Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

We ( Guard Players ) im sure are all aware of the Imperiums unrelenting airsupport that helps them gain foot holds in battles before the Massed Armies of t he Guard can be properly Deployed . Wings of Maruader high Alltitude Bombers support by Thunderbolt Fighters , but would bring forth the question , Why not deploy Airborne Commandos via Marauder . More accurately put while the enemy is ducking their heads from the rain of bombs , Have Commandos ( be it Stormtroopers , Kasrkin , Elysians ect. ) Disembark Though the bomb bay wearing Grav Suits and High Allitude Resprirators ( common on drop troopers ) so in Theory When the Marauder is opening it's bombbay you have your unit of Commandos Standing along the gangway that leads to the Rear of the Bomber , When the Last Bomb Falls Clear ( about 30m Away from the Bomber's Bay ) The Commando's follow suit and do a HALO style infitlration ( High Alltitude Low Opening ) Some would argue why not just integrate Valkyries into the Bomber formation and 1) that Would Be very Clear to the Enemy That A Airborne Action would take place 2) Valkyries don't have the Range nor ceiling Allitude to keep up with the Bombers and Their Escorts . But in Theory while the Bomber wing is dropping Its Ordanance the enemy will think nothing of Anti-Aircraft Fire but More So trying to keep their heads down . In Turn in one wing of bombers you could effectively land a Battalion of Commandos behind enemy lines to Disrupt supplie lines , kill Acting enemy CO's and Generally raise all sorts of hell . Now i know that this will cause all sorts of hell to break lose but Does it Seem Viable ? You have a High Alltitude bomber/ Troop Deploment Device also you are symontainously deploying Ordaniance en mass as well as Commandos which will further interupt the enemies supplie lines . ( yes i am aware this wouldn't work on unconventinal enemies - Tyranids -)

Isn't this how Storm Troopers operate by default?

But though viable, it's not a widespread tactic due to how the Imperium works when it comes to joint forces theatres and Guard-Navy-interfacing. The only one formation capable of always deploying this way would be the Imperial Guard Storm Trooper Regiment, as they have their own flyers.* Kadian Kasrkin or the Grenadiers of other regiments are way more numerous, but they in turn don't have the necessary dropships and thus rely on the Navy to transport them. Which sometimes works out, but as you can imagine relies on either the Navy voluntarily setting aside a few landers, or a Warmaster ordering them to do so. In short: it's probably not done as often as it'd be possible.

Though this is just a personal interpretation, and one that relies solely on GW material - other sources may depict another image, so as always it depends on what book you're looking at.

(*: the Elysians are another regiment, but I admit I have no idea if they have Grenadier units, or if their normal troops engage in commando-style missions, or if they simply use their dropships for airborne deployment within the frontlines instead of behind)

You also make the assumption that you have air superiority.

If enemy aircraft are in the air they are much more likely to go after the bombers that contain infantry since they, long term, are a much more lethal threat.

Why potentially sacrifice hundreds/thousands of infantry by grav insertion when you can ground pound alongside the relative safety of your tanks/chims and let your own air superiority craft focus on saving the dedicated bombers rather than having to choose?

In one of the Ghost books (Guns of Tanith maybe? The one set on Phantine...) this tactic was used to great effect in Operation Larisel, but it wasn't done en-masse, it was for 4 teams who were to drop in for a stealth insertion before the main assault a few days later. The bombing raid itself was performed by hundreds of marauders, within the same wave were four marauders that had no bombs, but contained the Ghost teams. Whilst the bombing raid was underway the Ghosts deployed via grav-chute onto the city.

So in short, yes, it can and has been done. But as Lynata and Ratius said, you may not always have air superiority, and even when you do, there's no guarantee that the Navy will be co-operative. It's also less likely to be used for regular guardsmen or in large numbers. Storm-Troopers or small numbers of Veteran Drop Troops are the most likely to use this tactic.

I appreciate the comments , And in General Since when doess the Imperial Guard Care about lost Material ? but yes i see your point , the Only Enemy That could rival the Airpower in a campagin are Orks if they are there long term and the Nids ( already said tactic wouldn't work against . Just a suggestiong because it seems plausable

Not true Im afraid, in IA3 and 11 both the Tau and Eldar caused significant and quite devastating losses to the IG and Navy due to their air prowess.

Eldar fighters/interceptors simply cannot be matched by the Navy (except through sheer numbers) and they often have to rely on ground to air defenses to destroy them.

The logistics behind dropping while bombing are foolish and impossible.

You NEVER see armies in todays world put bombing missions close to their own troops(besides laser guided bombs), because its a logistical nightmare. If you drop troops at the same time your bombing, your own troops willl take casualties.

Smitty0305 wrote:The logistics behind dropping while bombing are foolish and impossible.

You NEVER see armies in todays world put bombing missions close to their own troops(besides laser guided bombs), because its a logistical nightmare. If you drop troops at the same time your bombing, your own troops willl take casualties.

This. Far too many things that can, and will, go wrong, not enough benefits.

Smitty0305 wrote:The logistics behind dropping while bombing are foolish and impossible.

Welcome to the Imperial Guard.

If you take 20 friendly casualties for every 30 troops you drop due to friendly bombs exploding to close to them, that's a huge waste of resources and men.

If you were to do it in two waves, first waves paves the way with bombs, then the second wave comes in a drops grav-troops in, it could work.

Sign me up to chase dropping bombs!

McNinja wrote:If you take 20 friendly casualties for every 30 troops you drop due to friendly bombs exploding to close to them, that's a huge waste of resources and men.

If you were to do it in two waves, first waves paves the way with bombs, then the second wave comes in a drops grav-troops in, it could work.

Well, I would assume that the grav-chutes would make the troops' descend a little slower than the bombs. Would suck if they'd fall down with the same speed.
Also, they could sit in one of the last planes, or one on the outer edge of the formation, so as to minimize the risk of being hit by a bomb gliding past them.

Still some danger would probably persist in the form of blind shells or an unstable environment. But hey, at least the enemy will be distracted!

Doing this in multiple waves was done a few times in WW2 however, iirc. Including Market Garden and Overlord.

TermiesInARaider wrote:

Smitty0305 wrote:The logistics behind dropping while bombing are foolish and impossible.

You NEVER see armies in todays world put bombing missions close to their own troops(besides laser guided bombs), because its a logistical nightmare. If you drop troops at the same time your bombing, your own troops willl take casualties.

This. Far too many things that can, and will, go wrong, not enough benefits.

I f you read what i said ( sorry didn't communicate it well ) the Drop troops deploy AFTER the Bombs are dropped

Battlefield tactic 101 during an air raid. FLAK, AA, and more FLAK. Yeah, not an ideal place for troops dropping.

In those circumstances the Maraduers are high alltitude bombers , flak would be inefffective , and keep in mind the flak would follow the bomber not the deployed troops

What about that mechanic the eldar use on one of their special units?

I can't remember which (the Autarch or something isn't it?), first the Deep strike location is selected then blasts are thrown around it and once the blasts are done the character lands.
I don't know the entire process its been a while since i faced it. feel free to correct.


You mean Stormtroopers deploying akin to the above with Bomber support?



The 91st are crazy enough to try it! i've already deep striked a Leman Russ
(to great effect, the Russ landed and killed nearly all the firedragons in a squad minus 2 and fugain or whatever his name is, before tearing open a wave serpent and a guardian squad)

Now to shove paratroopers out the back of a Bomber as the bombs blast below them. Im up for it!!

Engine of War wrote:What about that mechanic the eldar use on one of their special units?

I can't remember which (the Autarch or something isn't it?), first the Deep strike location is selected then blasts are thrown around it and once the blasts are done the character lands.
I don't know the entire process its been a while since i faced it. feel free to correct.


You mean Stormtroopers deploying akin to the above with Bomber support?



The 91st are crazy enough to try it! i've already deep striked a Leman Russ
(to great effect, the Russ landed and killed nearly all the firedragons in a squad minus 2 and fugain or whatever his name is, before tearing open a wave serpent and a guardian squad)

Now to shove paratroopers out the back of a Bomber as the bombs blast below them. Im up for it!!

Ahh i see some one is thinking in a gerneral manner ...now imagine .......a Battalion of infantry and Hundreds of Bombers

Veldrain wrote:Battlefield tactic 101 during an air raid. FLAK, AA, and more FLAK. Yeah, not an ideal place for troops dropping.

WW2??

This was extremely common during the second world war and I'm pretty sure the IG cares less about its troops getting flaked than commanders during that engagement

And Very Few Militarys employ Flak based Weaponary , not to mention that the Range is impractical . Imperial guard and Orks are the only ones to employ Flak and those can't reach the Alltitude of the Bombers