?) i came across this topic:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/416304.page#3669417

However after re-reading the rules and looking around and not wanting to necro that old thread I just wanted to get this clarified (counter my argument regarding this matter).

HoverBoy wrote:

HoverBoy wrote:1. The "Templaes" rule explains what happens when a character on a monster is hit by a template.
2. This replaces the 2nd step of the "Shooting at Ridden Monsters rules" whenever a template is involved thus eliminating the randomising rules.
3. It is then followed by step 3 the wounding rules.
4. Purple Sun/Pit of Shades are spells that use templates and thus hit both the rider and his mount.
5. These spells however do not wound but cause a characteristic test, one per model.
6. These hits would mean two tests, but this would brake rule example 5, because a character and his monster are one model.
Conclusion – We have no choice but to make one test using the rules as given on page 10.

I was convinced this was the answer however... the rulebook specifies under Ridden Monsters-Template:

"...both the riders and the mount are automatically hit if the monster's base is touched by the template..." this is covered in point 2, ok, check. going on in the paragraph

"...In the case of a stone thrower, which inflicts hits at two different strengths, only one model will be hit at the higher Strength..."

Kinda weird that they call that only one model gets hit with the higher strength, that would mean by the logic above that both the rider and the mount would be hit at the higher strength since they are the same model, which i think is wrong therefore i would assume that the riders and the mount are considered separate models for this whole paragraph, anyway moving on...

"...Randomise, as for a shooting attack, to see whether one of the riders or the mount is unlucky enough to take the high Strength hit."

Well that pretty much confirms my theory and states clearly that for the rule purposes rider and mount are separate models.

And just as an extra last sentence says: "All other models are hit at the lower strength value."

That just removes any doubt that the first time they called the riders and the mount different models was a mistake.

So... can I claim that damn stegadon takes his I test at I2 on the tournament i just signed for?

If the model is touched by the template, he takes the test. And so will the riders.

A monstrous mount for a character is two models counted as one model. Do you randomise hits with shooting/magic? Can you attack the rider separately in combat? If the answer is yes, then whilst it is still ONE model, there are TWO models making up that one, as there are two completely different, independent statlines.

For example, an Ogre thundertusk (rare) that is hit by any template will only take ONE test/to wound roll, as you cannot "hurt" the riders separately. If it was a monstrous mount for a hunter, you take two such tests/rolls to wound, as the template hits both automatically.

If a monster is hit directly with a Stonethrower, both the Rider and Monster will each take a hit at the increased strength. Ridden Monsters are 1 model with 2 profiles, not 1 model that is actually 2 models.

If the monster is hit by a template that forces Characteristic tests both the monster and rider will take the test, using the best chracteristic avaliable. So a High Elf on a Dragon hit by a Toughness Test will make 2 test. One for the Elf and one for the Dragon, both will use the Dragon's toughness. Same for inititive, leadership, and so on.

You know what i'm not arguing this again just take it up with your TO.

Grey Templar wrote:If a monster is hit directly with a Stonethrower, both the Rider and Monster will each take a hit at the increased strength. Ridden Monsters are 1 model with 2 profiles, not 1 model that is actually 2 models.

If the monster is hit by a template that forces Characteristic tests both the monster and rider will take the test, using the best chracteristic avaliable. So a High Elf on a Dragon hit by a Toughness Test will make 2 test. One for the Elf and one for the Dragon, both will use the Dragon's toughness. Same for inititive, leadership, and so on.

The first part, at least, is not correct. See pg 105: Shooting At Ridden Monsters under Templates. Only one of the two will take the higher ST hit and the other will take the reduced ST (usually 3 and 9 for Stonethrowers).

Template spells are included under the section of Ridden Monsters and Templates stating both would take a hit so both would roll a characteristic test.

However, a spell that causes a characteristic test but is not a template like Dweller's Below would only cause a single test since the spell specifically calls for "a" strength test per model and the Ridden Monsters section says the monster/rider are considered a single model, there are no provisions that would allow Dweller's to force a model to roll more than one characteristic test. A bigger issue here is whether a single failed characteristic test on either part of the monster would mean the removal of both rider and monster since most of these spells specifically say that a failure means removal of the model and the rules say that monsters/riders are considered a single model.

It would definitly remove both rider and monster if the test was failed.

I think this is why they let you use the best characteristic avaliable. So a HE Prince on Dragon can use the Dragons T and Str while using his I and Ld, and vice verse.